Commando Archive

how about the massasi ink rifle at master coomando as a ranged/melee hybrid weapon.

it even looks the part.

im sorry but making commando a melee/range hybrid will not work, ever heard of the phaese "jack of all trades, master of none. if we become a hybrid we will loese half of our range mods for melee mod and becuase some moron pick a melee range prof everyone else have to suffer.

as for the unarmed tree, meny hyrbid prof. have a tree that don't help with the prof you are working for. like SL to go up the camping tree. do they have skills to make camps? no. and sumggler going up the unarmed tree do they have unarmed skills? no.

Message Edited by cyrom on 09-11-2005 10:35 AM

ok starnick. no prof can't stand on it own. anyone is only master at 1 prof does not knopw how to play this game. a riflemen does not have root or a aoe. a pistoler does not have power. so what will they do they will go to other prof and get skills. a CM does not have weapions. a doc does not have combat. TKA

2 Things:

1) We would most likely become a better melee add-on if we had ranged specials. That would preserve our damage (hence role), and then we'd be able to go into a melee template that would increase our tanking abilities and give us more options while being up close and personal with our flamers without sacraficing damage.

You could also make it where CoB worked with HW, but that could be pushing it since then smugglers would be left out despite them having UA IV too. Plus, tanking while being able to do damage? Bit sticky in relation to balance there.

2) Cyrom, you're missing my point big time. I never said a commando does not need to dabble, nor was that even what Im getting at. A Pistoleer can do crowd controlling abilities (stopping shot), and its role as a crowd controller without requiring another ranged profession. Its not a question of a profession standing on its own, its a question of "can we do our role and contribute it to our template?".

Ie, if you went into a TKM-Master Carbineer template, you'd get tanking as well as ranged crowd control abilities. With the same mind send, a TKM-Master Commando should be able to get tanking and ranged damage abilities. Right now, for us, that is untrue.

Now with ranged templates...if you mixed Carbineer and Commando you'd get crowd control from carbines, and damage from commando. Thats how it was intended, and with your template being made stronger with such a combination. Right now, we don't give damage...we recieve it from those professions that are non-damage dealers...now does that seem like something's wrong?

No where am I saying 121 sp in commando should equal a 250 sp template. Stand-alone, all professions have strengths and weaknesses that could be strengthened in a template. BUT if you compare commando to other ranged professions, our weaknesses of course show...but our strength also compares weakly too. Our role only comes out in certain ranged templates and no where else, while the roles of other professions can come out in -any- template regardless if they're stand-alone or not. Thats the problem. Also thats a huge difference from saying a profession should function as a template; the profession should function as its given role, and contribute those abilities to a template. Right now, we do improve...but we only become on par with other professions. For us, there is a huge damage disparity that is preventing flexiblity:

Ie, a Carbineer can still do the same damage in a melee or ranged template because of his specials. Our damage goes up in ranged templates, and becomes on par...but without a ranged template we're no more than a fanshot profession. If we had some kind of damage special, it would achieve an equiliberium (sp) and allow for more flexible templates while also not overpowering our profession in ranged templates since the damage will be the same regardless. Then, we will function like other professions were in a template we grow to become more powerful with abilities and mods, rather than using templates right now to perform the role we should've been able to do without templates. For us its a two-fold gainage (role and the usual gaining of versitility, abilities, and mods), for other professions its only one, as they already contribute their own role into a template.

And lastly:

"im sorry but making commando a melee/range hybrid will not work, ever heard of the phaese "jack of all trades, master of none. if we become a hybrid we will loese half of our range mods for melee mod and becuase some moron pick a melee range prof everyone else have to suffer."

Problem with this - we already are a melee-ranged hybrid. We've been a hybrid for two years, and with the CU we do in fact have general melee mod's in the Explosives Tree. I'm pretty sure thats why our ranged mods are a bit lower than the normal professions too...so why not utilize what we already got?

Sorry if I wasn't totally clear on this...

Message Edited by StarNick on 09-11-2005 04:13 PM

Message Edited by StarNick on 09-11-2005 04:15 PM

"Unfortunatly, at least on my server, Doc/melee stackers or BH/CMs are the FotM... Hard to compete with heals like that. Personally, I don't think doc should grant combat levels, but that's a whole nother debate..."

Yeah heh, thats the greatest irony of the CU right there Dragonrider

There are still FOTM templates out there, but at least because now many of the professions mesh very well that there is more flexibility if the right development can be put to the right places. Until that happens, the CU still isn't finished yet...

Bah! I haven't caved into the combat / healer templates. I refuse to water down my hitting power and defenses. Other healers are nearby, ESPECIALLY since most people have Doc 4xxx or CM 4xxx in their templates.

You know what that means? More people to look out for us pure fighters. We deal the damage, they can help keeping us in one piece. And there's MORE of them to do that nowadays.

warr, the damage you do with a single master ranged proff compared to that of a double master ranged proff is measured in a mere 150 extra damage per shot thanks to mods (+Accuracy) and yes, multiple combat abilities.

But that is totally useless when your opponent hits you back for 90% of the damage you dish out AND heals 90% of the damage you inflict on him ...damage you cannot heal up. medic/combat will always defeat pure combat.

I won't budge. I never had been FOTM in the Pre-CU days, and I intend to maintain that tradition in the current CU-era. And Combat / Healer templates are more FOTM right now than BH templates.

My main's template is Master Marksman / Master Carbineer / Master Rifleman / Pistoleer 0434. Fast, accurate, hits hard, has a good variety of specials for practically any situation. For an Imperial like me, I have full certification for Scout Trooper and Stormtrooper Armor. The template is balanced by the fact that I have no Medic boxes whatsoever.

And it makes no difference to me to not have any Medic. Why?

* I'm one of the very uncommon Pure Combat characters. Probably rarer than Jedi these days, LOL!

* I love the hitting power and the large ranged attack "toolbox" I have. I can do these attacks FAST, unlike the combat / healer templates, especially if they master CM or Doctor.

* I do not duel. Duels mean nothing to the Galactic Civil War and my continued service to the Emperor. The Galactic Civil War (or what little is left of it) is group combat.

* With group combat in mind, there are lots of people nowadays with CM 4xxx or Doctor 4xxx in their templates.

* My template isn't helpless when it comes to self-healing. I can get by on Ruby Bliel + Stimpacks to keep me going until I get healed by one of the half-dozen healers in my group.

* I may not have Medic skillboxes, but due to R.Bliel and Stimpacks, and the plethora of supporting healers out there, it's not like the damage done to me is unhealable during GCW combat.

* And again, I will NEVER be a FOTM character / player.

* I like it this way! I haven't had this much fun with a template since I had MBH / M.Carbineer just before the CU. And before that? When I mastered TKM and Commando way back.

---

Warmaker01 wrote:
I won't budge. I never had been FOTM in the Pre-CU days, and I intend to maintain that tradition in the current CU-era. And Combat / Healer templates are more FOTM right now than BH templates.

My main's template is Master Marksman / Master Carbineer / Master Rifleman / Pistoleer 0434. Fast, accurate, hits hard, has a good variety of specials for practically any situation. For an Imperial like me, I have full certification for Scout Trooper and Stormtrooper Armor. The template is balanced by the fact that I have no Medic boxes whatsoever.

And it makes no difference to me to not have any Medic. Why?

* I'm one of the very uncommon Pure Combat characters. Probably rarer than Jedi these days, LOL!

* I love the hitting power and the large ranged attack "toolbox" I have. I can do these attacks FAST, unlike the combat / healer templates, especially if they master CM or Doctor.

* I do not duel. Duels mean nothing to the Galactic Civil War and my continued service to the Emperor. The Galactic Civil War (or what little is left of it) is group combat.

* With group combat in mind, there are lots of people nowadays with CM 4xxx or Doctor 4xxx in their templates.

* My template isn't helpless when it comes to self-healing. I can get by on Ruby Bliel + Stimpacks to keep me going until I get healed by one of the half-dozen healers in my group.

* I may not have Medic skillboxes, but due to R.Bliel and Stimpacks, and the plethora of supporting healers out there, it's not like the damage done to me is unhealable during GCW combat.

* And again, I will NEVER be a FOTM character / player.

* I like it this way! I haven't had this much fun with a template since I had MBH / M.Carbineer just before the CU. And before that? When I mastered TKM and Commando way back.

---

you forgot:

* i only declare in a group, never solo.

Wars and battles aren't fought and won by the individual. It is the group.

And I still refuse to be FOTM. It is NOT requried to have Medic to be competent in combat.

And I have had my share of fighting and winning by myself, though I don't actively look for PVP. I have also had more than enough of my share of losing when I'm by myself.

Besides, loner Overts / Spec.Forces get eaten up. Either by groups of players or a Jedi (single or multiple... usually multiple) that are wandering around. If you're normal and intend to participate in the GCW, at Ahazi, you better group up. Or die as a sacrificial lamb for the sake of it. Even if you're going in as a pair you stand a better chance than the "lone Overt / Spec.Forces member."

"No man is an island," and the current era of CU reflects that, if you haven't realized it. At least for us Normal players. Gone are the days of Normal templates that absolutely dominate the battlefield. You will have strengths. You will have weaknesses. I chose a different set of strengths and weaknesses. I chose to be a Full Combat Template with the Pros and Cons that entails. I chose NOT to be LEMMING.

Message Edited by Warmaker01 on 09-12-2005 02:11 PM