Commando Archive
Thread: My take on a New Star Wars Commando (LONGwinded post)
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Warmaker01
Tue Oct 04, 2005 2:30 am
#1
It hit me rather recently that some of us, including myself, have always thought of SWG's Commando profession to be something similiar to Special Operations (like SAS, SEALS, etc.). In Star Wars terms, something like Rebel SpecOps Commandos or Imperial Storm Commandos.
Even though we have thought of SWG Commando to be like these Star Wars units, exactly how would we do it? What would the basic theme of a Master Commando in this mold would be? We haven't touched upon it, and here's my random insane thought on the matter. And, whatever snowball's chance in hell that the devs take this ball and run with it. It took me a LONG time to put this together, and hopefully I don't look like I've fallen off the Commando Deep-End. It's not fully tweaked out but I balanced it out as best I could.
So, here I go:
** Drastic change in Prerequisites; MUCH steeper.
--- Master Marksman (All around knowledge with small arms)
--- Scout 4004 (Terrain Negotiation for quick movements in rough terrain; Survival skills in remote locations, deep in enemy controlled territory)
--- With the Novice Commando Box attained, it leaves 124 Skill Points left over. With Master Commando, it leaves 67 Skill Points left over.
** Basic theme of the Star Wars Spec.Ops Commando.
--- Good accuracy; Focus on HEAVY damage (due to heavy training and extensive weapons knowledge).
--- Poor, poor Defense. The one thing Special Operations hate to get into, even in the real world, is a dragged out fight. Special Operations must hit hard and fast. Take out the immediate targets, accomplish the mission, and get out of town. Sticking around and getting into prolonged fights is generally bad. Having poor defenses makes sure the new SWG Commando follows this theme. It also balances out the HEAVY damage that I'm hoping for.
--- Excellent Meshing with the rest of the Elite Ranged Professions. Squad Leader would compliment Master Commando well for the Spec.Ops Team Leader. With Master Commando, enough SPs to Master either Pistoleer, Rifleman, Carbineer, or Squad Leader.
-*-*- Of concern is also being Master Commando / Master Bounty Hunter. Even with my newer, steeper Prerequisites for Commando, mastering both professions is still barely possible (4 sps left). That combination of good defenses (MBH) and hitting power / accuracy (MCommando) would be balanced out the same way all Pure Combat Templates are: No SPs left for ANY healing skill boxes, not even Novice Medic.
-*-*- Of concern is also being Master Commando / Master Bounty Hunter. Even with my newer, steeper Prerequisites for Commando, mastering both professions is still barely possible (4 sps left). That combination of good defenses (MBH) and hitting power / accuracy (MCommando) would be balanced out the same way all Pure Combat Templates are: No SPs left for ANY healing skill boxes, not even Novice Medic.
--- Mobility in rough terrain. Proficient in guerilla warfare / counter-insurgency / insurgency operations due to excellentmobility compared to normal Imperial / Rebel troops.
--- In the Post-CU era of SWG, melee / ranged combinations do not compliment each other well. The current prerequisite of Unarmed IV doesn't really do anything useful.
--- My version of Commando can be a damage dealer but requires other professions to flesh it out. It will make it truly a "tool box profession' but the requirements are steep. Carbineers, Pistoleers, Riflemen, and even Bounty Hunters will benefit some.
--- Healing templates with decent defenses are extremely powerful right now. The damage dealing of Commando will "offset" this.
--- A true Master Commando template will be heavy hitting. But to be truly effective, the Commando needs to get mods / specials from the other Elite Ranged Profession(s). This sucks away alot of SPs from other things such as healing skill boxes. It also balances out the profession some more.
** New SWG Commando Profession Breakdown & Summary. Tree Titles in Parenthesis:
- Prerequisites: Master Marksman / Scout 4004
- 124 SPs left at Novice Commando. 67 SPs left at Master Commando
NOTE: Carbine, Rifle, and Pistol Weapon Mods are scattered throughout the Commando Profession. Even at Master Commando, the total ___ Weapon Mods will never come close to a Master ___'s total Weapon Specific Mods. The Master Commando however will be proficient in many types of weapons, but to truly excel in a type, he needs to master those specific professions.
(For Rebels: Novice SpecOps Commando / For Neutrals: Novice Commando / For Imperials: Novice Storm Commando).
- Regular Assault Armor Certification.
-- Certification to Rebel SpecOps Assault Armor (not really sure how it should look like) for Rebels. Neutrals get Certification to a relic set of Old Republic Clonetrooper Katarn Armor (from the Republic Commando game). Imperials get certification to Storm Commando armor. Your Faction Affiliation affects which of these 3 special armors you can be equipped. These armors fall under the "Assault Armor" classification / mod usage.
- Several Novice Elite Ranged Profession Specials are placed here to get the Novice Commando going. No further "specials" are given. The better specials will remain with the specific Elite Ranged Professions, which can be improved upon by Commando.
-- Special: Body Shot (Pistol)
-- Special: Leg Shot (Carbine)
-- Special: Head Shot (Rifle)
- Regular Assault Armor Certification.
-- Certification to Rebel SpecOps Assault Armor (not really sure how it should look like) for Rebels. Neutrals get Certification to a relic set of Old Republic Clonetrooper Katarn Armor (from the Republic Commando game). Imperials get certification to Storm Commando armor. Your Faction Affiliation affects which of these 3 special armors you can be equipped. These armors fall under the "Assault Armor" classification / mod usage.
- Several Novice Elite Ranged Profession Specials are placed here to get the Novice Commando going. No further "specials" are given. The better specials will remain with the specific Elite Ranged Professions, which can be improved upon by Commando.
-- Special: Body Shot (Pistol)
-- Special: Leg Shot (Carbine)
-- Special: Head Shot (Rifle)
Tree 1 (Demolitionist): Requires Combat XPs. Melee & Ranged Defense Mods spaced here. Also, "Demolitions Preparation" mods are found here, but most of the mod is at Master Commando. The mod, with higher values, lessens the time it takes for a Commando to prepare a XC-42 Demolition Charge and lessens the reacharge timer for the PC-30 Heavy Proton Charge. Remember, even with Master Commando, these timers will still be long.
Tree 2 (Shock Trooper): Requires Carbine XPs. Grants Carbine Accuracy & Speed. Very small damage multipliers are added gradually to the Commando's Carbine Specials.
Tree 3 (Designated Marksman): Requires Rifle XPs. Grants Rifle Accuracy & Speed. Very small damage multipliers are added gradually to the Commando's Rifle Specials.
Tree 4 (Assault Team Member): Requires Pistol XPs. Grants Pistol Accuracy & Speed. Very small damage multipliers are added gradually to the Commando's Pistol Specials.
Master Commando (For Rebels: Alliance SpecOps Commando / For Neutrals: Master Commando / For Imperials: Imperial Storm Commando).
- The last, great chunks of all of Commando's Mods are found here. This is in particularly true for the "Demolitions Preparatoin" mods and Special Weapons Mods.
- Small Burst Run Efficiency and Terrain Negotiation Mods are added here.
- The last, big chunks of Assault Armor Mods fall here.
- The last, significant bonus damage multipliers are given to the Commando's various Carbine, Pistol, and Rifle Specials.Exactly how much total? As much as it takes to make the specials hurt good enough with a Master Commando / Master ___ Ranged Profession. Enough to make Commando rate the "5" Damage rating.
- The last, great chunks of all of Commando's Mods are found here. This is in particularly true for the "Demolitions Preparatoin" mods and Special Weapons Mods.
- Small Burst Run Efficiency and Terrain Negotiation Mods are added here.
- The last, big chunks of Assault Armor Mods fall here.
- The last, significant bonus damage multipliers are given to the Commando's various Carbine, Pistol, and Rifle Specials.Exactly how much total? As much as it takes to make the specials hurt good enough with a Master Commando / Master ___ Ranged Profession. Enough to make Commando rate the "5" Damage rating.
Mods scattered about the 4 Commando Trees:
Thrown Weapon Accuracy & Speed Mods.
Special Weapons Accuracy & Speed Mods.
Assault Armor Mods.
Thrown Weapon Accuracy & Speed Mods.
Special Weapons Accuracy & Speed Mods.
Assault Armor Mods.
** New Commando Weapons (all of which Weaponsmith Craftable, naturally. None of this "loot" c**p for the time being... support your favorite Weaponsmith)
--- For the sake of time, I didn't dive into Master Commando Carbines, Pistols, Rifles. But the general theme of these is that though they will require a Master Commando certification, they will still use Weapon Specific Mods for effective usage. In the same lines as the current Dawnsorrow Rifle... an MSL weapon but Rifle mods needed.
--- For the sake of time, I didn't dive into Master Commando Carbines, Pistols, Rifles. But the general theme of these is that though they will require a Master Commando certification, they will still use Weapon Specific Mods for effective usage. In the same lines as the current Dawnsorrow Rifle... an MSL weapon but Rifle mods needed.
Explosives and grenades will further the damage capability of the Commando.
--- Grenades need to be improved, however.
--- Grenades need to be improved, however.
--- 2 varieties of Explosives, all of which are craftable (Weaponsmith LOVE!):
- Blastech PC-30 Heavy Proton Charges (not to be confused with the Proton Grenades) with VERY short throwing ranges (<10m) and less than a 5 second timer before it blows in a very wide blast radius (slightly larger than the Proton Grenade) that does not distinguish between friend and foe. Quality of the charge of course influences the resulting effects. VERY LONG recharge timer (a minute?) to prevent Proton Charges from flying all over the place every second or so. Devastating to Heavy Equipment such as turrets, vehicles, walkers. Comes only as a single, consumeable item. Uses "Demolitions Preparation" mods.
- Blastech XC-42 Demolition Charges. Not thrown but must be set up, which requires a Commando to be stationary (in any position). A Commando who has been incapped / killed before the Demolition Charge is fully prepared will stop the timer. A friendly Commando with the proper skill can take over the work from there. A Commando who has been Knocked Down gets penalized by requiring even more time to prepare the explosives. An opposing Commando can approach the Demo.Charge and use his "Demolitions Preparation" mods to disarm it, but it also requires some time. The explosive can be set to go off via timer (10 sec - 30 sec - 1 min - 5 min intervals) or by remote. If by remote, then a Popup window with a button will appear. Hit the button, and BOOM! The radius is as large as the PC-30 Hvy.Proton Charge, but much, much more devastating. Capable of destroying an AT-ST and any turret smaller than a Large Turret with a single Demo Charge. Large Turrets require 2. The blast does not differentiate between friendly and enemies. Comes only as a single, consumeable item. Uses "Demolitions Preparation" mods.
- Merr-Sonn Munitions' PLX-3sop Rocket Launcher. Heck, you can use the current Rocket Launcher graphics for it, I don't care!
While the PLX-2 series of Missile Launchers originated from the Clone Wars, they have continued in the age of the Empire with the newer, advanced PLX-2M for standard, reliable battlefield usage. The PLX-3sop was developed in the very early development stages of the Imperial Storm Commando Program, headed by Crix Madine. The various heavy demolitions required a trooper to be in very short or "in your face" ranges to use, which can be hazardous to a man's health. While the PLX-2 series of Missile Launchers have served general military usage excellently, they are far too heavy for the speed and mobility required of Madine's vision of the Storm Commando. Merr-Sonn Munitions was called on to develop a smaller, lighter, but less powerful version of their reliable launcher, and they succeeded. The result is the PLX-3sop. Half the size, 1/2 the weight of the current PLX-2M. But it has significantly shorter ranges and half the punch of the full version. Still, it provides light troops with a decent means of light anti-armor capability at a safe distance. Of major significance is that the -3sop is now a Rocket Launcher instead of a Missile Launcher... it has no guidance system for nearly sure hits. New, smaller warheads were developed for the PLX-3sop. Several different types were put in production: High Explosive Dual Purpose Warheads (standard explosive; anti-armor capable); Acid Splash Warheads (acid damage... duh!); the Proton warheads (energy!).
--- The Commando player acquires the PLX-3sop R.Launcher and warheads seperately. The Launcher itself is non-consumeable and has the "permanent mods." The warheads are themselves consumeable and come in stacks of 5. They are loaded into the PLX-3sop as you would a Power Up. The warheads WILL be powerful. There are no CL classed warheads. No PUPs can be placed on the R.Launcher!
--- The Commando player acquires the PLX-3sop R.Launcher and warheads seperately. The Launcher itself is non-consumeable and has the "permanent mods." The warheads are themselves consumeable and come in stacks of 5. They are loaded into the PLX-3sop as you would a Power Up. The warheads WILL be powerful. There are no CL classed warheads. No PUPs can be placed on the R.Launcher!
Some stats for the PLX-3sop R.Launcher itself:
Combat Level Required: None, but requires merely Novice Commando. However, good mods are required for effective usage.
Speed: Very, very slow! Uses Special Weapons Accuracy & Speed Mods, scattered about the Commando profession.
Damage & Damage type: Varies on warhead quality.
Accuracy: Varies. Depends on the Weaponsmith's work, but generally higher Spec.Weapons Mods and shorter ranges help.
Blast Radius: Half the size of most grenade radii. Less if balance needs to come into play. Blast Radius does not distinguish between friend of foe.
States: All warheads cause stun to those in the blast radius. In addition, Standard Warheads can cause a radius Knockdown. Acid Warheads cause a short Blind State. Proton warheads do the same as the standard in states. Just more powerful in damage and a much likelier chance for a KD. The Proton Warheads are also a Master Commando certification.
Combat Level Required: None, but requires merely Novice Commando. However, good mods are required for effective usage.
Speed: Very, very slow! Uses Special Weapons Accuracy & Speed Mods, scattered about the Commando profession.
Damage & Damage type: Varies on warhead quality.
Accuracy: Varies. Depends on the Weaponsmith's work, but generally higher Spec.Weapons Mods and shorter ranges help.
Blast Radius: Half the size of most grenade radii. Less if balance needs to come into play. Blast Radius does not distinguish between friend of foe.
States: All warheads cause stun to those in the blast radius. In addition, Standard Warheads can cause a radius Knockdown. Acid Warheads cause a short Blind State. Proton warheads do the same as the standard in states. Just more powerful in damage and a much likelier chance for a KD. The Proton Warheads are also a Master Commando certification.
Range: 50m maximum. Increasing accuracy penalty at 40m+. Increasing bonus at shorter ranges below 39m. However, the Commando must be aware of the blast radius of his warheads.
______________
Any feedback appreciated guys!
Message Edited by Warmaker01 on 10-04-2005 12:48 PM
"If they can be fooled, they can be killed."
jmonty
Tue Oct 04, 2005 8:31 am
#2
"Special Operations must hit hard and fast. Take out the immediate targets, accomplish the mission, and get out of town."
i couldn't agree more.
great post, thanks for the detailed idea. wonderfull ideas, ihopethey are read by someone in charge of the game.
RoastyToasty
Tue Oct 04, 2005 9:33 am
#3
great ideas. This would be an awesome revamp (it gives Commando's damage and is still versitile enough to let you make most any commando out there.) The only thing is it makes Commando's purely ranged, which isn't too bad of an idea IMO. The high SP cost is very balancing as long as the Damage of those explosives and the RL are worth it. Additional weapon specific mods is a great idea to power up another profession, but the same could be done with general mods like a BH. Just like Bh, scatter them throughout the trees in 2's, 3's and fives so no one tree of Commando can be cherry picked. This makes MBH/MCommando a true expert with any weapon, but like you said, sacrifices healing. Drop defenses a bit like you said, and we have a balanced ranged offensively minded template. Only bad thing is a lack of a flamethrower, but I would give that up for Good damage and versatility (as well as a good RL like the one you describe).
JoebyrdWS6
Tue Oct 04, 2005 9:59 am
#4
I agree great ideas i love the high skill point cost as long as it gets rewarded with damage dealing to make up for it although i would remove the 0004 scout requirement as there should be no need for a commando force to spen that much time behind the lines. I also dont like the friendly fire on the rockets or thrown explosives as these would be used in battles where you melee group memebers could be fighting but i do agree that the demo charge should be friendly fire as you could use it to soften hard targets before the actual raid and not in the heat of the battle weapon.
Againwonderful ideas here.
Also I have a post titled MY top 5 fixes/wishes for commando post i have a few ideas in there thatyou might interesting warmaker01.
Warmaker01
Wed Oct 05, 2005 12:30 am
#6
Thanks for the replies guys.
I gave Commando a lot of "Pros" but had to constantly remind myself to put in some "Cons."
What I didn't want was another Alpha Class. I wanted Commando to be different yet extremely useful to the other Ranged Professions. I put in some stiff "Cons" to balance things out.
The common Master Commando templates will be powerful, but it will have the same weakness all Pure-Combat Templates have: No great self-healing ability.
BTW, I dreamt that up in 11pm and posted it up in roughly 2am. I woke up late that day and I had ALOT of Caffeine in the system!
I gave Commando a lot of "Pros" but had to constantly remind myself to put in some "Cons."
What I didn't want was another Alpha Class. I wanted Commando to be different yet extremely useful to the other Ranged Professions. I put in some stiff "Cons" to balance things out.
The common Master Commando templates will be powerful, but it will have the same weakness all Pure-Combat Templates have: No great self-healing ability.
BTW, I dreamt that up in 11pm and posted it up in roughly 2am. I woke up late that day and I had ALOT of Caffeine in the system!
Message Edited by Warmaker01 on 10-04-2005 12:32 PM
Tyyylowyspetily
Wed Oct 05, 2005 12:39 am
#7
Nice post. The background work on star warsEU weapons technology was entertaining.I can't help but think that when Rangers do get their revamp, there will be a mass exodus of commandos that have this vision of our prosession. I'm still on the fence myself with that, since I had a similar idea of what a "commando" ought to be. The spec ops profession which will concentrate on lightning strikes, hit and fade operations will likely be Ranger. On the point of a higher pre req to justify greater skills, I don't see the devs re-introducing it anytime soon, nor should we need a higher skill point sink to get the power level we should have right now. All professions save ID will soon have two skill lines as a prereq. Now what they need to do is make commando as useful as BH or Combat Medic.
Warmaker01
Wed Oct 05, 2005 12:45 am
#8
Tyyylowyspetily wrote:
Nice post. The background work on star warsEU weapons technology was entertaining.I can't help but think that when Rangers do get their revamp, there will be a mass exodus of commandos that have this vision of our prosession. I'm still on the fence myself with that, since I had a similar idea of what a "commando" ought to be. The spec ops profession which will concentrate on lightning strikes, hit and fade operations will likely be Ranger. On the point of a higher pre req to justify greater skills, I don't see the devs re-introducing it anytime soon, nor should we need a higher skill point sink to get the power level we should have right now. All professions save ID will soon have two skill lines as a prereq. Now what they need to do is make commando as useful as BH or Combat Medic.
I always liked digging into the background of Star Wars.
Blastech is the producer of a wide variety of blasters. Most famously is the E11.
Merr-Sonn is another one in Star Wars lore, and the PLX-2 Missile Launcher can be found in the databank of Starwars.com. The series of this launcher does start in the Clone Wars (the cartoon) and is stated to be still in upgraded service in the Imperial era as the PLX-2m. My PLX-3sop is completely made up, but I used Star Wars background "fluff" as a base for it.
I'll have to get Golan Arms in somewhere. They loved making big guns and weapon systems.
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