Commando Archive
Thread: Commando to be flat on our backs....again....
StarNick wrote:
Yeah the new healing costs are something fierce, and is a troubling concern being discussed on a few forums here...
People complained about healing being unbalanced in relation to Jedi (I'm not going to go into a diatribe about this since it isnt the Jedi forums)...So they made the heals stronger by simply increasing the numbers....Nevermind, that there is a mind cost to each heal, and ALREADY a slight action cost (same as there was a slight mind cost to firing a weapon)....
So to try and balance healing, rather than tweak the actual healing numbers, the institute an action cost to healing? Where is the balance in that?
Actionso thatyou can fire, recovery from KD.
Mind so that you can heal your health.
It WAS balanced.
Now action is getting saddled with firing your weapons/swinging your melee weapon, recovering from KD, AND healing???
It makes no sense. They may as well remove the mind bar, and have only Health and Action.
Message Edited by RankorCity on 10-10-2005 06:49 PM
Raptor2k1 wrote:
On the positive side, this means that it'll be a lot easier for a pure combat commando to take out a healer hybrid...
A healer hybrid, that can rather easy, despite action cost, can still outheal the damage we can dish out, while we as pure combatants, have no way to outheal their damage.
Because the damage dished out, is not related to how pure combat you are, but your CL 54 gun and your "CL 54" specials. That is why healer hybrids are working so well in PvE and PvP.
You dish out almost the same damage as a healer hybrid as a pure combatant. Until they correct that, the one with the healing hybrid, wins. Despite actioncost of heals.
Wolfmann31 wrote:
Raptor2k1 wrote:
On the positive side, this means that it'll be a lot easier for a pure combat commando to take out a healer hybrid...
A healer hybrid, that can rather easy, despite action cost, can still outheal the damage we can dish out, while we as pure combatants, have no way to outheal their damage.
Because the damage dished out, is not related to how pure combat you are, but your CL 54 gun and your "CL 54" specials. That is why healer hybrids are working so well in PvE and PvP.
You dish out almost the same damage as a healer hybrid as a pure combatant. Until they correct that, the one with the healing hybrid, wins. Despite actioncost of heals.
MatuVonnegut wrote:
Wolfmann31 wrote:
Raptor2k1 wrote:
On the positive side, this means that it'll be a lot easier for a pure combat commando to take out a healer hybrid...
A healer hybrid, that can rather easy, despite action cost, can still outheal the damage we can dish out, while we as pure combatants, have no way to outheal their damage.
Because the damage dished out, is not related to how pure combat you are, but your CL 54 gun and your "CL 54" specials. That is why healer hybrids are working so well in PvE and PvP.
You dish out almost the same damage as a healer hybrid as a pure combatant. Until they correct that, the one with the healing hybrid, wins. Despite actioncost of heals.
I'll agree with that, currently there is no benefit with going combat/combat except more specials. There's suppose to be strengths and weekness depending on the professions you choose right? The only benefit of combat/combat is more specials, unless you're commando. I had to pick up master doc in beta just so i could do stuff, despite the huge number of people i see on there everyone wants to get their quest done and it's insanely difficult to find a group.
would removing DOC from cl lvl's help? Perhaps just a huge increase in mind cost? Or a considerable damage bonus to combat/combat characters?
No. Simple fixes, would toss things more out of balance.
Make healers heal less, and you nerf PvE so much that it's unplayable, because mobs are balanced to the current "healing" setup so to speak.
Make healers go out of action or mind, and you do the same. PvE is still balanced in the way of damage, regeneration and ham, of to how much damage we can withstand before the mob die.
Make Combat/combat do more damage, and you unbalances PvE, because mobs are balanced in the case of HAM, Regen and damage output, to the "survivability" of a healer and the "damagelevels" that we get. Thus, a combat/combat who gains a increase in damage to balance against healers, will mopp the floor in PvE.
simple fixes, cannot help at this point. they failed, and now we might look at a total system overhaul, because everything needs to be rebalanced if they want it to work.
1. Balance damage output for PvE.
2. Balance healing for PvE
3. balance defenses for PvE
4. balance mobs to new player damage output, healing and defenses vs mob ham, specials, damage, defensesand regeneration.
well commandoes are pretty effective in the right circumstances. But yeah. I dont much like the sounds of the changes to healing when it comes to commandoes in there. For a while I tried straight up damage. MBH/MCom with some pistols for stopping shot.
It worked allright but it just got to the point I was being beat simply because I couldnt keep up in the healing. So I droped the pistols for CM skills. Change the action costs (The mind costs dont really affect me) and it'll really bite. It also seems to me that it'll really hurt smuggler/CMs too (Whcih I have one as well actually) as I found most smuggler specials for waht ever reason also suck up a fair bit of mind. Coupled with CM it gets rather nasty at times. But then unlike any other class I can just paralyze my opponent. Regen, take time to state him up abit. Regen some more and then go back to shooting. Or just run away at that point.
Commando on the other hand. Has none of these options. And I'm rather dubious about the damage increases really balancing us out. But time will tell I suppose. I'm willing to take the changes as they come. And then **modbot** about what needs to be fixed later on.
Wolfmann31 wrote:
MatuVonnegut wrote:
Wolfmann31 wrote:
Raptor2k1 wrote:
On the positive side, this means that it'll be a lot easier for a pure combat commando to take out a healer hybrid...
A healer hybrid, that can rather easy, despite action cost, can still outheal the damage we can dish out, while we as pure combatants, have no way to outheal their damage.
Because the damage dished out, is not related to how pure combat you are, but your CL 54 gun and your "CL 54" specials. That is why healer hybrids are working so well in PvE and PvP.
You dish out almost the same damage as a healer hybrid as a pure combatant. Until they correct that, the one with the healing hybrid, wins. Despite actioncost of heals.
I'll agree with that, currently there is no benefit with going combat/combat except more specials. There's suppose to be strengths and weekness depending on the professions you choose right? The only benefit of combat/combat is more specials, unless you're commando. I had to pick up master doc in beta just so i could do stuff, despite the huge number of people i see on there everyone wants to get their quest done and it's insanely difficult to find a group.
would removing DOC from cl lvl's help? Perhaps just a huge increase in mind cost? Or a considerable damage bonus to combat/combat characters?
No. Simple fixes, would toss things more out of balance.
Make healers heal less, and you nerf PvE so much that it's unplayable, because mobs are balanced to the current "healing" setup so to speak.
Make healers go out of action or mind, and you do the same. PvE is still balanced in the way of damage, regeneration and ham, of to how much damage we can withstand before the mob die.
Make Combat/combat do more damage, and you unbalances PvE, because mobs are balanced in the case of HAM, Regen and damage output, to the "survivability" of a healer and the "damagelevels" that we get. Thus, a combat/combat who gains a increase in damage to balance against healers, will mopp the floor in PvE.
simple fixes, cannot help at this point. they failed, and now we might look at a total system overhaul, because everything needs to be rebalanced if they want it to work.
1. Balance damage output for PvE.
2. Balance healing for PvE
3. balance defenses for PvE
4. balance mobs to new player damage output, healing and defenses vs mob ham, specials, damage, defensesand regeneration.
5. Cry in a corner, because you now need to balance PvP to the above.
MatuVonnegut wrote:
Wolfmann31 wrote:
MatuVonnegut wrote:
Wolfmann31 wrote:
Raptor2k1 wrote:
On the positive side, this means that it'll be a lot easier for a pure combat commando to take out a healer hybrid...
A healer hybrid, that can rather easy, despite action cost, can still outheal the damage we can dish out, while we as pure combatants, have no way to outheal their damage.
Because the damage dished out, is not related to how pure combat you are, but your CL 54 gun and your "CL 54" specials. That is why healer hybrids are working so well in PvE and PvP.
You dish out almost the same damage as a healer hybrid as a pure combatant. Until they correct that, the one with the healing hybrid, wins. Despite actioncost of heals.
I'll agree with that, currently there is no benefit with going combat/combat except more specials. There's suppose to be strengths and weekness depending on the professions you choose right? The only benefit of combat/combat is more specials, unless you're commando. I had to pick up master doc in beta just so i could do stuff, despite the huge number of people i see on there everyone wants to get their quest done and it's insanely difficult to find a group.
would removing DOC from cl lvl's help? Perhaps just a huge increase in mind cost? Or a considerable damage bonus to combat/combat characters?
No. Simple fixes, would toss things more out of balance.
Make healers heal less, and you nerf PvE so much that it's unplayable, because mobs are balanced to the current "healing" setup so to speak.
Make healers go out of action or mind, and you do the same. PvE is still balanced in the way of damage, regeneration and ham, of to how much damage we can withstand before the mob die.
Make Combat/combat do more damage, and you unbalances PvE, because mobs are balanced in the case of HAM, Regen and damage output, to the "survivability" of a healer and the "damagelevels" that we get. Thus, a combat/combat who gains a increase in damage to balance against healers, will mopp the floor in PvE.
simple fixes, cannot help at this point. they failed, and now we might look at a total system overhaul, because everything needs to be rebalanced if they want it to work.
1. Balance damage output for PvE.
2. Balance healing for PvE
3. balance defenses for PvE
4. balance mobs to new player damage output, healing and defenses vs mob ham, specials, damage, defensesand regeneration.
5. Cry in a corner, because you now need to balance PvP to the above.
in this case then adding action costs was the quickest and easiest way to even things out. with heals taking action now, when you're fighting that person their damage output has now been cut in a similar way that combat/combat heal output is cut. This should work fine. I'll enjoy laughing at all the docs that don't have as big an advantage anymore.
How about combat/combat getting a boost to the action bar the way the health bar is increased. That way, a heal hybrid willstill use a normal amount of action for just attacks and mind for heals, whereas a pure fighter can keep up with heavy-hitting specials. This seems to be a little closer to tactics and playstyle flexibility--ironman vs. boxing.
Message Edited by BloodMonk on 10-12-2005 10:14 AM