Dancer Archive
Thread: Suggestion for the entertainer revamp
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Reachwind
Thu Nov 25, 2004 10:12 am
#14
Ok just to clarify some things for.... First of all the box office idea is to take entertainers and give them value. I see a couple of major misunderstandings with the idea. First of all I see that you are equating the amount the players needing healing to our payment. This is not the case. Our missions would be scaled based on character skill level. These missions would equate to combat missions in payment and time needed. The amount a player needed to pay would be a set amount based on # of wounds and the amount of battle fatigue they had. The cost of this would be determined by the developement staff based on what they budget into a player's mission pay for it.
Currently SWG player characters do not have to pay an entertainer at all. There is no mechanic to require a payment. Therefore our healing has a value of 0 in the economy. Combat players however are still being paid based on the fact that they are paying for an entertainer to heal them even though in many cases they do not.
The players that are paying are simply being charitable. The role of entertainer should not be that of a beggar. Yet that is exactly what we are. What my proposal does is take our income from being scaled solely on charity to it being based on missions.
Also I see there was some misunderstanding about the places healing could work. Healing would only work in areas with a box office. I also suggested adding in box office droids that would allow healing pretty much anywhere. Our missions do not have to be DDR/Simon says style. They would be simply like the 200 credit missions we have now (again our pay would be based on character skill not just a flat amount like the current missions.)
Currently SWG player characters do not have to pay an entertainer at all. There is no mechanic to require a payment. Therefore our healing has a value of 0 in the economy. Combat players however are still being paid based on the fact that they are paying for an entertainer to heal them even though in many cases they do not.
The players that are paying are simply being charitable. The role of entertainer should not be that of a beggar. Yet that is exactly what we are. What my proposal does is take our income from being scaled solely on charity to it being based on missions.
Also I see there was some misunderstanding about the places healing could work. Healing would only work in areas with a box office. I also suggested adding in box office droids that would allow healing pretty much anywhere. Our missions do not have to be DDR/Simon says style. They would be simply like the 200 credit missions we have now (again our pay would be based on character skill not just a flat amount like the current missions.)
Reachwind
Thu Nov 25, 2004 11:19 am
#15
Tabi, you do rely on charity in the current system. There is no mechanic in place for you to grant authorization for your healing. If you are dancing you are healing for free. The only mechanics we have are for stopping people from taking healing from us by either not dancing or by forcefully denying them with /denyservice.
All my suggestion does is change the current setup from players /tipping to players paying a term. You would be paid by selecting your mission instead of waiting for a /tip. All I am doing is forcing a payment on the patron and adding in a click for you to authorize payment for yourself. No more no less.
The only players who would be negatively impacted are those who do not pay for healing from us and those who AFK dance (as they could no longer make money for this time). Our box office would be in the area we danced (so we would not have to stop dancing to take our missions) and our ability to dance for art sake (on your hilltop) would also not be impacted in the slightest. Only healing would be affected.
All my suggestion does is change the current setup from players /tipping to players paying a term. You would be paid by selecting your mission instead of waiting for a /tip. All I am doing is forcing a payment on the patron and adding in a click for you to authorize payment for yourself. No more no less.
The only players who would be negatively impacted are those who do not pay for healing from us and those who AFK dance (as they could no longer make money for this time). Our box office would be in the area we danced (so we would not have to stop dancing to take our missions) and our ability to dance for art sake (on your hilltop) would also not be impacted in the slightest. Only healing would be affected.
TabithaRashelle
Fri Nov 26, 2004 3:55 am
#16
Actually yes you are right...partially. I am completely being an elitist and need to apologize. When I think of my income, i usually think in terms of buffs, so yeah, you are right: for healing we are at the complete mercy of those being healed. For buffs we are incontrol though. So anyway i still wish we were more free in our healing. Actually, maybe its weird, but i kinda like the idea of someone across on another hilltop, healing their troubled mind simply by watching me dancing...
kirah_ashlin
Fri Nov 26, 2004 5:53 am
#17
Alright, I think I understand your idea a bit better, Reach, but I'm still not convenced it is theright solution. First, combat players would resent being forced to pay for their BF and mind wound healings (not that it makes sense that they should, but we all know they will) - so much so that they would either wait until their BF is somewhere upwards of 1000 before coming into the NPC cantinas (thus making the cantinas devoid of players much of the time) or they would simply have analt in their guild hall or player city cantina. This has the potential to hurt both leveling entertainers (whowould find it more difficult to gainnecessary xp)and new players (who don't havealot ofcredits to spend). I see it as potentionally degrading the social aspect of the profession, as well, as the cantina would no longer be a place to just hang out.
Also, once dance or music is mastered, what is the incentive to use the box office? A master's income is derived mainly from buffing and performing at events. If I'm buffingpatrons I, at least, don't want to be interupted with healing requests through the box office interface. And if I'min the cantina to just dance and have fun with my friends the box office could become a hinderance and a chore.
The idea has merit - as an option perhaps as opposed to a requirement (say, the patron wants his/her BF/mind wounds healed instantly and can pay the box office to gain the quick healand the entertainer chosen then gets bonus xp and the credits).
Reachwind
Fri Nov 26, 2004 9:46 am
#18
I didn't make any suggestions for enhancements because we haven't had the combat revamp. We honestly don't know if or what enhancements will be like until after that is in place.
That's why I only discussed healing.
As far as healing goes... Again it would not matter when or where a player chose to heal up. The cost would be the same. The box office price would remain a constant hardcoded rate.
Also the box office does not send requests to an entertainer. An entertainer pulls missions from it as they want credits. If you don't want credits for your dancing time don't pull a mission. It's not a hinderance to you at all. Also keep in mind... We have no idea what the new HAM system will be. This revamp suggestion is for the time whne a dev will actually look at us and make changes well after the CU.
That's why I only discussed healing.
As far as healing goes... Again it would not matter when or where a player chose to heal up. The cost would be the same. The box office price would remain a constant hardcoded rate.
Also the box office does not send requests to an entertainer. An entertainer pulls missions from it as they want credits. If you don't want credits for your dancing time don't pull a mission. It's not a hinderance to you at all. Also keep in mind... We have no idea what the new HAM system will be. This revamp suggestion is for the time whne a dev will actually look at us and make changes well after the CU.
Maisland
Sat Nov 27, 2004 10:56 pm
#19
Sorry, but I don't like these ideas.
I want to be able to heal in more places, not to be restricted to a "stage" area... and the "box office" concept is even more annoying.
I want to be able to heal my friends for free and not have them be forced to pay a "box office."
I would rather see entertainer missions from the terminals have decent payouts.
Iwant my current party droid to be functional in the same way that a medical droid is functional.
I want to be able to heal BF in a camp and not have to go to a cantina.
The way I see it, if these ideas were put in place, there would be people who would pick up entertainer just so they could heal themselves and not have to pay anyone... or would you have us lose the ability to heal our own BF and mind wounds? We already are not able to buff ourselves.
New entertainers would find that eh xp even harder to get than they do now. I know that if I were forced to pay for the healing and did not have any entertainer skills myself, I certainly would not bother with some newbie entertainer.
Kareanne
Sun Nov 28, 2004 11:46 am
#20
I agree with the things Maisland wants, and those things seem like pretty easy and simple fixes. Although, I think they keep the mission payouts low on purpose, so we don't bother with them...to make sure we are in the cantinas to heal all the wounds and bf. 
A box office of some kind sounds fun, but I don't like the idea of SOE deciding how much I should be paid. Yes, players can still tip, but most of them wont if they've already paid. The box office could be a new way for us to register with a location, rather than taking missions. It could be on a timer so you would have to re-register every so often. If a non ent player clicks on it it could list the ents registered with a reminder to PAY(not tip) them for their services rather than make them pay up front. Some people want a sort of popularity rating system, this could be a way to track that too.
I know this kind of thing has been suggested, and I don't know if it could be linked to the main box office(for the popularity reasons maybe), but we could also have our own little personal box offices. There could be something in our UI that could say "so and so needs/wants to be entertained," when they start to watch you, then you can select to entertain or not. That would give us some control over our income, because if we want to we can set a payment agreement before we accept. The watchers wouldn't really have to do anything more than they do now. They would just get a system message that the dancer/musician is entertaining them after the ent accepted. The word would get around about the players who don't pay and it could be hard for them to find someone to let the watch/listen.
What would be really funny, would be to also have a canitna bouncer. We give them the names of the players who don't pay...everytime they enter the bouncer will say, in spatial, something about them not paying the entertainers.
A box office of some kind sounds fun, but I don't like the idea of SOE deciding how much I should be paid. Yes, players can still tip, but most of them wont if they've already paid. The box office could be a new way for us to register with a location, rather than taking missions. It could be on a timer so you would have to re-register every so often. If a non ent player clicks on it it could list the ents registered with a reminder to PAY(not tip) them for their services rather than make them pay up front. Some people want a sort of popularity rating system, this could be a way to track that too.
I know this kind of thing has been suggested, and I don't know if it could be linked to the main box office(for the popularity reasons maybe), but we could also have our own little personal box offices. There could be something in our UI that could say "so and so needs/wants to be entertained," when they start to watch you, then you can select to entertain or not. That would give us some control over our income, because if we want to we can set a payment agreement before we accept. The watchers wouldn't really have to do anything more than they do now. They would just get a system message that the dancer/musician is entertaining them after the ent accepted. The word would get around about the players who don't pay and it could be hard for them to find someone to let the watch/listen.
What would be really funny, would be to also have a canitna bouncer. We give them the names of the players who don't pay...everytime they enter the bouncer will say, in spatial, something about them not paying the entertainers.
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