Dancer Archive
Thread: Annoyed with Mind-Only Buffing
I admit, it is great being able to buff mind. Yippee and all that. What I do not get is why I am not allowed to buff focus and willpower. Seems buffing the two substats, as musicians do, is more powerful than similar buffs to the mind. After all, twice the focus essentially means twice the mind--add in twice the willpower. . . .
But, more importantly, it just seems silly to me. Is dancer only half a profession? (And musician too, of course.) Do the devs seriously think I would suddenly just stop dancing with the musicians if I could buff all three stats?
Especially considering they are requiring I spend five minutes flourishing like mad to get the buffs up to snuff, too.
My vote: Forget self-buffs, and give me the triple-buff, instead. (Not that I would complain. . . .)
While I am on my rant, I would like to ask if anyone else is having this problem: I spend forever buffing my friends. We go on a hunt, and one or more die, losing the buff. Later, I try to apply another buff to the now-revived fallen, but it does not work. The people who survived still have their buffs, so it is within the same timer.
I am a Master Doctor, as well, and we docs had the nuisance of the timer not being reset upon premature buff (and player) expiration--meaning, if you died five minutes into a two-hour buff, you had 1:55 to burn before being able to get a new buff. (And, let me tell you, thatwas a royal stinker.) I was wondering, since it seemed so similar,if other entertainers were facing this, or if this is just a big botch-up on my part. (Always a distinct possibility with me.)
Thanks all.
No, it would be the same for combat. As I said, twice the focus can be essentially twice the mind, since damage to the mind pool is reduced. (I do not know the formulas used--the"twice" valuewould be true if the power of the substat was linear.) In fact, with enough focus, weaker drains on the mind would be reduced to zero, meaning any such attacks could be absorbed indefinitely. This is amptly demonstrated with dancing and buffing the quickness substat. 1500 quickness or so is sufficient to make even exotic2 and all its flourishes action-free.
Another benefit with doubling the substats is the quick recovery given by, in the case of mind, willpower. Sure, as a dancer I can potentially double my friends' mind stats; however, they still have to, very slowly, sit down and recover their mind. Doubling the willpower would be a tremendous asset. And never mind the combat value of this, especially for classes whose attacks drain mind. With higher focus and willpower, these attacks could continue, theoretically, forever--regardless of whether the mind pool is 400 or 2200. (Of course, the buffs' time limits would expire first, I am sure, but the point is made.)
However, I really have not intended to get into a contest with musicians over whose buffs are more powerful. My biggest gripe here is the feeling I get from this issue thedancers and musicians are only half-breeds in the eyes of the devs,as though they should be required to constantly work together on everything they do. (So much for the descriptions for Master.) In my opinion, the two professions should be able to do the same things, only in their own unique manner--either through dance or song. As it is, it just feels wrong to me, is all.
Besides, from my experience, most dancers love to have musicians playing (dancing to silence is about as much fun as watching paint dry. . . . Okay, a little more than that. Maybe.), and the musicians seem to enjoy us dancers, as well. As such, it simply seems natural the two professions will work together on their own, without any promptings from the devs.
Anwyay, anyone have any bad luck with the buffing timer issue I keep running up against? Or is it just me? 
In my experience there's a bit of a bug with the buffing. If someone gets buffed, then dies apparently they can't be buffed again until they die.... or something. But we've found that if they get killed again then it's all good. So if we notice that a buff didn't work, typically the combatant/doctor whatever (buffee?) will duel someone and have the other perosn kill them, then life is good and they get buffed.
Tekoa- Ahazi Master Dancer, novice tailor
NoHandleWanted wrote:
No, it would be the same for combat. As I said, twice the focus can be essentially twice the mind, since damage to the mind pool is reduced. (I do not know the formulas used--the"twice" valuewould be true if the power of the substat was linear.) In fact, with enough focus, weaker drains on the mind would be reduced to zero, meaning any such attacks could be absorbed indefinitely. This is amptly demonstrated with dancing and buffing the quickness substat. 1500 quickness or so is sufficient to make even exotic2 and all its flourishes action-free.
Really? The sub stats actually reduce damage taken in combat? I haven't tested this scientifically, but it never looked like I took less damage when my Constitution is buffed.
Well, I thought they did in combat, due to two factors: I seem to take less mind damage (1100 substat versus 400 to the others) and it always appeared I took less when I buffed my strength and quickness. Just ran a test against some butterflies: First with no buffs, thenwith my constitution (health recovery) and quickness (action damage) stats buffed to 1720 and 1790, respectively (close enough). I took the same damage on all three stat hits, about 25-50,during both experiments. My bad.
What I did note, however, was how the critter had no chance on my health, since it recovered way faster than it could damage me. That was very amusing to see--my action tanking (400 whole points), and my health almost constantly full.
Sorry about the error, and thank you for catching it. No more strength buffing for me, now, since I do not use any health-reducing skill.
Of course, now this strikes me as though musicians' buffs are not all that hot. Sigh. See why this annoys me?
OH MY GOODNESS!!!!
I don't believe my eyes/ears. The developers just gaveusthe gift of the century (targeted and group mind buffs) and someone actually has the gall to ask for more. ROFL
Ever hear the story of the fisherman's wife???
Almost overnight I went from earning less than 1k an hour in a busy cantena to averaging 1k per patron thanks to the targeted mind buff. And I freely give away the buff for donations only.
I for one want to go on record for simply thanking the developers for this awesome new ability. It COMPLETELY changed the profession for the better.
Real sorry, but I have to disagree with you. The secondary stats buff belongs to the musician and gives them a similarpurpose to life as the mind buff gives to us. It's a well designed blance.
Developers: /thank;/love;/thank;/love;thank;/love;/hug;/thank;/pause 5;/kiss
Lorane
4,4,3,4 Dancer
Kauri
Sorry, but to my eyes this is not a "gift" but a logical extension of the professions.
If you want musicians buffs, be a musician. It's not communism where everyone gets the same and all suck 
You don't hear entertainers complain not getting Doc's buff, too, do you ?
Ah, but doctor's buff are clearly in the realm of the medical professions, are they not? No entertainer even considers red and green stats to be our concern. Blue stats, on the other hand, are clearly in the domain of the entertainer professions, so doctors perfectly understand why blue buffs would be given to the entertainers. And, since buffing existed from day one for the doctors, it should have existed from day one for the dancers and musicians.
By your same style of comparison, by the way, is there a profession out there which would complain if dancers and musicians could buff all three stats? I doubt it.
Okay, I will try a different approach, one which will be to get me to understand why buffing would be best as is. Why is it best to keep the buffs split between musicians and dancers?
Clearly, this is the point I cannot see. I feel as it stands I am treated as half a profession, always needing my musician to round out my abilities.I have considered howthe musician essentially doubles my healing rate, but two doctors together do the same thing--this is not a comparison. While it is true the musician's healing gives me entertainer healing, whereas the two doctors only get their individual healing XP, this is only a minor issue, since all XP becomes moot after a certain point, anyway, and this is already calculated in the XP tables.
The ability to buff blue stats should have been in the game from the beginning. It is clearly the logical thing to do--all the other stats can not only be buffed, but healed--in combat, no less!--making the mind pool the great weakness. What is the point of 3k health and action buffs when one hit to your 600 mind drops you? There should have been no question the blue stats should get buffed, and it clearly rests in the domain of the dancers and musicians.
So, the devs finally give us this watered-down buffing version, and they expect us to rejoice for something we should have had from the beginning. Well, sorry, but I am not going to pat you on the back for doing your job late, and only half-way, at that. I am quite understanding when it comes to glitches and bugs (I was quite patient with the buffing timer not being reset, and I am a Master Doctor). I have no patience with holding out something which clearly should exist until people are so desperate for it they will bow down and kiss your feet when you finally deign to give it to them.
I have already stated the triple-buff ability has virtually zero chance of splitting musicians and dancers apart, so I cannot see just what benefit splitting them up has.
Yeah, I know, it seems I am cynical. Well, I am bothered at the devs treatment of the profession on this issue and the attitude of "Rejoice, afundamentalability has finally been given to you". I am, however, open-minded as to just why the buffs should be split between the two professions. Any reasons out there? Thank you.
NoHandleWanted wrote:
The ability to buff blue stats should have been in the game from the beginning. It is clearly the logical thing to do--all the other stats can not only be buffed, but healed--in combat, no less!--making the mind pool the great weakness. What is the point of 3k health and action buffs when one hit to your 600 mind drops you? There should have been no question the blue stats should get buffed, and it clearly rests in the domain of the dancers and musicians.
Actually, we could always buff from the very beginning of the game. We just didn't realize it until about 2 months after release (as fun as it may be to discover some of these rules during gameplay, it'd have been nice to know what Dancing Mind Enhancement really was for from the beginning). The buff isn't new. The duration, potency, and method of delivery are all new (and improved).
As for the question, "Why should this be separated into Musician and Dancer?" I could see one reason: It helps differentiates between the two professions. With a few exceptions, there is little reason to choose one over the other, mechanics speaking. Having one do the Mind and the other do the substats keeps the two professions from looking like the same thing. Do I agree with it? *shrug* I can see it, but I wouldn't mind buffing all three. People would choose Dancer over Musician and vice versa based on their own personal tastes anyway. But I don't mind seeing a little extra benefit for someone who masters both Dancer and Musician. This person is a lot more desirable than either a Master Dancer or a Master Musician.
I wouldn't belittle either the Dancer ability or the Musician ability. Both have their advantages, depending on what you need.
Dancer (Mind only): Increased Mind pool means able to withstand more damage to that bar. The Rifleman cannot drop you as easily.
Musician (Focus and Willpower): Reduced cost and high regeneration helps out those who rely on the Mind for special abilities. A Rifleman will rarely kill himself spamming Headshot3. A Doctor is merely limited by his Injury Treatment Speed and not his Mind pool (I've witnessed this myself as a Medic patron; impressive).
So I wouldn't say that we get the shaft or that Musicians get the shaft. Well, neither one of us can buff all three, so that might be considered the shaft. But compared to each other as it stands now, I don't think either profession particularly outshines the other in that department.