Commando Archive
Thread: What's up Commandos...
Warmaker01
Fri Sep 30, 2005 11:09 pm
#92
Helios_SOE wrote:
If, hyptothetically speaking, I were to say "If you could snap your fingers and fix THREE (3) things with your profession right now, what would they be?", you would answer with...
Make Commando match up to the devs' own description of the profession with the Combat Upgrade Documents.
Commando was supposed to be a "5" rated Offensive Profession.
Fixing AOE, IMO, does not bring Commando a "5" Offensive rating. Why? I know the devs will never allow AOE damage to come anywhere close to the damage the original target takes.
My wishes for Commando?
* Ditch most of our target control abilities for the sake of much higher damage. A Carbineer easily outdamages Commando, and Carbineer was supposed to be "Positional Control." Rifleman also suffers from a lack of hitting power, but not as badly as Commando. Increase the effects (damage / states) of Grenades.
* Remove Commando from being essentially an area attack profession. Player groups have grown to RESENT Commandos since the profession is a liability to the group.
* More useful weapons for Master Commando There are only TWO useful Master Commando weapons. Everything else is too weak.
"If they can be fooled, they can be killed."
RankorCity
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:04 am
#93
MsNiL wrote:
3. Add the recoveries...
If the Recoveries are to remain in the game, add them to Commando just as you done to all other combat professions.
FWIW, Commando DOES get KD recovery after much ballyhoo of NOT having it during CU Beta.
SioBabble
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:04 am
#94
1. Give me free SP to be a commando again
2. Kill the level system and the marketing weenies who imposed idiotic deadlines that forced it on the game.
3. AOE attacks that actually mean something
4. Give commandos AT ALL LEVELS the option to use AOE or individually targeted attacks, so they don't become pariahs in groups.
5. Fix grenades so that they don't give combat XP, but grenade XP, and restore the combat XP ratio at the village as a result.
That's five, but the first two were not commando specific.
RyFord
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:12 am
#95
1. Damage Shots
2. AOE
3. Unarmed Skillpoints removed to allow for a more effective spreading of Skillpoints as Melee provides us no inherent benefit.
Brutus_Krylop
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:12 am
#96
Really, the whole "vision" for Commandos needs to be refined, revamped, or fleshed-out. As it stands right now, what the Commando profession brings to the table is very limited, and the profession just doesn't make much sense in the context of the way the game is played today. The grand experiment of Commando as a "toolbox" profession hasn't worked;it's time to change it.
The Commando profession should, in many ways, mirror the other "successful" hybrid combatprofessions, Bounty Hunter and Combat Medic. Prerequisites should be part of the basic skills that players use in performing the primary functions of their profession. The actual profession skilltree should consist of one "profession defining" line, one line of offensive specials, and two lines of defensive skills / supporting tools. Currently, the Commando profession follows none of that, as its prereqs don't make much sense, and the skilltree just begs for some content. Furthermore, the profession needs to be able to stand-alone, such that a character who had only Master Commando could be combat-effective.
So, how to fix it? I have a suggestion in four steps:
First Step: Define the Profession
"Commando" can mean many things to many people. Are they stealthy, Special Forces types who infiltrate enemy positions and wreak havoc? Are they elite, frontline soldiers?Are they heavy infantry support? All three?
In my opinion, the "Special Forces" and Elite Soldier options make the most sense. When I think of "commandos" in a Star Wars setting, three images come to mind -- Kyle Katarn in Dark Forces, various elite Stormtrooper units, and Canderous Ordo. Aside from being badass fighters, the common characteristics that most come to mindare that they are tough and have all the subtlety of a bantha.
So, I'd say that a Master Commando should be high damage, high ranged defense, moderate melee defense, and minimal crowd control (other than AOEs).
SecondStep:Redesign the Prerequisites
While the idea of a commando having some skill in hand-to-hand combat isn't a big stretch, it simply doesn't work in an era where stacking ranged and melee professions in a single character build is counterproductive. If (and this is a big if) the Commando skillset were upgraded to significantly higher offensive capability with stand-alone combat effectiveness slightly greater than that of a stand-alone elite combat profession, Unarmed IV would be fine. Otherwise, the Commando needs another useful line. Nothing in Scout makes inherent sense, nor would anything in Artisan or Entertainer. What could make sense is Medical Support IV, which would enhance the "toughness" of Commandos, and make some sense in that most elite soldiers have some basic training in first aid.
Ranged Support IV works just fine.
ThirdStep: Redesign the Skill Tree, Include Specials
To correspondwith the other hybrid professions, yet keep the profession offensive-minded, Commando will need a "profession-defining" line, two offensive tactics lines, and a line of defensive / miscellaneous tactics.
For something profession-defining, why not try a new twist on Center of Being / Duelist Stance? Call it "Attack Position" or something, and have it add a significant bonus to speed / accuracy, with a minor penalty to defense or movement.
Offensively, Commandos clearly need both single-target and multiple-target specials. Call them "Focused Fire" and "Strafing Shot," respectively.
Other specials aren't quite as obvious ... something similar to Firearm Strike would make sense, as would ranged knockdowns, "daze / horror" shots, etc. The possibilities are numerous.
Fourth Step: Alter the Weapon Design
Compared to other ranged weapons, heavy weapons are clearly inferior. Remove the inherent AOEs and effects from the heavy weapons; they don't work. That sort of functionality needs to be in the profession specials. There are many good ideas and threads relating to this out there, particularly with respect to the grenades.
RankorCity
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:12 am
#97
Helios,
PLEASE follow up with us on this...I know its not your MO, but too many times we have seen a red letter come in here, post "What Do You Want?", we answer, then they vanish only to be never heard from again 
Our night vision is just fine. We dont need any more carrots dangled in front of us. Our skins have already developed an orange tint...
Respectfully,
RyFord
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:15 am
#98
No offense meant but my first opinion before I addressed 2 issues was that this belongs on the Jedi or BH forums since thats all the devs ever seem to care about 
<3 Helios
Helios_SOE
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:17 am
#99
TheTemplar2 wrote:
1) Better (Full?) AoE damage from weapons (currently it is elemental + 1).
Can someone give me a detailed explanation of this issue along with an example?
Does this defect occur 100% of the time or is it intermittent?
Does it matter what AOE weapon you use?
Does this happen with AOE specials from other professions?
Does this happen with AOE specials from other professions only when you're using one of the commando AOE weapons?
Hedd
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:21 am
#100
We've never had AOE damage. It teases us right after server reset until we cross a zone line and its back to 1+elemental. Its the same with all Heavy Weapons. No it doesn't effect other professions as their AOE is special move based and not innate. AOE specials with a heavy weapon result in nothing more then a normal heavy weapon AOE effect complete with the 1+elemental AOE effect.
Helios_SOE wrote:
TheTemplar2 wrote:
1) Better (Full?) AoE damage from weapons (currently it is elemental + 1).
Can someone give me a detailed explanation of this issue along with an example?
Does this defect occur 100% of the time or is it intermittent?
Does it matter what AOE weapon you use?
Does this happen with AOE specials from other professions?
Does this happen with AOE specials from other professions only when you're using one of the commando AOE weapons?
RyFord
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:26 am
#101
Helios_SOE wrote:
TheTemplar2 wrote:
1) Better (Full?) AoE damage from weapons (currently it is elemental + 1).
Can someone give me a detailed explanation of this issue along with an example?
Does this defect occur 100% of the time or is it intermittent?
Does it matter what AOE weapon you use?
Does this happen with AOE specials from other professions?
Does this happen with AOE specials from other professions only when you're using one of the commando AOE weapons?
Using MOST Commando weapons I do 100% damage to the main target and 1 point of damage to surrounding targets.
Using a Rocket Launcher,Proton Rifle, or The Voidthere is NO AOE.
It has been this way all this time we have no AOE except to apply states which is why we use Smuggler and Pistoleer or Carbineer.
Using Fan Shot does 100% damage to the targeted mob but only 1 damage to the other mobs when you use a Commando Weapon, except Proton Rifle, RL,or Void.
OrianaM
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:27 am
#102
My 2 decicreds
1. Fix AoE
2. Make Grenades worth using (Increase dmg and stack size)
3. Increase damage on the PFT and/or allow a power-up to be applied to it.
Helios_SOE
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:31 am
#103
Hedd wrote:
We've never had AOE damage. It teases us right after server reset until we cross a zone line and its back to 1+elemental. Its the same with all Heavy Weapons.
So, does that mean it does work properly at some point?
Yeraze
Sat Oct 01, 2005 12:33 am
#104
Hate to attempt a Hijack, and while I'm flattered to see the Devs talking to the Rangers & the Commando's... What ever happened to the SL's? Are we once again left out in the cold?