Commando Archive

Personally I wouldn't mind if throwing grenades was really slow if they did a sufficient amount of damage to a generous area of effect. I would like to see a grenade hitting 16m radius for 6000. How would this be fair to PVP? Make a delay on the explosion. You throw the grenade, it lands at its intended target, 2-3 seconds for people to get the heck out of there before WHAM! Big explotion. Most creatures are too stupid to move in RL. Most people that saw a grenande land at their feet would run like hell.

I also like the idea of rolling grenades, and I also think we should be able to throw them over walls and such.

I got suggestions out the wazzoo but I'll keep it short and sweet.

1: Fix the delay between throwing the grenade and haveing the damage actually hit.

2: Make the grenades throwable to a distance of 64m, or reduce the distance that cm's can throw their poisons to that of the grenades. If grenade range is NOT increased then remove the chance for the grenades to hit you in the blast.

3: Reduce the ham costs so they match the flamethrower's ham costs. This increases their useability while heavily armored. Allowing players to be grenadeers for real. This along with small but usefull mods all up and down the field tactics line would allow the field tactics tree to be very valuable and usefull for dabblers and masters alike.

4: Don't change the accuracys ordamage. Add side effects to the blasts (dizzy, knockdown for C22 [not C12], Protons, and Imperial detenators,immobilize if its a cryoban, disease andpoison if its a glopetc.) BUT increase their range of effect to 16m. This along with the range increase to 64m would allow these weapons to be used as artillery. Inaccurate but still, whatever they hit, they hit hard. And provides disorienting effects for targets in the blast radius.

5: Adjust the blast radius of the grenades so that the damage reduces for targets depending on their distance from ground 0 with targets in the 13m-16m recieveing 1/4th of the damage but still getting checked for status changes.

6: Adjust the speed so its more sane. Grenades SHOULD be a viable spam weapon. They have a 50% chance to hit on average at master level, this counters their high damage. Thus they would be very well balanced. Perhaps 4.0 speed on average.

7: Increase average stacks to 150+ and make them easier to craft. Again this would increase their usefullness as a spammable weapon, again this would be a good thing. This would give master commandos more weapons to use and also allow players to dabble in the field tactics line and either add punch to their own attacks or become TKA grenadeers (for example) giveing TKA players some range.

8: Remove the LOS check when throwing a grenade.

I see grenades as a possible artillery/support weapon. A hybrid of sorts of the HWs and Flamethrower/HAR. With a large radius and poor accuracy, along with no line of sight requirement, these weapons would make great support weapons and artillery fire. Thats what I'm hopeing for anyway.

Also since there isnt a Field Tactics tree suggestions post I'll stick it here.

1: First level should have +10 to cover and/or +5-10 toterrain negotiation. This is where mods for either of these ends though. The first level of tactics trains the commando to use the terrain to his advantage. Both of these mods do exactly this.

2: Second level should add a new special "lay trap" and give a +20 bonus to "Lay Trap". Traps would last 10 or 20 minutes, act like mine fields (but only the commando who layed it could see where it is) and they would only effect creatures that have aggroed the commando or players that are TEF to the commando. Traps would add status effects like immobilize, knockdown, bleed (spikes). Each trap would either have one or more of these status effects. Traps would not do damage but they would be usefull for setting ambushes. As the commando raises in field tactics tree, he learns new traps to set. Traps would be made from twigs branches and various stuff like that laying around, thus no resources would be required. It would be like chooseing what dance you want to do. Hitting "lay trap" would bring up the list of traps you can put down. There is no limit to the traps you can lay. Your skill in trap laying would effect the duration it lasts, the chances of trapping the victem (or failing), and the radius of the traps effect. Traps would only attack 1 target in the radius as soon as he enters the radius. Alternatively, instead of haveing sevreal choices of traps, you merely lay 1 trap which has a random chance to apply 1 or more of the above status effects. Your skill in laying traps determines the chances of each status effect to be applied aswell as all the rest.

3: Third level of Field Tactics should include a +10 bonus to hitting humanoid targets with any weapon. Maybe add +5 to damage against humanoid targets, aswell as +20 lay trap. This level of commando tactics begins the commandos learning in physialogy of the enemy, Commandos at this level would know the weaknesses of all races.

4: This level of field tactics should add +20 lay trap, +15 to hit humanoid targets. And +10 deffense bonus against humanoid targets. This last bonus applys to any weapon type that the opponent may have (melee and ranged). This level of commando tactics trains the commando in psycology. Thus giveing them both the ability to predict where their target will move, aswell as predict how your target will attack you.

5: Master should have another +20 to lay traps, +5 accuracy vs humanoid, and +15 deffense vs humanoids. This is where commandos really begin to shine as true soldiers.

All of these abilitys are in ADDITION to the abilitys and mods already in the field tactics line. Thus balanceing out the tree and improveing both its dabble value AND its value to the master commando. Also, the bonuses to accuracy against humanoids ONLY applies if you are useing normal shots with any weapon (includeing grenades, but not HWs) as long as you aren't useing specials for the weapon. This is alot like the scouts bonus to accuracy against creatures.

---

AlufNull wrote:

Wow, the boards are out of wack today.

As I was saying...

The range for the launcher would be 32-64m so you could not use it closer then that. This would only alow you one shot (maybe two) before you target closes distance on you. Also, the AoE would draw agro, so you would be taking a big risk using a weapon like that.

---

Ooooooooo... <drool> A Blooper! I want one!

Somebody tell MasterSynn that this is a great freakin' idea, just so long as it has the "thoooomp" sound when it fires....God, I so loved the 203.

I like the idea of some of the (as maddog likes to say) gernades being AP3. I also like the idea of each 'nade having a state effect.

What I really want is a flash-bang I can chuck into a mob. Does no damage, but 100% to stun/dizzy/blind for oh, say, 20 secs? If somebody already posted this, then shame on me for not taking time to read carefully.

Nyce Ta'Meetcha - Bela Imperial Division - Commando /Smuggler(Flurry)
Commando Timeline: (stole this from one of my commando brothers)
Useless class of Masochists
GODS OF DEATH
Tinkerbells

GotUrBacca - TRIAD - Master Gunfighter/Master CH (Eclipse)
"Pikachu! I Choose You!" and "A!" "F!" "A!" "F!" "A! A! A! A! A!" "F!"
- words to live and die by.

---

maddogs wrote:

still working on the luncher ideal for the gernades need more deatels befor we can throw it to the devs any ideals?

---

How aboutthis:

For the grenade launcher to work, you have to be stationary. Perhaps even toss in the bone that you have to be kneeling...I dunno.

Every neat little idea that creeps into my brain is immediately followed by an imaginary mob of gnomes shouting of "nerf nerf nerf nerf!"

Nyce Ta'Meetcha - Bela Imperial Division - Commando /Smuggler(Flurry)
Commando Timeline: (stole this from one of my commando brothers)
Useless class of Masochists
GODS OF DEATH
Tinkerbells

GotUrBacca - TRIAD - Master Gunfighter/Master CH (Eclipse)
"Pikachu! I Choose You!" and "A!" "F!" "A!" "F!" "A! A! A! A! A!" "F!"
- words to live and die by.

(GERNADES)

make some of the gernades have stat efects like dizzy kdstun blind posion(glop gernades should posion)(hey plzs give us a phouspherious gernads to ) and theres ben alot of tallk about giveing us a gernade launcher this would make gernads shoot 64m but would not letyou use closer then 32m and could stack 3-5 sets of gernades in one it would decay like normal weps

the ham would be about 5/20/10+ to what the gernade all ready cost the speed would be 2.2+ to what the gernade all readyare and the rang mods would be -30/+30/-20 (ideal rang be about 48m)....so lets say u have a gernade that is 12/35/12 ham costand speed 2.5 rang mod +12/+60/+12 max rang 32m min rang 0 after puting it in the launcher it be

ham cost 18/50/22 speed would now be 4.8 and ran mods would now be -30/+30/-20 max rang 64m and min 32

make the gernades rang mods +12/+60/+12

make ham on gernades 12/35/12

make speed on gernades 2.5 .... but the gernads dont go off on impact they wait for 3 secs to explode

make all gernades have ap 3

make the radius of most gernades 16m and the proton gernade 25m

make it so u dont hit ur shelf with ur own gernades

add a command to role instead of only toss/throw

and most of all take the 2.5 mod away(or do it like this field tactics 1 mod 2.0 field 2 mod 1.5 feild 3 mod 1.0 field 4 mod .5 master no mod )

this would make us like were sapose to be and it make the hw worth buying knowing that u wont miss 50% of the time useing them

and the gernades be worth useing becous there fast accurat and aoe with not to high of ham

hum this seems to be alitel over powerd letspick and choos like maby the stat efect only have a 20% changes of haponing

I am a big fan of the 203 as well Carl. That is why I like this idea so much. I also like it as a good way to combine the grenade and heavy weapons branches to make room for a launcher pistol branch.

hey guys i was tould that ac on the gernade has alott to do with dam is this true if so then no wounder there so in acuret

can any one tell us exactly how a gernade works

Launcher idea sounds cool, and the 32m minimum range should keep some of the nerf at bay. The weapon should also have the ability to lob a grenade over a wall.... I mean, you run up to a base, Reb or Imp, and you have to run around to the FRONT DOOR to toss in a grenade...

Have the system perform a check to see where you are in relation to the blast... if you're going to be inside the blast radius the system does not allow you throw the grenade. Also, if you throw the grenade and the mob is moving towards you, it should land where the mob WAS not where it is. "Hey Bobbo, hand me them nifty Heat-Seeking Grenades over there, think them baddies are gonna charge us...."

State changes to target. If nothing else make Proton Grenades blind the target... it's a freakin NUKE for cryin out loud. Have to warn folks in my groups when I use one it's so bright sometimes....

Last idea... 2 different radius... First radius is 1/2 max blast radius, full damage is done to every target in this radius. Second radius is the "wound radius", this extends all the way out to the max blast radius. Damage is cut to 25% of max but state changes are still possible, along with the possibility of bleeding from fragmentation grenades.

To answer Maddogs question about how grenades work... I'm going to guess you mean the real thing. Grenades are the simplest weapon ever used. A frag grenade is nothing more than a hollow metal case filled with an explosive compound and a detonator. You pull the safety pin out to arm, while holding pressure down on the striker handle. You then throw the 'nade, the striker comes off igniting the detonator delay. The delay burns for between 3 and 5 seconds and ignites the detonator, the detonator then ignited the explosive filler. The explosion shreds the metal casing turning it into lethal fragments.

Real grenades have a max blast radius of approximatly 15m. Inside of this 15m is a 5m "kill" radius where targets are expected to either be killed instantly or so severly wounded as to not pose a further risk on the battlefield. Outside of the "kill" radius is the "wound" radius of about 10m more. Targets inside the wound radius run a 75 to 95% of receiving at least minor wounds, with the majority of the targets requiring immediate medical attention.

Of course these examples are fragmentation grenades. All grenades work on the same principle but some use the explosive filler to disperse chemicals, smoke, and other payloads.

Hope this helps

Master Commando/1034 Squadleader

actuly kbarsoom i ment in the game

what i found out is that for some reson the devs made the gernades dam rely on ac so when there giveing us +40 ac at master thats actuly +40 dam and +40 ac hehehe

so i have had to lower the rang mods not to be so accraut on the gernads what we want for gernadesis now as follows

(GERNADES)

make some of the gernades have stat efects like dizzy kd stun blind posion(glop gernades should posion) they have a 20% canchs of stat efect

(hey plzs give us a phouspherious gernads to )

theres ben alot of tallk about giveing us a gernade launcher this would make gernads shoot 64m but would not let you use closer then 32m and could stack 3-5 sets of gernades in one it would decay like normal weps and would be a left hand fierd wep soyou have to kneel to shoot

the ham would be about 5/20/10+ to what the gernade all ready cost the speed would be 2.2+ to what the gernade all ready are and the rang mods would be -30/+30/-20 (ideal rang be about 48m) ....so lets say u have a gernade that is 12/35/12 ham cost and speed 2.5 rang mod -12/+20/-12 max rang 32m min rang 0 after puting it in the launcher it be

ham cost 18/50/22 speed would now be 4.8 and rang mods would now be -30/+30/-20 max rang 64m and min 32

make the gernades rang mods -15/+20/-15 (tryed to make them ac but not to ac becous the more ac the more dam )

make ham on gernades 12/35/12

make speed on gernades 2.5

make all gernades have ap 3

make the radius of most gernades 16m and the proton gernade 25m

make it so u dont hit ur shelf with ur own gernades

add a command to role instead of only toss/throw and this would make them do more dam becous more accruat.... but the gernads dont go offas soon asyou rolethem they wait for 3 secs afteryou roleto explode

and most of all take the 2.5 mod away(or do it like this field tactics 1 mod 2.0 field 2 mod 1.5 feild 3 mod 1.0 field 4 mod .5 master no mod )

what u guys think any thing elss

There are many great suggestions and some pretty stupid one's in this thread already. I have been screaming for grenades to fixed for months now so I would like the thank everyone in this threed and it's ccreator for throwing in your 2 cents.

1.

I have no lcue what just happened but my message posted and I hadn't even really begun it yet. As I was saying.

1. When crafting Grenades, if you have the schems for them, take a look at them. There are OPTIONAL components that can be used, such as a Warheads Effects Booster and an Enhanced Composition Charge. The schems currently do no exist in the game at all. They are missing from the game!!! We need these desperatly. To make the Grenades more powerful.

2. GRENADES NEED TO DO MORE DAMAGE!!!! It's as simple as that. Listen there are no special moves for grenades so THEY WILL NEVER DO MORE THAN WHAT THE MAX DAMAGE AND AP RATING ALLOW THEM TO HAVE. It 's silly really that a Flamethrower can do more damage than a thermal detonator. Remember when the Princess dressed as the bounty pulled out the thermal detonator at Jabba's and the entire palace trembled with fear. They did so because a Thermal detonator set off inside Jabba's place would literally LEVEL the entire building. Right now using the greatest resources you still cannont get a thermal detonator's max damage above 2000 without a power up. Even though they are AP2 this makes no difference against most creatures because they usually have no armor rating or Heavy. Grenades get reduced by 75% in PvP anyway so we can't use them during a PvP fight either!!! Grenades need to do more damage.

3. The Field tactics line should have higher grenade mods. Such as Accuracy +100 and possibly damage plus +200 per field tactics box and then one for Master Commando as well. That way they will do more damage and when you hit commando they will do a plus +1000 damage total. Thrown Weapon Speed +100 would be good too!

4. The Field tactics line should include special moves for grenades as well. We do the most damage using our specials. Grenades have no specials and are almost worthless. The accuracy sucks, so does the damage, and the HAM costs are too high. Give us a some special moves that way grenades can be where they are supposed to be at.

5. All grenades should be HEAVY ARMOR PIERCING......not AP1 or AP2 they should be AP3. What I would like to ask from you is have you ever thrown a real grenade. I have and let me tell you, they are the most powerful hand held devices on the battlefield. Literally your whole chest vibrates in and out from the power of these things. The grenades and heavy weapons (not including Acid Rifle or FLame Thrower) are supposed to do more damage than anything else in the game period. The Rocket Launcher, Proton Grenades, Particle Beam Cannon, Thermal Detonator, Acid Stream Launcher, Imperial Detonator, Glop, Cryoban, C22, and C12..................In that EXACT ORDER IS HOW THE DAMAGE SHOULD BE DONE. Rocket launcher's of course being the highest at say max damage of 10,000 and then the C12's being the lowest having1,000 max damage. Yes people 10,000 Max damage you read right with heavy armor piercing. Commando's are supposed to be commando's. They are already reduced in PvP by 75% so that's not what they are going to be used for anyway.

Thanks for this awesome thread. I hope it accomplishes something.