Dancer Archive
Thread: Dancing Taxes
What if they make Cantinas basically hire entertainers. Now, just go me right now, as this is a basic idea, not a complete plan. This is how I see it right now:
1. You register with a Cantina, the longer you dance/play the more you are paid when you leave (credit for work hours, much like real life).
2. To defend against AFK abuse; have a "Manager Check" every so often. A pop-up of the manager checking on you and making sure you are doing your job (or something like that). If no response, you're fired and the clock stops for you. You can keep going, but you get no payout.
3. To reward regular staff, each Cantina will give Faction, basically (you have +100 at Kor Vella Cantina). As your faction increases, so does your pay, to be capped at some point I would think.
4. The more advance your skill, the higher the payout. This would give young dancers/musicians even more incentive to increase skill and reward those working the hardest.
5. At a certain faction level, allow players to display an employee tag, something that identifies them as a regular performer at that cantina.
That's all I can think of right now. I personally think this would add to the performers game experience, as well as to the visitors experience. The only down side I can see, right now, is people decided not to tip at all. Basically that old saying, "why should I tip, they'll getting paid anyway." Any ideas how to combat that?
Well, there's my idea, have fun
Beery wrote:
You have absolutely no social conscience, and you deserve to be vilified.
And by Social Conscience I assume you mean that your NEED and your WANT trumps MY right to personal property? That because you... WANT... something, my Money, my House, my Clothes, the things that I WORKED for, the things that I EARNED through long hours of hard work...
You WANT them and you NEED them so therefore we'll set up a system where someone with Power can TAKE them away from me and GIVE them to YOU and other like you?
Do I understand your basic premise correctly???
Or if your response is that you don't want it for YOU but for those "less fortunate", which the phrase normally used, then why? Is it because you want them to LIKE you for giving them things you took from someone else? Do you feel a need for their Gratitude?
Or do you mean that you will appeal to my....Altruism? That I should feel GUILTY because I worked for something and achieved it. And that because you either weren't WILLING or ABLE to work as hard as I did and achieve the same result that I should feel BAD about that????
That I should take everything I have and GIVE it to those who were not able to achieve what I did? Or course since there's more of YOU than there are of ME then we can all be equally poor together?
Is THAT your definition of Social Conscience?
From MY experience in here and out in R/L Social Conscience generally means that someone doesn't LIKE the fact that I have MORE than they do and that they feel that they have a Right to take it away from me and give it to someone else.
When one person does that we call it armed robbery. When the Government does it then we call it....Welfare and Social Programs.
Well you can do that if you like and can talk the devs into it. But when you DO then I quit and there will be one LESS person from which to take it. And when other do the same there will be even FEWER from whom to take it. What happens when you run out of victims from which to take dear? Do you starve or simply look wider for Other victims from which to mooch?
Beery wrote:"I don't want to work in a WELFARE profession. I earn my way and I take pride from that."
Aw come on! Our profession relies on handouts. The fact that the government (the developers) don't give them to you doesn't make them any less a form of welfare. Next you'll be telling us that charging a fee for service is communism.
You can view it as "handouts" if you like, but it's been my long experience that the "voluntary donations" usually vary according to the amount of value I'm offering - not just for healing, but also for entertainment enjoyment. If all Dancers were mindless bots, maybe your term would have validity. But we're not, so it doesn't.
"Welfare" implies that I'm paid whether I work or not. It subverts the spirit of competition -- why should I try harder than the next dancer if we're both going to be paid the same, even if she's not really at the keyboard and thinks her dirty panties are sexy?
The current tip system isn't perfect, but to me it's still far better than MMRPG socialism where initiative and creativity are ground to dust under the metal tracks of "equality".
If we look at the way things are in most servers right now, the best of the Dancers have left the public establishments. They've either given up dancing, or are pursuing careers with private cantinas. If we need anything, we need a way to make private cantinas more accessible and appealing. I think that would solve more ills than just the question of dancer income. It would eventually benefit all players.
I agree full with Flaw and Sinda.
How could I be proud getting money atomaticly?
The key for us earning money is entertaining not begging LAMEing or getting social welfare or dole-money.
I like to live from the tips. It shows me, how well I have done my job or how less well.
If I leave the cantina with 10000 or 20000 cr, andif I managed that the on or other patron stood longer as intended in the cantina and gave a second tip perhaps, then I am proud of it.
Earning automaticly money for tipping a keybordkey is for LAMErs not for entertainer.
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Aniella (Gorath) Dancer
First off, it's nice to see you back, Flawed!
It's nice to see that more people are agreeing than disagreeing. Listening to some people makes me think I live on the nicest server in the world! I usually make about 5kin tips a night in my small cantina, and sometimes more if people are feeling generous. I would guess for most of us who are on regularly that that's enough to live on, get new clothes, pay for house, etc. And of course, if that really isn't enough, go run destroy or deliver missions. My fear with automatically paying dancers is that it would encourage patrons not to tip - and frankly, tips are how I measure how well I am performing as a dancer! People don't always compliment you out loud, but a 1k credit tip speaks pretty well.
The only caveat I have is if the devs are going to keep the entertainer missions, they should increase the payout, if only a little. After you join the local entertainer group in the cantina and complete the mission, you can only get about 50 creds, to as little as 15 depending on the size of the group. With that kind of reward, the missions are useless. Make them useful or get rid of them, in my opinion. 
"Fix the entertainer missions; just make them scale with skill level and be done with them. If you don't want to travel, just refresh until you get one in your local cantina or hotel."
I agree. This is a simple fix, and would solve the problem once and for all. People would still be able to tip, and entertainers would finally have a realreason to get to, and to stay at, the master level.
"But since the devs seem to be trying very hard to remove credits from the game I think they are looking for ways to just shuffle more credits to us from the community instead of the system."
I certainly hope the developers are NOT trying to create a closed monetary system. If they do, it will create super-rich and super-poor classes of players - anddancers will be among the super-poor if nothing changes regarding their pay structure.
I've only started out really so I don't have a loyal customer base yet. Still, I'm not starving and I'm able to afford clothes every other day or so. I don't make great tips yet but then I'm not a great dancer yet.
I really didn't expect to make as many credits as a dancer as other professions do. Running delivery missions is a nice way to supplement my dancing income and it's not a combat related deal (though I don't mind those now and then either).
I really hope players won't be forced to pay me. I'd really rather they come in, enjoy the chatter, take a break from the fighting, and pay me what they feel is owed. I'm not getting rich being a dancer (yet) but I am certainly enjoying the comraderie of the entertainers in the cantina and the occasion customer who wants to talk a little now and then.
Sinda said in another post, there are three types of customers: the ones that always tip, the ones that never tip, and the ones that might. Sway the ones that might, be grateful for the ones that always will, and don't worry about the rest.
I don't need to be wealthy (but that would be nice!); I really just want to enjoy myself.
Flawed /applause
You have neatly summed up everything that i feel about the whole tip situation.
Devs. LEAVE THE TIP SYSTEM ALONE.
If this autopay thing comes in it will destroy the entertainer classes.
"I'm not getting rich being a dancer (yet)"
You make it sound as if it's possible (eventually) to get rich as a dancer. I assure you, it isn't. If you're after riches, stop dancing now, and start a different career - any different career. No matter how good you are as a dancer, your tips will never make you rich, dancemissions will never make you rich, and your need for dancing clothes will always keep you poor. That applies to a Master just as much as to a novice.
i like the idea of opertunities, not guarentees either. i make jack **edit** for tips, but i also do some destroy missions here and there. granted, i haven't the skillpoints to master any elite fighter class profession, but i can do some missions here and there to take care of myself.
the one thing i want changed, and i think should be changed, is the payout for entertainer missions. i don't even know how to complete them, and i /hear/ that is takes 30 minutes of standing in one place dancing to complete one for minimal pay, while normal mission take say, 10 minutes. i would like to be encouraged to do these missions, to feel like it is an opertunity, and not some piss poor sad joke.
"i don't want anyone to HAVE to pay to watch me."
So you don't think the healing job you're doing, or the time you've spent developing that skill, is worth anything? Only certaindancers, it seems, have such a low opinion of themselves. People in every other profession feel justified in how they make money through the service they provide. But somein the dancing professionseem to have delusions of insignificance,in that they don't seem to be able torealise that they also provide a service to the SWGcommunity.