Dancer Archive
Thread: Our Next Project: Improve the Cantinas!
Some other ideas:
Hopefully players will be able to decorate those cantinas however they wish. In other words, place down their own table and chairs, etc.
I would really like to see people who don't have entertainer skills be able to do one or two of the basic dances without flourishes. Let them participate by actually dancing.
Lighting. I realize disco balls might be a bit too hard to put in, but if the atmosphere is naturally dim inside a player cantina, the owner could control the amount of light by placing lamps, torches, whatever. A corollary to this is to fix lamps so they actually throw light and also provide lamps that throw colored light.
Bartenders/vendors. This was already mentioned, but it's really important.
Some sort of inherent bonus to the dancers/musicians who work in a player run establishment. My current thought is to reduce the amount of action required for entertaining across the board when in a player run establishment, thus allowing them to perform longer. It'd be even better if this were tied to the crowd size (bigger crowds spurring the entertainers on). We need something like this to get people OUT of the NPC cantinas and into the player run establishments.
Definitely allow player run cantinas to be on the planetary map. Allow entertainers to register there the same as any other cantina. Better yet, when you click the cantina list on the planetary map, not only indicate which cantinas have performers registered, but also list the names of the master level entertainers playing at player run cantinas (not regular cantinas). A bit of a perk for gaining mastery and playing in a player-run establishment.
Just tossin around ideas, let's hear more!
- J
Only have to wait a month or so to find out tho!
i heard that was the first addition to mos eisleys cantina after han shot greedo. a disco ball. they also put in a lighted floor, made it less crowded, took away the bartenders and let in droids and mounts.
my ideas:
1 cantina per city.... group size limited to 5.....1 group per area of the cantina.... darker..... dirtier.....nix mission terminals and ticket terminals and move them to npcs in the cantina.
and since i mentioned the group stuff... groups bigger than 5 go to the theater. if its booked, tough. pay to book the theater for X amount of time and group performances require a fee to watch but give a passive XXX amount stat buff that lasts for X hours/days/whatever.
flame away!
Negative reinforcement doesn't work. It will only foster resentment towards the devs and to us, because we'll be guilty by association. Positive reinforcement is the only way to improve the cantinas, which is why I tried to limit my suggestions to positive results (except for the pet thing, I guess).
To be honest, most players won't care if Sally Sandstrider is performing in the Mos Eisley cantina. What will draw them in are tangible benefits that they themselves will see.Like dice games. Gambling via slot machines and such never works in a game - but put the player against another player(s) in a dice or card game, and suddenly people show up.
Also, just sort of strange random things happening in a cantina could spice it up. What if one day in the Mos Eisley cantina, the Ithorian male and the human he's always talking to got into a gun fight, and the human got blown away? What if stormtroopers popped in every now and then, and any overt rebels were attacked? What if a rancor sat on a dancer (oh wait, that happens now).
And no offense, but if I ever saw a disco ball ina Star Wars-esque cantina, I'd throw up.
And no offense, but if I ever saw a disco ball ina Star Wars-esque cantina, I'd throw up.
agreed. even the coruscant nightclub in episode2 wasn't anything like disco party theed 2003.
"Gambling via slot machines and such never works in a game "
I think it would if the games were weighted so that the player could make a small profit on average. I know if I was down on my luck and out of optionsI would be tempted to gamble at the casino if there was a good chance of turning my few credits into a few more.
What Pickles said! Maybe not disco balls (yuck!) but some kind of neat lighting effects, more gambling options, etc.
As for Player cantinas, I'm 100% for this, but I hope they figure out some way in-game to promote them beyond just notes on the world map. What we've seen so far with private cantinas tells me that if players can't easily find them they're going to flop. Location is something the players have to observe when they place them, but more in-game promotional mechanics would be great. Throw the Businessmen another nugget and let them be our agents!
I tried to start a discussion about a month ago on ways to improve the cantinas, but I think my timing (or wording) was a little off. I'd like to revisit that subject if we could.
With the attention the Devs are apparently giving entertainers right now, the time just may be right to expand our wish list. We're getting new buffs, the Devs are looking at improving entertainment missions and limiting or eliminating AFK Macroing. What more could we want?
In another thread below dealing with BF healing in camps, the discussion has turned on the fact that as long as cantinas are dull and grungy and uninviting, they're not going to remain a focus of social life in SWG. So it's my contention that if we could push some ideas through on making cantinas more pleasant and sociable, it would then remove some of the pressure to exclude other classes from participating in a trade skill chain that lets players handle some of their BF and mind wound problems in the field. If the cantina situation is once again healthy, then the cantina would not be nearly as threatened by other developments. (See that thread for comments from Drake and others)
I'm going to quote NotYourAvgEwok here, as she itemized a short list of things she thinks would help. I agree, and I think it's a good starting point:
Suggestions for improving Cantinas:
1. Elimination of pets from cantinas (I know some people would prefer to allow only small pets in cantinas, I don't know if this is possible. I would prefer no pets to all pets, and I know many people feel the same).
No arguments here, even though I like to use my pet snake, Slinky, in my routine. Maybe if the Devs give us "usable" snakes I'd be happier Anyway, I could live without Slinky in my act if it meant nobody could trot a Rancor or an AT-ST into a cantina.
2. Reorganization of space so that there actually exists an area for groups to perform in.
To be more specific: Cantinas are too disorganized, floor wise. They need a formal stage area where there is room for 10 to 12 players to perform. Dancing XP can only be gained if you're in that stage area. This moves the knot of players away from the entrance and uses the rest of the place.
3. Food and drink crafting stations behind the bar, and benefits to the chef class for working in a cantina. Also, possibly benefits to food/drink consumption if performed in a cantina.
I've never been in favor of cover charges to pay dancers and musicians, but I DO think it would be a godsend for chefs if they could get missions that required them to tend bar in specific cantinas for a set length of time. Anything to (a) make the bar feel more like a bar and (b) give chefs another way to make money. Along this line, I don't know why you can't get your character drunk in SWG like you could in EQ. It makes for some... interesting ... hunts
4. A sort of randomly generated "rumor mill" where NPC characters in the cantinas occasionally offer items of real interest to players, including game knowledge that isn't in the manual (So-and-so says, "I hear that Princess Leia is somewhere on Corellia" or "Did you know that riflemen take twice as much damage in melee if they're holding their rifle?" You know, stuff that maybe you don't know, but you should.)
I like this idea too, on the condition that the conversation is not spammed in spatial. In Mos Eisley, there is a commando quest giver who stands in the cantina and spams the same quest dialog 10 times an hour! As if there weren't enough spam already. (I seem to remember Obi-Wan and Han whispering during their first cantina encounter) The cantina should also be a logical place to go for NPC quests of all kinds.
5. A message board system, where you can leave notes and read notes from other players. ("We're hunting on Lok...need a medic bad! Send /tell to Sam") The messages could be purged once a day, or when the person leaving the message signs out, or something.
Another keeper. Put it outside the door so anyone can see it without entering the cantina - then we could put advertisement bills outside telling patrons we're currently in the house. Someone else already suggested the idea of Fame - giving Master Dancers a secondary goal to work toward, allowing those with a certain level of Fame (gained through entertainer quests) to have their names publicized when they /register at a venue.
I'd also like to see the ability to interact with furniture - standing on tables or the bar instead of walking through them, a feng shui approach to bar organization so you don't have to trip over 20 tables just to reach the area where you can view the stage... and if we ever get recordable holodisks, maybe even a crafting machine in cantinas where we can actually record our performances.
I'd like to hear some other great ideas for making cantinas more important and nicer to visit -- I know the creative minds that haunt this board can come up with something, so let's hear it
Just how many things on your list are still there after the new and improved Cantina's go in we'll have to see in a month when they hit test. I'm sure there will still be some room for improvement but they will be a huge step in the right direction I think.
I'm not a dancer, but let me tell you I like to go to a cantina to sit back and relaxe, I'm one of the few players that tips good to the musician and dancers. On Saturday I tipped between 7 performers(musicians and dancers) like a total of 20k, their choreography was just great. I would like to see good improvements to the cantina's environment.
I would like to purchase drinks, food, etc. , I want the cantinas to look more Star Wars like on New Hope and on Attack of the Clones.
I'm a master brawler/master creature handler/3,2,4,3 pikeman and I need from the dancers and musicians, I'm behind you guys all the way.
/sign
I would personally love a disco ball, only it wouldn't be a disco ball it would be called a Novacorp Glitter Ball after the planet we came from, Glitter.
Anyway, I've sent my wishlist to developers we opened a perpetual cantina the end of July. Here are some of the thing I have longed for that are mostly cosmetic:
Mood lighting per room, set the lighting to dim, medium, bright, give us smoke, light or heavy
Make the areas for sound barriers more discrete, going into a room with a door you shouldn't hear anything.
Give us cantinas that have lockable storage rooms, Also good for image designers, tailors and smugglers to run a business out of a cantina.
Give us a reasonable item limit. 250 for furniture, decorations, food, drink, item ingrediants and stations is not enough.
Give us the ability to see eating and drinking emotes like in AO
Give us the ability to move objects along the Z axis for decorations.
Give us bars and tables and chairs you can lean on.
Make the seating stickier so you aren't sliding around.
Allow architechts to paint interiors
Give us mirrors, tapestries, neon signs, wall hangings.
Give players more gambling action for player versus player
Give us more range of vocalization for bartender npc's, more script use (npc bartenders might be necessary to deal with factioned patrons at an establishment)
Give us the ability to post signs inside the bar for rules, health notices, menus, band notices, wanted ads, etc.
Give managers the ability to designate house dancers and musicians and other staff and pay them from a fund for the cantina that, like a PA you can put money in and take out.
Give us advertising ability on the planetary maps showing open or closed, staffed or unstaffed
And everything else everyone has suggested...