Dancer Archive
Thread: My answer to Holo on Entertainers earning money
"Do we want the game to artificially impose tariffs on other classes just to support us?"
There are artificial tariffs all throughout the game. There is no such thing as a free market - markets are always controlled. Besides, I thought that socialismwas what the game was all about - we all rely on each other to get ahead in the game. The problem is that unlike other professions, entertainers have to rely on something (tips)that is totally unreliable. All other professions have a social safety net. Entertainers do not.
"How true. The entertainers unique ability to cure Battle Fatigue and heal Mind Wounds is surely more deserving than a hand-out!"
No no no no. You're confused. Battle fatigue EXISTS SOLELY to give entertainers a reason to matter. You shoot yourself in the foot here. OF COURSE you don't care if I kill stuff. And you shouldn't have to. Because the point of killing stuff is that it amuses ME. You don't have to care or participate. I can do my thing, make my cash, & have fun with the profession I chose.
You totally oppose all that. You ALREADY have a class...THE ONLY class, that I am artificially FORCED to bother with. I don't visit doctors. I need one weapon a month or so, & could have easily crafted it anyway. But I HAVE to go into lag-hell towns that I would otherwise avoid like death, to humor you. Because they MADE me have to be involved in what YOU wanna do. Dancing for FUN & playing an entertainer because...AMAZINGLY...you LIKE it, just like I like killing stuff, isn't good enough? Wake up. This is screwed.
I demand that all entertainers now require food & meat to live, which ONLY can be gained by theRanger profession.The game will now penalize YOU if you don't come out in the middle of where ever, find ME, & hope I'm there to fix you up. And you better TIP me too.
Face it...unlike me, you were considered a frivolous, add-on class that just as easily, uniquely, could have been left out. ONE stimpack replaces you. Although in reality, they knew it would be better to make others not ignore you totally. Which we sure would be. They had to shoehorn in a game mechanic reason for people to visit cantinas, otherwise only hardcore RPers would ever bother.
Theaters are dead, empty wastes of RAM. Cantinas would have been too. But they came up with a fun profession & came up with a clever incentive to have players be actually useful. But now your sense of worth is totally inflated out of all semblance of reality. You deserve to be able to force me to support you AND myself, the second it's the other way around. No sooner. Play your class because YOU LIKE playing it in & of itself. Not because I'm paying you to.
You're NOT HEALERS. YOU'RE NOT providing a necessary service. You're a stimpack that can talk & is only in the game so you can feel useful. I'm all for entertainer revenge commands & welfare commands...AFTER I can buy BF healing stimpacks. You don't care about what I do...WHY should I have to care about what you do? ONLY correct answer: I shouldn't.
Um, Ninja, why are you even here? Did you take a wrong turn at the Commando board?
Hmm. This is the Dancer board. We're here talking about Dancer issues. Did you expect Creature Handling discussion, maybe?
Have a nice day.
Kae
Ninja - " You're a stimpack that can talk & is only in the game so you can feel useful. I'm all for entertainer revenge commands & welfare commands...AFTER I can buy BF healing stimpacks. "
Exactly. If we were not in the game you would have to buy stimpacks or go to a medic (most of which make you pay before service these days) and pay to have this stuff taken care of. Now.. you can do it for free because we can't make you tip or stop you from getting healed. You seem to enjoy being able to get our services free so I don't really think you would be happy to the SOE allow us to craft mind packs that we could sell or use selectivly because than you would now have to pay for mind healing like you pay for medical healing. Careful what you wish for.
Whether or not SOE put in Mind wounds and battle fatigue to make the dancers useful in beta doesn't matter. The game mechanics have to be looked at post launch. And post launch you need us, and we need injured people. I don't agree with any type of forced tipping scheme. I think we should either A) have a craftable, sellable item.. like a dance video or music CD that lets you heal in the field without us there orB) have increased mission payouts so we are getting money from the system like everyone else. Personally I do okay with tips. If you are there and interact with your customers I find most tip and are very nice. There are a few griefers and it would be nice if we could completely screw them over, but I can leave the cantina and go to another one. I always make sure I have enough credits on me for a shuttle ticket at least one town away. I would rather deal with the griefers on my own than have a system put in which could allow even one dancer to grief someone else.
I realize a number of the entertainers are not making money, but I think you are responsible to change that. You might be the most active, engaging entertainer in the room. But if you're in a place like Theed, you are just one of about 20 entertainers in the room. You will not make as much, there are just too many people around. Re-located to a less populated town or a cantina on a harder planet where the fighters are really grateful to see someone. If you are not particularly engaging or if you AFK through the skill tree, then that is why you are not making as many tips are other people. It's fine to be role-playing a shy person, but shy people will never make the money that an outgoing person will make. You are in control of your income..I know a lot of you don't believe that, but you are. Your actions and decisions directly effect the amount of money you make. There will be people that never tip, but it's like that in rl too. Some people are just cheap and they will come up with many many excuses for their behavior. Don't let them get to you.. just dance, entertain and let the rest come as will. Our profession runs pretty well and when player cities get into the game it will be even better because you can own a bar on the map and set the rules and prices as you please. Just give it time.
Min'Tora Ehi
Starlance wrote:
Each and every profession should be able to 'support itself' and be a viable part of the online world/economy relying only on it's own skillset.
And if the entertainer missions are fixed so their payouts are appropriate, then entertainers will be able to support themselves just fine.
If this fix happens, then setting the rate is unnecessary.
Completely agree with you Sinda. Most other classes make their money via missions, I don't know why we need to have a special thread to figure out how entertainers can make more money.
And who was the genious that set all the prices for ent missions below the cost of the roundtrip shuttle to complete the mission? /chuckle Nice.
Beery wrote:
You know, this whole attitude that says 'do something else if you want to earn $$' is wrong. Entertainer should be a valid way to make money. The fact that it isn't IS NOT the fault of those who choose the entertainment field.
Actually if mission payouts were raised to the same level combat missions were at, we would be earning money exactly the same way as everyone else. Why should entertainers be able to force people to simply give them money, when there are ent mission booths sitting right outside the cantina?
Ninja, you don't need us, give up some of those valuable skill points and learn to dance... Then you can dance at your camp site and heal yourself and never step into a cantina ever again. From your attitude, well I'm sure the entertainers in the Cantinas surely won't miss you 
Unless we get targeted healing we willalways be looked upon as a free comodity that may be worthy of a tip by some. Then there are those who will post here and tell you that you are worthless and shouldn't even exist. This isn't just about tips, its also about respect. We aren't waitress's delivering a product made by a chef, we are the product, and just as everyone else in the game can control their income, we should have that ability also. Entertainer missions are stupid and a waste of time and takes entertainers out of the place they are needed. As long as entertainers are needed as healers of BF and mind wounds, then let us do our jobs, but give us some control over how we do it.
I've done well working for tips-- I have about 150k credit worth of clothing that I have bought from tips, and another 50k worth as gifts from freinds. I feel that the biggest problem with our profession is public AFK entertainers. Now don't get me wrong, I AFK'd abit in my house as I was skilling up-- but you have no excuse to whine about not getting paid if you are doing it in a public cantina! As for setting a price for our services... that's a joke! A better way for us to get the money we need for our profession (aside from better paying gigs) would be to place a bartender in the cantina. An entertainer would have to speak to the bartender say... every 10 to 15 minutes to re-establish a temporary performancecontract. once the performer does 10 to 15 minutes of performance (not sitting on your buns- actual playing or dancing is required with time you are performing being cummulative for us that have less action). Ofcourse the amount the establishment would pay would be dependent on skill level. This will ensure that the Public AFKers do not get paid, and that the REAL entertainers are able to be self sufficient.Any thoughts?
-Patina
Master Dancer / Novice TKA
Face it...unlike me, you were considered a frivolous, add-on class that just as easily, uniquely, could have been left out. ONE stimpack replaces you
Wait a minute. What part of carrying a Big Gun and killing small animals is "necessary"? Is it therapeutic for you because of your own sexual inadequacies?
Trolls. Can't live with 'em, can't stuff 'em in a sack. Someone needs to go back to school and take MMRPGs 101... or go back to Quake.
I have no idea if it is possible or even a good idea.. But I was thinking about if the entertainers could have some sort of "salary" from the cantina they entertain in. The "salary" would increase the higher you get in the profession.
Like.. If a dancer/music person comes into the cantine he or she "announces" the arrival on some sort of data pad and registers in the cantina. maybe the "salary" would get bigger if you dance there often.. Maybe the patrons could put in requests to see this or that dancer, listen to this or that musician, and that too would raise the "salary". The cantina could every 30 minute ask you if you needed a break or wish to continue to entertain, in a popup msg, and that would take care of the LAMers. Just some thoughts I have sitting at work all alone when everybody else are sound asleep in there beds.
The problem with this, and also with raising mission payouts (which I heartily agree needs doing, or just rip those insulting mission terms right out!) is that it creates more money from thin air and places it into the economy. I expect very much that the devs DO NOT want this, and wish to have us paid by the other players for our services, just as a Tailor is paid by others for the clothing they produce, which actually moves money in the economy. For this reason, I don't believe this will be seen as a viable alternative by the devs. And economically, it is a valid point. No matter what anyone thinks or says, our BF and Mind healing IS a service and we are providing it to other players. It is from those others that payment for services rendered should come, otherwise it is not an economy at all.