Dancer Archive
Thread: CU and Entertainers The Positive Thread For Dev Feedback
Broom
Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:26 am
#14
Aynianu wrote:
Ok ive got a new coffee, ive got Enya playing for me in my bedroom, im in a better mood.....
So we are loosing Buffs
So we are loosing Wound Healing
What will this mean?
In terms of skill boxes it will mean...
Ent healing exp harder to obtain, aswell as one whole tree of dancer and musician becomming completely obsolete
no Mind buffs means the techniques line is just a couple of fancy lights that no one really uses much.
Answer to this to me would mean Dancer requiring a LOT less skill points and exp required to master (at least on entertainer healing exp) As we have a virtually useless line in techniques, and an obsolete line in wound healing which should be removed skill-point wise in all fairness.
What needs to be Done?
There are two big options, one idoubt many are happy with but as an option i will post it anyway.
1: Merge dancer and musician, 4 skill boxes, dance knowledge, music knowledge, entertainer healing, entertainer techniques.
2: Expand both dancer and musician.
to do this,
Technique lines from both proffessions need to have a lot more abilities added. This can be a lot more visual effects, implementation of props into dancing/music or whatever else could really come under techniques.
Addition of a replacement skill tree for the wound healing. Wound healing is gone so a buffing line is to replace it? then lets have a lot of buffs, state defences perhaps.
These changes make me feel physically ill. I predict a mass exodus. Entertainers do not want new songs and dances (not me anyway, who cares). We want CONTENT, a role in the GCW. Image Designers do not want their profession made a valueless add-on, they want CONTENT. No stat migration? How are they going to get xp? And talking about no stat migration: cookie cutter HAM bars. Bah. I love the variety in this game. I do not want cookie cutter junk. You are marginalising the non-combat professions, and for what?
I love playing my Master Swordsman / Doc / 18 points FS. You are telling me to forget about doc crafting. You are also telling me to take skills I do not want or dump the fs mods I worked hard for to get. I love playing my other accounts. They are not perfect, but I like their skills as they are.
I don't WANT you to mess with the entire system. It works. No one is complaining about imbalance in SP used, we are complaining about imbalance in actual ABILITIES and a lack of CONTENT. Could you please just fix the professions? And stop messing with what works?
And another thing: who was complaining about buffs? Nerf the armor, by all means, it will force is all to work together to a much greater extent. But what is so very wrong about buffs? They give people afar more equal chance than what you are now proposing. What about crafters who need a buff to check harvesters? 1000 HAM + 20%? You are going to lose all of them.
Already your announced or rumored changes are doing nasty things to the economy. Who wants to stock armor when it is getting nerfed anyway? Who wants to create buffs if no one knows what is going to happen with them?
I actually had hope for the game when I saw the last few publishes. This makes me want to throw in the towel. It does not fix anything, it just places us all in yet another beta, with all the bugs all over again.
5 accounts here, SOE. Think about it, because sure as hell, I am not staying if this turns out as I fear it will.
Linna
guild leader <Fated> since March 2004
Bloodfin Server
Upia
Sat Mar 19, 2005 7:52 am
#15
Aynianu wrote:
1: Merge dancer and musician, 4 skill boxes, dance knowledge, music knowledge, entertainer healing, entertainer techniques.
If they would be merging musician and dancer then why reduce the number of points needed to master ID so you can have musican, dancer and ID?
I don't think it's what they are going to do..
Drygo
Sat Mar 19, 2005 8:20 am
#16
Ok, positives:
1) I will have more time to exercise and plan a healthy eating schedule, so I will become thin again and have lots of sex.
2) I will be able to watch more DVD's.
3) I'll probably hang out with my friends more, so that will mean they won't think of me as quite so anti-social.
4) I'll get to bed on time and be more productive at work.
5) I'll be happier.
6) I'll be able to pay full attention to my favorite TV shows like Alias, and Amazing Race.
7) I'll smoke a lot less, maybe even quit.
8) I'll dance more in real life.
9) I'll be able to do more overtime at work, thereby being able to redecorate my condo, possibly even buying a 60 inch wall mounted television with surround sound.
10) I'll probably turn on my cell phone more often, so that when my mother calls me she won't get pissed that it was off.
Yes, this is a very positive change indeed.
Ignok
Sat Mar 19, 2005 9:09 am
#17
Honestly, I'm past the point of caring much about healing or buffing, I just want the Cantina to be fun again. At least if these changes take effect and they're as bleak for us functionally as they sound, the Cantinas will be full of people who really want to be there instead of people whohave to come by and get buffs or heals or bots who just wanna generate imaginary money.
The way I see it is, this will cut down on a lot of day-to-day annoyances for me. No more being harrassed for buffs, no more wondering why I'm not being tipped, no more buying uber-expensive attachments (I hope). Just playing the game, making the best of it, having fun where I can with good people who love this profession as much as I do.
I'm tickled pink to be getting new dances, not be falling over and not have to wait between songs or dances. That's more than I expected with the CU, but my expectations for Ent changes were low and I'm pretty easy to please.
I mean, breakdancing?!!? Come on! What doesn't rule about that?! It has very little to do with Star Wars but man, whatever, I'm gonna love it and I'm gonna keep on loving the Dancer profession.
DoI wish Entertainers were a vital part of the game and every Dancer or Musician actually *played* their character? Of course. No one wants to play a gimped or underappreciated class. But no matter what, every time I /startdance, I'm gonna have fun. Functional or not.
Kyranis
Sat Mar 19, 2005 9:15 am
#18
Silly idea. I never really STUCK with entertainer as a full time occupation, but I do the music thing every once in a while.
Why not attribute a new, different skill buff type to each Dance/Song, with Flourishing increasing the effectiveness of the buff.Make sure that no one song/dance is the ULTIMATE buff, thus allowing people to request which song/dance they want to hear, and what they want buffed. The entertainer can choose to not begin performing until tipped, and this would also diminish the appeal of AFK entertaining as well, as the listener would need to input with a reactive entertainer to get the buffs of choice.
You could probably only have one music and one dance buff at a time, so it doesnt get overpowered, and ID could also probably be used in such a way as well.
Or maybe Im just stupid. 
PoetDancer
Sat Mar 19, 2005 9:50 am
#19
My only concern is that these buffs will amount to a complicated headache like the current system.
The very buffing system itself today, I am convinced, has led to the current problems of the cantina.
Chessack
Sat Mar 19, 2005 9:58 am
#20
Ignok wrote:
Honestly, I'm past the point of caring much about healing or buffing, I just want the Cantina to be fun again. At least if these changes take effect and they're as bleak for us functionally as they sound, the Cantinas will be full of people who really want to be there instead of people who have to come by and get buffs or heals or bots who just wanna generate imaginary money.
I agree that what may be left in the cantina will be only people who WANT to be there, but that it will be "full" I do not follow. How exactly is that going to happen? More than likely, only a tiny handful of entertainers will be left on each galaxy (the non-AFK ones right now, will be the only ones left, apparently). How does this mean the cantina will be "full"? I only know of a couple dozen (maybe) true entertainers on my entire server (Naritus). They might, together, be able to fill ONE (since nobody's logged in and entertaining more than a couple of hours a day). The rest will remain as empty as always. I'm not sure how this makes things "better." Entertainers aren't there with the goal of just socializing for themselves. Some of us, at least, picked it to be HEALERS and to do that in a social way. If nobody needs to really come to us much anymore, how are we able to do that? I don't envy the devs here, as they are in a pickle. If they make Entertainment useful to other players, then they will get macro-bots. If they make entertainers useless to other players, they will have a tiny number of live people who are stupid enough to spend skill points on a near-useless profession. Neither seems enviable.
Oh wait... there was a third choice. They could've made it useful and just banned AFK macroing from the game a year and a half ago, and there wouldn't be a problem with AFK macro-bots right now. So this is their solution. Instead of fixing AFK macroing (which they keep saying they are going to take away but never have), they are making it so nobody would want to bother being an entertainer in the first place.
Ignok wrote:
I'm tickled pink to be getting new dances, not be falling over and not have to wait between songs or dances. That's more than I expected with the CU, but my expectations for Ent changes were low and I'm pretty easy to please. I mean, breakdancing?!!? Come on! What doesn't rule about that?! It has very little to do with Star Wars but man, whatever, I'm gonna love it and I'm gonna keep on loving the Dancer profession.
You're right. Breakdancing has zero to do with Star Wars and really does not belong in the game. My dancer will probably never use it. She is a sexy, elegant, professional not some ham-handed street punk. How about they give every dance, I mean all of them including all 4 exotic dances, a full range of flourishes instead? I mean it's only been what 2 years that they have had to do this. How about a "ballroom dance" style that lets 2 dancers work together in unison? That, I'd like. Breakdancing... I will probably never use.
And now apparently we can't synch our dances anymore?? What the HELL are they thinking? Clearly, the devs have NO IDEA what entertainers want, or need.
C
Aynianu
Sat Mar 19, 2005 10:13 am
#21
Ignok wrote:
Honestly, I'm past the point of caring much about healing or buffing, I just want the Cantina to be fun again. At least if these changes take effect and they're as bleak for us functionally as they sound, the Cantinas will be full of people who really want to be there instead of people whohave to come by and get buffs or heals or bots who just wanna generate imaginary money.
I agree to some extent with what you say.
However you use the phrase 'cantina will be FULL of people who really want to be there.
You are right i am sure, however i think FULL may not consist of very many people. I dont know about you, but if im in a cantina with 2 or 3 people and none really chatting much, id get bored and do something else. How often will the cantina be full enough to have fun?
Ive a real bad feeling about this. i just hope im wrong
Ignok
Sat Mar 19, 2005 10:18 am
#22
Man you guys are a rough crowd. I'm not in controlhere and I can't force people to have fun doing something they don't want to do, I'm just trying to look on the bright side. No, it won't be "full", ok, I chose an unfortunate word there.
Also, I'd take one quality chatty customer or fellow dancer over a packed to capacity Cantina any day. I guess I'm foolish to be optimistic that way.
Edit: Also, I thought this was the Positive Thread, so I was keeping the gripey parts out. I surely have gripes and would love Cantinas to be like they were back around launch when I was grinding dancer, but I don't know if that can ever happen.
Message Edited by Ignok on 03-19-2005 09:20 AM
Esharra
Sat Mar 19, 2005 10:21 am
#23
My bright side has slowly deteriorated over the past 1.75 years.
Aynianu
Sat Mar 19, 2005 10:24 am
#24
Ignok wrote:
Edit: Also, I thought this was the Positive Thread, so I was keeping the gripey parts out. I surely have gripes and would love Cantinas to be like they were back around launch when I was grinding dancer, but I don't know if that can ever happen.
I had hoped it would be, but i cant remain positive for long about this myself even im afraid 
Going to not post anymore and just see what else comes, and if anything else is thrown our way.
Ignok
Sat Mar 19, 2005 10:31 am
#25
Aynianu wrote:
Ignok wrote:
Edit: Also, I thought this was the Positive Thread, so I was keeping the gripey parts out. I surely have gripes and would love Cantinas to be like they were back around launch when I was grinding dancer, but I don't know if that can ever happen.
I had hoped it would be, but i cant remain positive for long about this myself even im afraid
Going to not post anymore and just see what else comes, and if anything else is thrown our way.
Yeah, the CU still seems to be in its infancy, maybe even embryonic stage, so things could change dramatically. I feel worse for the Image Designers than I do for us, because although we're getting screwed out of most of the utilitarian purposes we're used to, IDs might just end up walking makeup counters.
Again, my expectations are low. I gave up on Ent missions becoming fun a long time ago, but was happy to be able to do the Theed theater quest. They're small trade-offs and I'm aware a lot of the "content" added for entertainers is mainly to placate us, but it conditions us to not expect miracles. I still dream of a perfect Entertainer experience where the combat players need and respect us and the social scene is rich and immersive and there'sa real sense ofcommunity in every Cantina. That's what makes it so hard to read updates and notes and posts like this preliminary CU one. It feels more likea slap in the face than baby steps to better gameplay. But I dunno, I sure am trying.
Message Edited by Ignok on 03-19-2005 09:37 AM
Mariki
Sat Mar 19, 2005 10:51 am
#26
Drygo wrote:
Ok, positives:
1) I will have more time to exercise and plan a healthy eating schedule, so I will become thin again and have lots of sex.
2) I will be able to watch more DVD's.
3) I'll probably hang out with my friends more, so that will mean they won't think of me as quite so anti-social.
4) I'll get to bed on time and be more productive at work.
5) I'll be happier.
6) I'll be able to pay full attention to my favorite TV shows like Alias, and Amazing Race.
7) I'll smoke a lot less, maybe even quit.
8) I'll dance more in real life.
9) I'll be able to do more overtime at work, thereby being able to redecorate my condo, possibly even buying a 60 inch wall mounted television with surround sound.
10) I'll probably turn on my cell phone more often, so that when my mother calls me she won't get pissed that it was off.
Yes, this is a very positive change indeed.
You may be absolutely right. The summer is around the corner. Its a good time to get out of this increasing cycle of BS. I know there are real SWG problems when I spend more time on the boards with no desire to go on the game.
It would be a good time to start taking more walks. Maybe even get a dog, that might be fun.