Commando Archive
Thread: Launcher Pistol Suggestion Thread
AlufNull wrote:
I really think that suggesting the launcher pistol be romoved from the pistol framework and made a stand alone weapon is unrealistic.
Posts of this type are suggesting that commando should be an uber stand alone class and that is just not how the game was designed.
How is separating LP from regular pistols unrealistic? Are there any other classes that are forced to attain skills in other professions in order to be proficient in their profession exclusive weapon? Cross-training in another profession should be a bonus not a nessecity. To deny this means you are unwilling to look beyond your personal character spec and recognize a design flaw.
If the Devs don't separate the skills and give Commandos a +pistol accuracy/speed you will see an ungodly increase in dabblers that take BH/Pistoleer/Commado just to be super-uber with one weapon.
But the LP IS a exclusive weapon, just like the BH's scatter pistol. It requires that you take up novice commando (or BH) to get the weapon. This makes it exclusive in THIS game systems terms. Others can use it all they want, they can use it effectively if they get novice commando.
I think that people need MORE incentive to dabble in commando, because as is. The LP is a good weapon but no one takes novice commando because nothing comes with it. If we added mods and specials up say field tactics, then the weapon would become more appealing. I'm not asking for mods large enough to compete with pistoleer but they should be competeing with BH mods, at the very least. We get 1 tree of mods and most of those will likely be +10 to accuracy and +5 to damage per box (twice that for novice and master) that gives us a total of +80 accuracy and +40 speed, that puts the LP on par with the other HWs in our class and gives dabblers a reason to dabble in something other then the flamethrower. But it doesn't give us the insane speed and accuracy bonuses of the pistoleer. It won't stop players from takeing up pistoleer, but it won't give commandos a completely useless weapon should they choose not to. We don't get any mods other then accuracy and speed. No accuracy while moveing, no damage, no nothing.
Some suggestions for the lousy hair dryer (even if these get put in I doubt I'll use the **edit** thing, I don't like pistols because SOE pampers them like puppies)
1: Keep the LP as is in terms of armor pierceing. Because it does blast damage it shouldn't have AP otherwise it will be way to powerful against vehicles. Instead increase damage a bit more.
2:Add specials that make sense with the LP's nature. A "target lock 1 and 2" which increases your accuracy with the weapon by 150% for 10-20 seconds, halves its refire rate, and prevents the use of specials during the 5-10 seconds. This special is only useable with the LP. This I think would be a good special because the LP is suppose to fire target seeking rockets. TL2 would add a damage boost of 30% and last 15-20 seconds. Another special might be "Impact Shot" which would cause a knockdown, with no bonus to damage. And "Stunning Blast" which targets the head of an opponent and does mind damage, stunning and dizzyingthe target. This last one would only be given at master level (I don't wanna see another eye shot, but if something like this was added to the LP then I might use the hairdryer, MIGHT) It would do no extra damage.
3: Put these mods up the field tactics line. And the specials up the HWs line, this way dabblers wouldn't be TOO encouraged to take up the lp with these specials and mods. This prevents people from really exploiting the dabble system with a stopping shot type attack and 100+ bonuses to both speed and accuracy. Thus if someone wanted the LP they could choose between the specials and HWs, or the Field tactics with mods and merely use their own specials. Masters could use both and since the mods stack with pistol mods (infact they SHOULD be pistol mods) you have yourself a good commando weapon. I just wish they would change the look at the very least!
Welp since 1 person on this entire thread doesn't like carbines (I still think an assult rifle is a better commando weapon then a pistol) then how about replaceing LP with a shoulder mounted non-disposable Light Rocket Launcher?
I really don't care if it gets its own tree, combined with another tree or what. All I want is AP1, the weapons range mods fixed and its own specials. The devs can make it to where the launcher pistol will not and cannot use pistol specials, after all it is a heavy weapon and if you think it aint then you need to wake up...it shoots mini missiles for goodness sake and grants only heavy weapons exp not pistol exp so this should be do-able. Doing this would then give us our own specials, speed/accuracy mods and possibly AP1. Or they can leave the use of pistol specials alone and just move it over to the field tactics tree, that alone would discourage ALOT of people from dabbling just for it. The speed and accuracy mods given at novice could equal that at Master Marksman then box's 1-4could be speed +5/accuracy+5.
That would put accuracy with the LP in line with both the HAR(so to speak) and the Flamethrower at box 4(+80). Then the big payoff could come at Master Commando with +25 accuracy/+10 speed and would make getting Master Commando even more worthwhile(considering if what is on test center already actually goes live). As far as specific specials I am still undecided what we should get. I was thinking of a dizzy from the blast of the missiles and maybe supressionfire2 like the carbineer tree. They could give the dizzy a 20% chance to apply the effect and the supressionfire2 a 50% chance to effect its target.
Do you guys think in order to atleast get Ap1 on it they should drop the high end damage a bit? Say min could go up a bit and drop high end down a bit then give it Ap1? For instance min:95, max:180 or there abouts. As it stand now the Dx2 has(on my server Kauri) Acid damage,AP1, min90,max155, scatter pistol has Acid damage, AP1, min 100, max 180. If they do this they then could fix the ranges on the LP and make it point blank 0m +0, ideal 20m +30, max 64m -85. I like all these ideas everyone is posting, save few "other" proffessions that come in here posting one what they think we SHOULD get and who dont play the class.
"The launcher pistol is not an exclusive weapon. It is a pistol. This is a skills based system, not a professions based one."
Alufnull,
You make some decent points but you are missing one of biggest problems with LP being just another pistol.
The LP gives Heavy Weapons Exp. It is the only weapon that gives experience that does not directly effect the weapon being used.
How much since would it make if all carbines used pistol experience and to get good at a carbine you had to use a FWG5? Here lies the fundamental error in the current design. The LPmust give heavy weapons exp to allow the Commando to advance in his/her skill trees. Isolating the LP as it's own weapon type will allow a Commando to get proficient at that weapon while using it.
The current LP system is flawed. This is not a personal bias. This is basic reasoning.
Mishap wrote:
LP should be given its own stats. This would cut down on dabblers. I am sorry for those that want to take Smuggler or Pistoleer skills but I should not have to take skills in another profession to make my profession exclusive weapon worth a **edit**.
It would be simple to attach a new set of skills for the LP.
Give the Novice Commando block +60 accuracy +30 speed for 'Launcher Pistol'. This would bring the Novice block to the level that is already attainable for pistols by mastering Marksman. The rest is obvious...just fill in 4 levels of any one of the trees to include accuracy and speed mods and a few special moves.
I think the statement that the Devs made regarding combining FT and HAR is BS. There is no way that combining these two is technically impossible. I think the real issue is that they don't want to give the flame dabblers a second weapon for free. I agree with this frame of thought, however, I wish the Devs would quit trying to blow smoke where it doesn't belong.
IF the devs refuse to combine FT and HAR then I think all the disposable weapons should be removed from their own tree and divided between the Field Tactics, HAR, and new LP tree. The FT tree could remain as is to prevent more incentive for dabblers. I think this would be a reasonable fix to the Launcher Pistol issues.
As some have written, how about putting the LP in the line with grenades? The devs could even use that as a similar enough type of weapon-set to justify it. A grenade, or a weapon that basically launches grenades, same skill set. Just put specials and skill mods (either pistol-usable or LP's own skill type) in that line, and Commando is basically a well rounded elite profession, rather than a Flame-thrower heavy half-done profession.
Actually I re-thought things last nite, and I think the AP1 issue is easily solvable by giving the LP AP1 at MASTER COMMANDO level.
Again, that rewards someone that worked to get to Master Commando, and sort of equates to saying that now that you've mastered the class, your weapon is even more dangerous because you can now use Armor piercing rounds with it. If it's solved by providing an armor piercing special, that's fine.
I had also earlier said that the weapon should have a chance of doing knockdown damage. I reconsidered that and am more in favor of STUN damage instead. As others said, clearly, if you were shot in an armor chest piece with a weapon that was firing rockets at you, you'd probably be pretty stunned. Perhaps keep a very small percentage chance on the weapon that a knockdown could happen thanks to the attack, but primarily have the weapon add STUN damage as you progress up the line.
To Alufnul: sorry, but I don't believe that the answer is to force those that want to master commando to dabble over in pistoleer or smuggler. In fact, I feel the opposite. Some of their specials need to be moved up to a point that it's not as easy to be rewarded for dabbling in those trees while also being in the Commando or BH tree.
As is, I have to spend enough points getting Commando that I don't have that many points remaining to use for artisan skills, or medic skills, or other useful trees. If I keep scout for terrain navigation and hunting, then I'm really hurting for skill points to spread elsewhere. Smuggler makes sense, or TKA makes sense, but again, you can only be spread so thin....
The Launcher Pistol should be a weapon primarily for Commandos, and should have mods for Commandos that come through the trees somewhere. It still makes sense for those mods to come primarily from Field Tactics, which is where you are already getting benefits from weapons that go boom.
tnarb wrote:
I really don't care if it gets its own tree, combined with another tree or what. All I want is AP1, the weapons range mods fixed and its own specials. The devs can make it to where the launcher pistol will not and cannot use pistol specials, after all it is a heavy weapon and if you think it aint then you need to wake up...it shoots mini missiles for goodness sake and grants only heavy weapons exp not pistol exp so this should be do-able. Doing this would then give us our own specials, speed/accuracy mods and possibly AP1. Or they can leave the use of pistol specials alone and just move it over to the field tactics tree, that alone would discourage ALOT of people from dabbling just for it. The speed and accuracy mods given at novice could equal that at Master Marksman then box's 1-4could be speed +5/accuracy+5.
That would put accuracy with the LP in line with both the HAR(so to speak) and the Flamethrower at box 4(+80). Then the big payoff could come at Master Commando with +25 accuracy/+10 speed and would make getting Master Commando even more worthwhile(considering if what is on test center already actually goes live). As far as specific specials I am still undecided what we should get. I was thinking of a dizzy from the blast of the missiles and maybe supressionfire2 like the carbineer tree. They could give the dizzy a 20% chance to apply the effect and the supressionfire2 a 50% chance to effect its target.
Do you guys think in order to atleast get Ap1 on it they should drop the high end damage a bit? Say min could go up a bit and drop high end down a bit then give it Ap1? For instance min:95, max:180 or there abouts. As it stand now the Dx2 has(on my server Kauri) Acid damage,AP1, min90,max155, scatter pistol has Acid damage, AP1, min 100, max 180. If they do this they then could fix the ranges on the LP and make it point blank 0m +0, ideal 20m +30, max 64m -85. I like all these ideas everyone is posting, save few "other" proffessions that come in here posting one what they think we SHOULD get and who dont play the class.