Commando Archive

Its good to see us commandos not laying down and rolling over for the devs thats offering us such a slap in the face 'fix' as they stated. We WANT to be COMMANDOS and NOT pistoleers, carbineers, rifleman, or even TKA**edit** it.

The developers advertised a commando profession and hyped it up pretty **edit** well on their forums for throughout development of the game, and beta, yet the Commando profession still isnt even beta ready yet. SOE and SWG devs should be ashamed of what they attemped to pawn off and false-advertised to all of us just for a profit in their wallets.

SOE is dangerously crossing over into false advertisment and bait and switch advertising. People laugh when others threaten to sue game companies for faliure to offer what was promised out of their product. I would laugh to if it wasnt for the fact that we pay for games like this monthly AFTER we make our original purchase.

Now with that said, SOE we love the game. Most of us are keeping our accounts active which in turn puts money in your pockets. We have a RIGHT to demand satisfaction out of the product we have purchased. None of us commandos are demanding an 'instant win button', we are simply asking to be allowed to play the profession we were promised and to be able to compete effectively. We have struggled through game bugs, server crashes, login problems. constant game bugs that still plague us daily, the fact we are ONLY allowed ONE character per server which was NOT an attempt to make the game economy better (frankly its the most unstable game economy I have ever seen) only to pad your pockets even further, but NOW you expect us to sit idely by while you further patronize us with these so called 'fixes'.

After all those game bugs, crashes, and being ridiculed as the most gimped class in SWG and having to pay 4-6x as much for our weapons which some cant even be made yet, and others dont even have proper certification, while still others are totatly gimped in dmg, styles, and speed and not even giving the proper xp we need to BE a commando, all we are asking for is some freaking respect and allow us to play the class which we are still holding out to actually be.

Im watching a WWII documentry and if you want to know what a commando is suppose to be, you might want to check out the "History of the Marines" or the "History of the Navy Seals" on the History Channel. Now I know that this is a game based on a storyline in galaxy far far blah blah blah, but its obvious the developers dont even know what a commando is. Commandos are battle hardened roughnecks that either carry heavy equipment or are stealth warriors.They do everything from using explosive charges to bust bunkers and destroy key targets, to using flamethrowers on tanks and weeding out enemy foxholes and shelters as well as push back front lines. They also are tough as nails combatants in hand to hand combat, and can use melee weps like knives extremly proficiently. They excel in both short range and long range combat tactics and can easily snipe off any target at a considerable range with their special rifles. They are high-tech gadgetry masters using the latest technology to accomplish each of the points I just made. They are called upon for special missions when a difficult task needs to be accomplished. They are special forces, they are COMMANDOS!

Now SOE has layed a decent blueprint of that description that I just described, however they have failed to successfully implement that design properly. First of all they claim that all our heavy weps are only secondary and used for specific case situations. I assume these specific case situations arnt not implemented into the game, now will they we implemented till the space expansion comes out in about a year. There are no structures or vechicles to explode atm so all our heavy weps are totally useless from that point of view. They further state that the launcher pistol is our primary weapon. Now with that being said, I compare a commando with no pistoleer skills using a launcher pistol with only marksman pistol skills to that of a regular street cop with medicore pistol skills using a Mark23. We all know a Master Marksman will almost never beat a Master Pistoleer. We should have our OWN offensive styles and defensive styles for our OWN weapons just like all other professions have.

Lastly I found a page that perfectly describes what a commando is.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/military/2001/10/special_weapons_navy_seals/index4.phtml

The devs said that our heavy weps are only for certain case situations. However I STRONGLY necourage them to read this quote from an actual commando:

"To be realistic," says one member, "if you're in a combat environment where people are out there with assault rifles and heavy machine guns, your [stuff] is pretty weak if you're out there with a handgun. A handgun would typically be used for escape and evasion, which means that everything's gone to hell."

I think that quote will be my Commando sig for now on, at least till the devs realize what a commando really is.

My 2 cents:

There are alot of issues with the commando prof. but three things really stand out as being really ridiculously wrong.

1. Why is it that a that an unarmed tk can cause more damage with his bare hands than a commando can do by throwing grenades in a cons face or by lighting it on fire with a friggin flamethrower!?!

2. Whydo commandos need unarmed combatas a prereq for using rocket launchers and grenades (not my definition of unarmed combat)? If commandos had their own specialized unarmed specials (even just a couple good ones) the prereq would make sense. As it is, it is stupid! 29 skill pts. on a prereq whose skills will never be used again.

3. There really needs to be a new xp pool and some defenive specials for field tactics. Combat xp for novice, fine but why combat xp for grenades? Why not grenade use xp? Especially since field tactics contains exactly zero tactical special moves (no defensive or posture specials, which is a whole other problem and they need so add some in my opinbion).

I know there are problems and issues with alot of other professions but in my opinion the only prof. in as bad or worse shape then commando is bio-engineer. All you have to do is read the pfofession boards to realize this and i hope the devs do. They really need to focus on these two professions and make major improvements or they will be DEAD professions! They have always listened to the people before and I believe they are now. The announced test center changes are a start but its not nearly enough to make commando a worthwhile and fun profession.

Again, just my 2 cents, take it for what its worth

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Tavinureel wrote:

Garibaldi man,

Thanks a lot for listening to all our complaints and wading throught the deluge of our recommendations, as well as putting up with the fact that the DEV's have absolutely NO idea what you are talking about when you talk to them.

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I second that. It's sometimes difficult to see through the haze and recognise al the work you're doing (because the devs don't listen) but the whole commando community appreciates it nonetheless.

Thanks man.

Many thanks to Garibaldi for his efforts in moderating this list and talking to the Devs. Thanks!

But, two facets of the commando class still concern me. One, making it seem that the Launcher Pistol is the primary weapon of choice for the commando. Two, re-developing Field Tactics Branch.

Launcerh Pistol, currently I hunt with a few fencer's and a TKA. Each of them can do 1100+ damage per hit in 3.5 seconds or less. in a 12 second time period that it takes a commando to use any of the heavy weapons the fencer and TKA can do 4 hit's. Bringing the total damge in that time period to 4400+ points per individual. Unless the heavy weapons are going to be at this damage level or higher for that time period, then there really needs to be some thought put to what a primary and special case wepaon is. I have a launcher pistol with 51-177dmg at 3.0 speed. So far, my top damage rating with it is 560 per hit using Overcharge2 special move. I'm still not dealing out as much damage as a fencer or TKA. This means I have to go pistoleer to get better pistol special moves to use with the launcher pistol. But with the damage rating set at what it is I don't see any move, nor do I have any from pistoleer, that will get the Launcher Pistol in the 900+ dmg range. I believe that there needs to be 3 primary wepons with faster recycle rates a Heavy Pistol(launcher would be fine if it didn't lag so), carbine and rifle -- as well the ability to use the special moves from Marksman, rifleman, pistoleer and carbineer. I Haven't been able to get my hands on an acid rifle yet, so I'm not sure how they are. But commando's definitely need something less graphic intensive and more damage dealing than a Launcher pistol as a primary weapon. Otherwise, every encounter would have to start with a commando using a "special case" weapon to really punch out some damage, and then finish with a primary, for each and every encounter. This means that there really isn't such a thing as a "special case" weapon, because the weapon would have to be used for each and every encounter. Unless we hunt only gnorts for the rest of our SWG lives. I'm asking the devs to think about adding some primary weapons that allow an individual to choose the damage level needed for the encounter -- pistol for small, carbine for medium, rifle for larger encounters and "special case" for the insane mob encounters, and help us keep the special case weapons special. Otherwise, I'm going to go through acid launchers and heavy PB weapons quickly and make some weaponsmith very wealthy. As well, as a commando we have learned the mastery of weapons so the speed of the weapons should be dropping on our primaries. We should be getting into the 1.5 - 3 range, not the 3.5 - 12 range.

Field Tactics Branch,Commando's should be able to dish out mucho pain and be able to take a lot as well. I don't agree witht he Field Tactics Branch only being about grenades and your throwing accuracy. It seems to me at this point Field Tactics should be more into helping the commando defend against and agress towards an opponent. Maybe incorporate into the branch additional points for melee and ranged defense to help the commando in battle. Along with special moves that help the commando to commit to proper posture in combat as well as exposing the opponents. Without some thought put into this branch I think it should be renamed toGrenade Branch and be based off of Grenade XP. I mean after all we had to endure using each the rifle, pistol and carbine for marksman why not the same with grenades and their xp instead of combat.

Right now I feel like the devs are pushing us to do Commando plus Pistoleer Plus as much Carbineer as we can get. Especially since I was looking forward to becoming a Commandowith Creature Handler. But, I think now the wiser course is to finish my last two skill slots for Pistoleer, and Start on Carbineer.

Thanks again Garibaldi! I look forward to the upcoming responses!

Server: Kauri

Character: Owolo Funk'Shwei

Class: Commando/Pistoleer/wannabee CH

Alright, this is my first post, but I've read carefully, and taken everything into consideration, and from the looks of it, the last two -pages- of this topic were full of people that completely want to re-write the skill tree for the commando. I don't agree to that, do I want the weapons fixed, yes, do I want the resources readily available, yes. Do I agree with simply buying ammo for charged weapons rather then buying a new weapon, yes. But I don't agree with switching around, adding/subtracting skills and lines, for all this gobbledie-**edit**. Commando's primary should be there heavy weapon, -that- to me is what a commando is. Launcher Pistol to me is a secondary, light weapon. On the last note, they have all these changes going on the test center, and I've seen the question asked several times in many posts. "When is it going to change for all servers, all of us?" and I've yet to see it answered. All I have to say is, thank god I'm a musician too...

If people are talking about revamping the skill trees, here's my suggestion.

Pre-req - Master Brawler, Master Marksman

First off, this makes complete sense as the Commando should be able to be good with anything put into his hands. (Not the best, but good)

Make the Launcher a Light Heavy Weapon and use special abilities granted by the Commando skill tree. Here is my list of trees:

Commando Hand to Hand - Adds bonuses and moves to any weapon skill group, not a LOT, but enough to make him viable in close quarter stuff.

Heavy Weapon Tactics - Adds bonuses and moves to all commando weaponry. All moves in this tree would work for ALL the commando's weapons and thus would even work for the Launcher as well.

Artillery Tactics- Adds certifications and bonues to all the Super Heavy weapons the commando can get.

Field Tactics - Adds grenade certifications and resistances (Like Knockdown resistances)

These trees would make the Commando a force to be dealt with, but with the Master/Master requirement, it would take serious dedication to be one. The Launcher pistol becomes a true Commando weapon, and he becomes a decent (not godly) hand to hand artist. I really think SOE needs to take a long, hard look at what it means to be a Commando and not always just trust what a Dev thinks it should be. I can guarantee our ideas are more original that what has already been put on the drawing board. Too bad they probably won't look at all these good suggestions people are doing unless G submits it all in an email.

Those are my recommendations. Otherwise, the Launcher pistol is simply going to have to be Pistol unless they change the trees, otherwise we won't be ablet to do jack with the stupid thing. Yes I am Novice Pistoleer just so I can add some bonuses to that weapon.

Right now in order to be a GOOD commando, you need some TKA and Pistoleer in you. Thus, GOOD commandos will have Master Unarmed, Master Marksman, Novice TKA, Novice Pistoleer, and Master Commando. This layout maximizes the C's current skill tree requirements very well, but it is simply sad that we have to do this to be a good Commando.

The launcher pistol in the commando tree giving hw and using pistol specials is ok, but after the first response I was going to go commando/pistoleer, now i have to.

They need to treat us like the BH and on one of the lines increase our pistol speed/accuracy and give us pistol specials. We still don't have a primary weapon that increases at all without taking other professions. As an elite class our primary weapon requiring a seperate profession is really not right. I was going to do it anyway but that doesn't mean i should have to. Other people might want to try other things then combat realated and Commando still takes up the second biggest chunk of points. We should be self sufficient and progress in our primary weapons throughout our career, not rely on another profession.

I also forgot since the launcher pistol is going to be our primary weapon then it needs to not be "rare" and needs to be made from iron in general not dolovite iron is there any other profession that relies entirely on rare metal to make their weapons? Its insanity.

The whole resource system is interesting, it probably took a long time and the devs are probalby very impressed with themselves over how intricate and vast it is. But they need to take a hard step back to see if its doing what they want. The resources in general probably don't exist for long enough, but they longer they exist the less chance of seeing a rare resource. On top of them apparently turning up the decay rate on weapons we will never have a decent compliment or supply of our weapons.

I am really happy that your correspondent is actually making some headway with the Devs in getting some of the commando issues looked at. Yours is a class that I truly want to see in action as they should be, not as a fancy firework show that isn't worth a flip in a group structure.

Having read the chats and the interactions there are a few things that you all, and several other classes need tokeep in your mind.

1. Even if they get all your weapon certifications fixed, your weapons need to have their Damage Per Second balanced out. If they have decided that Commando Heavy Weapons are going to be High Delay weapons then they need to have an impact that matches the delay. As your correspondent has noted, your CR (Challenge Rating) has been adjusted based on some sort of fictitious mega damage output that you do not have, thus reducing the amount of XP that you get per kill. You can see this on a smaller scale when you are grinding XP, if you go out and attack a durni (rabbit) with your Laser Rifle and Rifle Specialist certification you get about 40 XP per rabbit that you kill because you are a badass with that gun and the rabbit stands no chance. If you unequip your rifle and attack the same rabbit with your untrained brawling skill and no weapon you will get nearly 200 unarmed combat XP for that kill because it was a challenge with your unskilled style. The game apparently thinks that using that flame thrower makes you a billy-bad-youknowwhat and is screwing you out of combat XP due to some fictional DPS you don't have.

Your DPS with Heavy Weapons needs to be Ungodly if they are going to give you a 10 second delay between shots with a high miss ratio. otherwise as you have seen your XP will be NIL in groups, not to mention that you will be contributing next to nothing when compared to a pistolleer or a TKA, and solo you will die........alot.

This may be hard to balance but for all the work you have put into this Combat oriented profession, and then to be massively outdamaged consistently buy a novice marksman with a 500 credit rifle is just insulting. If your hits are going to be rare, then they need to be impressive.

2. This is my opinion as an outsider but You Commandos should have a crafting branch in your tree. In that tree you should be able to craft munitions for your weapons, Grenades, and You as COMMANDOS should have the highest weapon repair skill in the game. A Commando should be skilled in weapon repair/maintenance, even more skilled than a weaponsmith. They make them, you use and maintain them. You should get schematics for all of your grenadesand munitionsand they should be craftable in a specialized crafting tool with NO FACTORY PARTS.

What is this really asking for?? The ability to maintain your weapon, make ammunition (As yours is the only class in the game that requires ammunition) and with a little effort save yourself some money on expendable damage output that should not run you a zillion credits unless it is going to do a zillion points of damage. As things stand now, you would be foolish to pay 10K for a couple grenades that miss too frequently, do less damage than a novice Marksman with a DL20 rifle and destroy your HAM. Useless weapons in an Elite profession (Call it hybrid if you like but BH and Commando are more Elite, requiring more effort,than any of the so calledElite Classes).

Maybe I am reading too much into the name but in my mind a Commando is something of a self sufficientmilitary bad-a$$, and not some little fella that sweeps the weaponsmith's workshop to scrounge up the credits to buy dud grenades and flame throwers that do the damage of an upturned bottle of hairspray and a lighter.

Com-man-do - A member of a small fighting force, specially trained for making quick, DESTRUCTIVE raids against enemy held areas. - The American Heritage College Dictionary

i think this guy might have something.

If we make it where our weapon repair is the highest in the game, it would slightly (but not by much) improve our weapon problems. We buy the rare item, and don't need to worry about getting a new one for a while.

I don't think we should revamp the tree, just fix the bugs in it, and add new perks to the appropriate boxes and tiers.