Creature Handler Archive
Thread: Petition: MASTER CH'S WANT ALL CREATURES UNDER 70 TAMABLE
TivoTenook wrote:
ok, im probably one of the very few people that would respond KINDLY to your posts...so you know what, you need to take a few days on the beaches of naboo and drink some lemonaide man. geeze
Yes, I do.
I wasn't targeting your post directly, just making general statements about all of the comments in this thread.
Ko-aIri wrote:
For Ackis, and anyone interested in a bit of constructive discussion:
This thread has a fairly simple goal, IMO: To determine what creatures are not spawning babies, and then to determine WHY this is the case. Is this as intended? If so, why is this the intent?
Thunderheart posted on behalf of the devs quite a while back before this rebalance, and stated that creatures CL 50 and under WITHOUT babies would be the EXCEPTION and not the RULE. He then further stated that MOST creatures CL 51-70 would have babies, they would just be considered rare, some would be ultra-rare, some would be mega-ultra-rare.
He also stated the rebalance was designed to balance out the statistics of creatures to be more in line with a fair and balanced game. Gone would be medium armor from a tamable pet, hence the de-valuing of pets like the Arachne Webmaster. Fine, fair. No wild creature below CL 75 has medium armor, in fact I think it's limited to 100+. So, we're also not generally fighting "uber" creatures except with a group, so it's not that big a deal.
At any rate, at this moment a bio-engineer is able to make ANY pet they see fit below CL 70 and a CH can use it. This pet may have statistics including resists up to 100% in all categories except kinetic and energy, in which case we are hard-capped at 60%, with light armor. The reason those are hard capped is for balance in PvE and PvP, I would assume. Energy is one of the most common damage types in PvP and PvE against NPCs, and kinetic is THE most common in PvE. Also, be it by bug or design, a BE cannot make special attacks like Force Strike (KD/Dizzy in one hit) Plague Strike (150 point AoE disease), Open Wounds (150 point AoE disease) or Poison Spray (150 point AoE poison), just to name a few, stick on a clone. Those are reserved for rare tames, like the Mantigrue Screecher (Plague Strike) or an extinct, like the Frenzied Graul (Open Wounds). There has been NO response if this is intended by design or just a bug for BEs (after all, the DNA samples still show the special attack, it just NEVER EVER will make it to the final combine), but I can only assume it is to help fill each niche market. The BEs can make pets will most special attacks, but a few special attacks require a rare tame. Mostly fair... assuming we can tame something with those attacks. However, only a couple with those attacks exist as pets, and a couple special attacks are represented NOWHERE in the current tamables.
Currently, only an extinct pet exceeds the hard cap for kinetic resists, the Frenzied Graul. It is capped at 65% kinetic, making it the best pure tank available, if only by a whopping 5%. However, only the very fortunate (having had the foresight and longevity of play to have tamed and kept one pre-September 2003) or very wealthy (having the 5+ million credits to afford one) may have this pet. It is simply extinct to all others, and as the vitality goes down on the current population, will become totally extinct or so valuable as to be completely un-attainable.
However, there is a CURRENTLY TAMABLE but rather rare pet, the Rhoa Kwi Pack Leader, which has 65% energy resists with light armor. So, it's a bonus over a non-BE pet, something a CH can only get through hard work of finding and taming. But why does this exist if the Frenzied does not? Why can I tame a pet with 65% energy yet not 65% kinetic? And no, the Prowling Gurreck doesn't count, because while it has 65% kinetic and 65% energy resists, it does not have light armor, so the resists are still weaker.
Regardless, if you will look at the list of requested extincts, you will see that none of those pets have medium armor. In fact, most of the pets have very comparable stats to what exist as tamables/creatables now. It's just that for a great many of us who have stuck with the profession, we'd like the opportunity to have these pets in our datapad, or to use the ones we have without fear of never being able to get another one. I'd say 99% of people who have the extincts do nothing with them except pull them out at the starport and go, "Look, I have one." This is a shame, for most are exceptional pets that deserve to be used. But if I know I can never replace it, would I really use it and risk vitality loss? Not likely.
And for some of the "extincts/no babies," I can make an EXACT COPY with my bio-engineer. A Seething Bol Crusher, for example, can be directly sampled, combined, cloned and copied and stuck in a bol body and tamed from the deed form and used. But I can't go out and tame one. Why is this? Obviously not for balance, it can't be too strong or else I wouldn't be able to make it. So, one starts to believe there is a bit of oversight, someone didn't flip the ON switch to make babies pop. Or something larger at work. But we never have had a direct response to this issue until today, and we're still waiting to hear back on what Thunderheart finds out.
The balance was supposed to make everything the correct CL for its power. If the job was done correctly, and I fully believe it has, no creature CL 70 or less would be an unbalanced pet to be used in the game by a CH. If it's unbalanced as a pet, the CL would be 71+, and there would be NO argument from any creature handler here about it. We can't have a mutant rancor no matter how much we want, because it is CL 75. You don't see us asking for those. All we are asking for is what would seem to make sense, or an explanation why it does not make sense. Hopefully, we will now be getting our answers.
TivoTenook wrote:
I have had it up to here (points to the sky) with the ridiculous fact that there are undeniablly no babies for the following species, and we want them back (some never had babies but definately should):
- frenzied graul
- ancient graul
- merek harvester
- king/queen merek harvester
- blood-drenched merek king
- arachne queen
- mantigrue reaper
- bark mite burrower
- bark mite burrower queen
- thune herd leader
- kliknik queen
- seething bol crusher
- fierce piket protector
- slinking voritor hunter
- horned voritor lizard
- surefoot brackaset
There is no reason why these creatures should not be spawning babies and I'm sick of it. WE DEMAND THESE CREATURES BACK RIGHT NOW. This is not about the debate between BEs and CHs, this is the plain and simple fact that these creatures SHOULD be spawning babies.
If you agree with this, sign here...That is all.
(one last thing: if any DEV happens to read this, please be aware that if these are supposed to be spawning babies, they are not. it has been 2 months since the december patch and no one has tamed any that i listed)
Read and compare the two posts. A LOT different. (no offense to Tivo).
I'm tired and have a headache, otherwise I would go through and write a more detailed post, but the above sentance gives the jist of it.
Thunderheart wrote:
Vertexon had mentioned this to me. At this time I'm not going to assume that they are truly extinct, but I will speak work with the producers to find out if anything might be wrong. If it is simply a matter of these creatures spawning too rarely, Ill see if anything can be done.
Thunderheart wrote:
Vertexon had mentioned this to me. At this time I'm not going to assume that they are truly extinct, but I will speak work with the producers to find out if anything might be wrong. If it is simply a matter of these creatures spawning too rarely, Ill see if anything can be done.
2 months and 212 lairs mind you, and no Bull Rancor babies...
wookieboy02 wrote:
thnx for your reply, but this is not a droid debate. try the DE forum. ty.
Look at the title though. CH's DEMAND the extincts back (in yelling of course).
I'll reitterate my previous point (which no one seems to have read ) that:
- Right now there's a lot of diversity for CHs
- The pets were most likely removed for a reason (game unbalancing?)
Now, with a little cynicism, I can say that I know CHs will get more down the road because the devs love their class compared with DEs, but to demand it and then have 7/8 pages (currently) of people signing it?
All that was proposed for this petition was that WE WANT THESE **edit** PETS BACK!!! Cavemangamer made a good point in saying basically that you don't get much bang for your buck for variety as you advance up the levels, however there is a flaw in that. You get other things as you advance up the levels. Taming abilities, etc. which corrosponds nicely with most of the other classes out there (ie: combat where you get one or two certs, some mods, or special attacks). As well, this thread is directed at what Master CH's want, not those grinding up the profession.
I still don't really see a valid reason why CH's need more pets right now, given the entire selection you have now.
Ackis wrote:
wookieboy02 wrote:
thnx for your reply, but this is not a droid debate. try the DE forum. ty.
Look at the title though. CH's DEMAND the extincts back (in yelling of course).
I'll reitterate my previous point (which no one seems to have read
- Right now there's a lot of diversity for CHs
- The pets were most likely removed for a reason (game unbalancing?)
Now, with a little cynicism, I can say that I know CHs will get more down the road because the devs love their class compared with DEs, but to demand it and then have 7/8 pages (currently) of people signing it?
All that was proposed for this petition was that WE WANT THESE **edit** PETS BACK!!! Cavemangamer made a good point in saying basically that you don't get much bang for your buck for variety as you advance up the levels, however there is a flaw in that. You get other things as you advance up the levels. Taming abilities, etc. which corrosponds nicely with most of the other classes out there (ie: combat where you get one or two certs, some mods, or special attacks). As well, this thread is directed at what Master CH's want, not those grinding up the profession.
I still don't really see a valid reason why CH's need more pets right now, given the entire selection you have now.
And we'll reiterate our previous points of GO AND TROLL ELSEWHERE. This is NOT the DE forum nor does what we are asking/demanding have anything to do with you or impact your business/profession. This is specifically calling out TH and previous comments made that state that pets without babies would be the EXCEPTION. Please go back to ranting in your own forum.
"I still don't really see a valid reason why CH's need more pets right now, given the entire selection you have now."
Think of having 50 different colors of MSE driods.....thats pretty much what we have right now. Try CH and you'll see what I mean.
"This issue would effect the whole game, because before you had **edit** wars and now you don't (step in the right direction). Giving ultra-uber pets to CHs again would be going back to where it was before, and result in another nerf to the CH profession down the road."
P o k e m o n wars vs mech wars. The pets listed arent ultra and uber pets. They are better than some things in the wild but worse than others.....with the rebalancing" they are far from ultra and uber.
You also said that DE is a logical comparison to CH because it's the only other class that has "pets".
To compare the two is virtually impossible. Maybe DE to BE. Both can build "pets". However your creations serve a different purpose. I havent tried butI seriously doubt I will be able to experiment on something just because I have my GSP out and healing wounds using my Rancor wont happen. Just as I wouldnt send my surgical driod in to tank on abaz nitchlair. The purpose of pets and the purpose of driods is totally different.
I'm not flaming you by any means but when you come in the thread basically saying you guys shouldnt get this because my profession is borked and expect not to get some hostile responses that is just insane. These pets arent uber by any means. They are extinct. They are something we used to have and no longer do. Their stats arent any better than alot of other things we can tame. In all honesty they are just cool pets. Like tivo said...there really is no reason they should not be spawning babies. But to base an argument that they shouldnt spawn because driod engineer is still buggy and limited is neither valid nor correct. If you have a valid reason why they shouldnt spawn then i would be more than happy to hear it. Basing it on"game balance" doesnt cut it. Like I said before...there are other things that have better stats, have better specials, and do more damage than the pets on this list. I do understand the fact that you want a better selection of driods with other uses however the CH forums are not the place to get something done about it.