Creature Handler Archive

My main gripe with the CH profession as it stands is that it is not very viable as a player’s solo combat profession.

Now I’m not a master CH but I am working on it, nevertheless, I’ve come up with the following idea that, imo, would greatly improve the profession that so many of us love to play.

Here is a list of issues I’ve taken into consideration when constructing this proposal.

• To be viable as a solo combat profession in PvE pets need a DPS on par with other combat professions (except the hybrids because of their increased SP cost)
• To be viable in PvP pets need a DPS on par with other combat professions and need to have relatively better defences so that they can put up a fight.
• Pets cannot make the difference in a battle. Ie their DPS + the DPS of a supporting combat profession should not be an insurmountable force for a normal combat profession and especially not a hybrid one.

The biggest problem is outlined in the third bullet point. Before the great nerf pets alone were on par with other combat professions (as far as I’m aware anyway, please correct me if I’m wrong) but when paired with another combat profession they became overpowering simply because the full DPS of both professions could be used at the same time. The problem was not the strength of pets but they their full force could be used at the same time as another full combat profession.

The solution to this problem would have to ensure that when using only your pets you have a high DPS but when you are using another weapon your pets damage is anecdotal enough not to turn the tide in battle, merely give a slight edge and a tank.

After thinking about how this could be achieved I decided that having an item that a CH would have to equip to use the full power of their pets which could not be equipped at the same time as any weapon. My only idea for what this item could be is a whip.

Now you wouldn’t *need* this item to use your pets. It is my vision that when not using the item pets have a DPS relative to their current DPS, it wont change the tide of a battle but it helps. With improved defences you would still have a tank and a little extra DPS than your support combat profession alone, which would be very helpful in PvE.

Now if you use the whip you would be able to command you pets to use various special attacks. There would need to be a much larger variety of specials than there currently is and each pet should be able to learn more than 2 (5 from a choice of 10 maybe?) These special moves would have dmg modifiers, some might have AP and others could induce states, KDs, PDs, as well as poisons and diseases. Lower level pets would have lower level specials and maybe not the maximum number to choose from. Without the whip equipped you could still issue commands such as attack, follow, stay etc. Just not special attack commands.

The whip itself could be made by artisans (CHs have no skills that suggest they could make such an item) and would have no effect on combat skills. It could have modifiers to taming vicious creatures as that is logical but so long as it has no mods to combat I’d be happy. The resource requirements would be very simply. Leathery Hide for the whip with some metal for the handle in small quantities.

My logic behind this idea is that when you are concentrating on aiming your rifle, or lugging that sword around, you aren’t concentrating fully on controlling your pets however their loyalty to you would make them stand by your side and fight with you. If you concentrate on your pets you can help them to fight more effectively but wouldn’t be able to concentrate well enough to hold that pistol steady.

I feel this offers a solution to pets not being viable on their own and still lets players fight alongside their pets. I feel that you should still be able to heal and use other similar actions whilst you have the whip equipped, I would expect this could make CH a bit more powerful than other combat professions (bar hybrid) but we do invest a few extra skill points to master.

What do you guys think of this?

(obviously all this should be relative to other combat professions after the CU)

Are there official lists of what proffesions are combat and what are support? If CH is a support class in the dev's eyes then this post is kinda pointless

I have allways thought of CH as a combat class (you use it in combat after all) which had alot of fun non combat/crafting gameplay with it. I was also under the impression that the nerf way back when brought pets inline with the CU vision meaning that CH would be viable solo afterwards, my concern is that this would lead to a similar situation as that that led to the nerf so I came up with this idea that could prevent that and, hopefully, keep everybody happy at the same time.

I get the impresion that people have decided CH *should* be a support class simply becuase the nerf meant that it is all CH is really good for in the current system.

Message Edited by Combat_Medic_to_be on 03-12-2005 09:18 PM

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theorb22 wrote:

162 SP does not a support proffesion make, except for maybe SL but they don't count because so many of their skills are broken that it's hard to tell how powerful they would be if their proffesion was actually working.

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lol..let the one stars fly(honestly i don't really pay attention to those, your point would be more effective if you made a post)...so orb, how is ch a combat profession? if it wasn't listed as one, would you think it is?..i love the profession for the content, and it is great support for rifles, but as combat on it's own?..i just don't see it..i gladly use the 162 sp for the priviledge to play ch..to hunt and tame the rares, but in no way do i, or did i ever consider it a combat profession. i am post nerf however, so apparently it was a very srtong combat profession, but it seems a lot of people are still hung up on that, possibly i would be too, but ch is what it is, a fun profession , but not a combat ...

The only reason I can think of for you feeling CH shouldn't be viable as a solo combat proffesion is that atm it simply isnt good enough to be one. The ideas I put forward are what I feel could make CH viable solo but not overpowering when used alongside another combat proffesion. I agree, it is still a very fun proffesion in it's current state but it is a combat proffesion because you can use it to fight in combat and because of that I feel CH chould be as powerful as it once was (relatively speaking) but the problem then was that you could use it's full power at the same as another fully fledged combat proffesion. My idea would allow CH to be viable on its own and still allow people to fight alongside their pets without being overpowered.

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chumanatotanka wrote:

...........sometimes they are more trouble than support.I dint get CH to support me as a master fencer.I dont think most of us are asking for super pets.just some much needed changes...for the good not the bad.and if its just for support then make it easier to get MCH and make it easier to get rare pets and so on.....

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i think the only people who want rares easier to find, are those that don't have the rares...believe me once you get them after searching for an extended period, you don't want to see a new mch say " i got 2 bull rancors..are they rare??"...the bull ,the wild dune boar, and the death'shead are the only ones i've only tamed once..don't want to get this very good thread off topic, but rarity is fine, with the possible exception of the frenzied graul

The only reason I can think of for you feeling CH shouldn't be viable as a solo combat proffesion is that atm it simply isnt good enough to be one. The ideas I put forward are what I feel could make CH viable solo but not overpowering when used alongside another combat proffesion. I agree, it is still a very fun proffesion in it's current state but it is a combat proffesion because you can use it to fight in combat and because of that I feel CH chould be as powerful as it once was (relatively speaking) but the problem then was that you could use it's full power at the same as another fully fledged combat proffesion. My idea would allow CH to be viable on its own and still allow people to fight alongside their pets without being overpowered.

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hossp wrote:

you hit the nail on ther had though as the resaon pets do not deal damage is 2 combat professions are too strong...now let me ask you this...as a CM, could you throw disease/poisons while your pets were dealing damage?

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I see no reason why not. Both using pet specials and throwing poisons/diseases would create an item in the combat queue but seeing as you can use CM and Doctor items with any other weapon (just stop attacking while you do it) I see no reason why pets couldnt be used to their fullest extent while using medical items so long as using the medical items has the same sort of effect on CH specials as it does to other combat proffesion specials. You could argue that using poisons and diseases increases your DPS while you are using your weapon but CM is a hybrid proffesion with a high SP cost so I think that this ability is fair when compared to their SP cost.

Message Edited by theorb22 on 03-13-2005 02:54 PM

Actually to show how pathetically weak the typical creature is....

Yesterday I came across a Graul Mauler baby. I had deleated my pair of GMs when I was regrinding CH becuase they were useless for gaing CHxp they were too powerful.

So I go to tame the baby and it ends up attacking a Fierce picket protector that aggroed one of the adults.

Now it is 1 FPP vs 5 GM's + 1 baby. I had to wait 5 min for the battle to be over.
It should have been a slaughter, Instead it was a slow pathetic battle.