Commando Archive
Thread: I was wrong and right about the 2.5x modifier (chatlogs inside)
I think the thing we need now is for a second person to independently verify these results and let us know.
Oh, and the delay on the specials is supposed to be just the old weapon speed formula, so:
(speed of weapon) x (special delay factor) x ((100 - weapon speed skill adjustment)/100)
I've never seen what the delayfactors are for our FT specials, but assuming a 10.5 second firing time (the combat logs show something between 10 and 11 seconds), using a 4.6 speed weapon (and we know bikebum has a 45 weapon speed skill) that means the delay mod on FS2 is about 4.1 or 4.2.
This thread is useful is only for that info.
That means my FT (3.3 speed) should have a delay using FS2 of about 7.4 to 7.6 seconds. My impression is that my delay was about 8 seconds, so this fits nicely.
On the LP question, the other poster is correct that you will need to factor out your unarmed toughness in determining what the damage multiplier is (if any) on the LP. You will take less damage unarmed than you will holding the LP.
Great post
Not at all suggesting that your results are not reliable...just that independent confirmation of results from a new source is always a good thing.
How did you cut and paste the combat log text into the forums, by the way? Oh and thanks for the tips regarding timestamps. I never saw that option.
Why so negative Xytroncore? FYI, you are correct, in that situation I had my pet (stimpy) on an add, and could not have killed the 2 pikets without him. I also used him to tank so I could demonstrate my special time. However, when I pull the pikets single, I, and you for that matter, should have no difficulty soloing (true solo with no pet) as long as you avoid the beating you can take during the special cooldown. I have done it many times to verify my dropping CH, which is the whole reason I have been doing these tests.
As far as having 75% composite, that isn't actually true. The bracer you used as an example is an effectiveness sliced peice that is 49%. However, my TKA unarmed toughness is also figured into the damage I take when unarmed.
Some more logging as requested:
[Combat] 01:19:24 You stand up.
[Combat] 01:19:36 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 139 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:38 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 199 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:40 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 159 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:40 a piket longhorn female hits you for 217 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:40 Your Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 150 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:41 You shoot at a piket longhorn female, but he dodges out of the way.
[Combat] 01:19:42 a piket longhorn female hits you for 287 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:42 Your Composite Armor Helmet armor prevented 198 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:43 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 99 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:44 a piket longhorn female hits you for 280 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:44 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 193 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:45 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 152 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:46 a piket longhorn female hits you for 250 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:46 Your Composite Armor Helmet armor prevented 172 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:47 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 247 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:48 a piket longhorn female hits you for 187 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:48 Your Composite Armor Left Bicep armor prevented 129 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:48 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 217 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:50 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 261 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:50 a piket longhorn female hits you for 172 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:50 Your Composite Armor Gloves armor prevented 127 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:51 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 234 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:52 a piket longhorn female hits you for 122 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:52 Your Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 84 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:52 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 316 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:54 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 237 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:54 a piket longhorn female hits you for 157 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:54 Your Composite Armor Helmet armor prevented 108 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:55 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 220 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:56 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 237 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:56 a piket longhorn female hits you for 188 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:56 Your Composite Armor Left Bicep armor prevented 130 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:58 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 262 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:58 a piket longhorn female hits you for 112 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:19:58 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 76 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:19:59 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 196 points of damage.
Above you can see that I started out with LP and switched to unarmed. When I had the LP equipped, the base damage was near 259, and once unarmed it dropped to around 156 (60% drop). Possibly our LP takes a 1.5x modifier?
[Combat] 01:25:48 You stand up.
[Combat] 01:25:57 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 263 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:25:59 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 350 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:01 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 243 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:01 a piket longhorn female hits you for 157 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:26:01 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 108 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:02 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 309 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:03 a piket longhorn female misses you!
[Combat] 01:26:04 You shoot at a piket longhorn female, but he dodges out of the way.
[Combat] 01:26:05 a piket longhorn female hits you for 213 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:26:05 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 146 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:06 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 127 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:07 a piket longhorn female hits you for 185 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:26:07 Your Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 128 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:08 You shoot at a piket longhorn female but miss.
[Combat] 01:26:09 a piket longhorn female misses you!
[Combat] 01:26:09 You shoot at a piket longhorn female but miss.
[Combat] 01:26:11 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit him, but he counterattacks!
[Combat] 01:26:11 a piket longhorn female misses you!
[Combat] 01:26:13 You shoot at a piket longhorn female and hit for 301 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:13 a piket longhorn female hits you for 294 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:26:13 Your Composite Armor Left Bicep armor prevented 204 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:14 (Bad) misses a piket longhorn female!
[Combat] 01:26:15 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 317 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:15 a piket longhorn female hits you for 185 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:26:15 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 127 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:26:16 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 234 points of damage.
Above another example with LP, slightly less dramatic.
[Combat] 01:33:14 You stand up.
[Combat] 01:33:25 You use your flamethrower to spray concentrated fire on a piket longhorn female for 5516 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:33:29 a piket longhorn female hits you for 312 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:33:29 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 215 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:33 a piket longhorn female hits you for 120 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:33:33 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 82 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:36 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 275 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:36 a piket longhorn female hits you for 206 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:33:36 Your Composite Armor Pants armor prevented 142 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:37 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 270 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:38 a piket longhorn female misses you!
[Combat] 01:33:38 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 309 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:40 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 326 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:40 a piket longhorn female hits you for 167 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:33:40 Your Composite Armor Gloves armor prevented 123 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:41 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 302 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:42 a piket longhorn female hits you for 186 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:33:42 Your Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 128 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:42 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 264 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:44 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 252 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:44 a piket longhorn female hits you for 122 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:33:44 Your Composite Armor Right Bracer armor prevented 90 points of damage.
[Combat] 01:33:45 You swing at a piket longhorn female and hit for 308 points of damage.
Another example of the FT 2.5x modifier... note the first hit was with FT equipped and subsequent with VK's equipped. The following is the worst I have been hit for during my tests with FT equipped:
[Combat] 01:50:24 a piket longhorn hits you for 436 points of damage!
[Combat] 01:50:24 Your Composite Armor Pants armor prevented 304 points of damage.
Remember when you look at this, I do not have 69% composite, it is the fact that the Piket has AP0 attack against my AF1 45% composite. Note that since I had FT equipped my unarmed toughness bonuses do not get factored in.
So, I'd say there are plenty of modifiers out there. Please bear in mind that when I do these tests I am armored with 45-49% composite and have unarmed toughness that both reduce my damage taken. However, the base damages would be the same regardless of armor or amount of training in TKA.
-Krillin- wrote:
Couple obs:
1) Great post....nice to see some data about this problem.
2) You're data is pretty consistent, but the sample size is a little small. We've all had the phenomenon that mobs hit once for 200, and another time for 700. Since the trend is pretty consistent I'll buy it however.
3) Seems like your unarmed toughness kicks in immediatly after you unequip. I'm wondering if that would be the same for us without TK...ie, is this the ua toughness modifying a 2.5x dmg, or is this a wep shift from 2.5x to 1x with ua toughness added on. Seems like you were getting hit for 770 dmg equipped with ft (actual dmg plus that absorbed), then for 3-400 without. Seem like if you loose a 2.5x and add a 34% dmg reduction the final dmg should be more like 105 before armor.
4) Your armor is blocking everything. What a lucky duck....1 in 5 shots bypass my ubese and I take full dmg.
First of all, thanks for recognition of my work. On point #2, check out my other post of a fight with an entire piket lair.
On #3 you are correct that unarmed toughness does kick in when I equip VKs. I also know this to work when you have no TKA at all, since I just got my TKA skills 2 days ago and I used the same technique prior. Only problem is that you will not see as dramatic a reduction in the damage. Note also that your conception of the damage with armor is slightly off. The base damage is just that, base damage, I am actually taking the base damage minus my armor absorb when I am hit. IE. If it says, "piket longhorn female hits you for 400 damage. Your composite chest absorbs 250 damage. I am actually only taking 150 damage (the # that floats above my head).
On #4, I used to have the exact same problem. I did some logging and asking of questions and found out that holes are created due to additional items worn other than your armor. So when I am armored I wear nothing but the armor and weapon. That means remove all jewelry, glasses, backpacks, sashes, belts, etc and you will see the armor "hole" disappear to near extinction (it happens very rarely to me now).
Thanks for your support and hopefully I helped some.
I can concur with what's been determined here. Here's something I find quite usefull.
/ui action toolbarSlot06; /flamesingle2; /pause 2; /ui action toolbarSlot05;
This arms my flamethrower, torches some poor beast/player, and rearmed my VKs. Minimal 2.5x dmg exposure and nice quick FT special. This works with the cone specials as well. (Many o' times my groupmates have complained to me in teamspeak due to me killing the other "add" pikets while we're all still fighting the first.. Too bad Longhorn's weren't vulnerable to fire like normal pikets.)
Sedory - commando/teras kasi artist
I have "only" Flamethrower specialization 3 if anyone wants to know.
Basespeed is 3.3
weapon speed flamethrower
[Chat] 22:23:00 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 1078 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:02 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 1068 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:04 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 764 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:06 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 1133 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:09 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 1159 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:11 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 841 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:12 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 1191 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:15 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 809 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:23:17 You shoot at an Imperial encampment and hit for 727 points of damage.
special single1 flamethrower
[Chat] 22:21:17 You use your flamethrower on Hove Eektoufoska (an Imperial Colonel) for 2688 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:21:17 Hove Eektoufoska (an Imperial Colonel) shoots at you and hits for 217 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:21:17 Your Advanced Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 160 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:21:19 Hove Eektoufoska (an Imperial Colonel) shoots at you and hits for 121 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:21:19 Ogro Hergo (an Imperial trooper) shoots at you and misses.
[Chat] 22:21:21 Hove Eektoufoska (an Imperial Colonel) shoots at you and misses.
[Chat] 22:21:23 Ogro Hergo (an Imperial trooper) shoots at you and misses.
[Chat] 22:21:25 Hove Eektoufoska (an Imperial Colonel) shoots at you and hits for 122 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:21:26 You shoot at Ogro Hergo (an Imperial trooper) and hit for 702 points of damage.
You see the speed is less than 10 seconds (it's even somewhat under 9 seconds I think.)
Though I doubt we will ever see someone spamming flame-specials
Launcher pistol vs scoutblaster:
LP:
[Chat] 22:24:12 a squill hits you for 130 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:14 a squill hits you for 123 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:14 Your Advanced Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 91 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:24:17 a squill hits you for 142 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:17 Your Advanced Composite Armor Right Bicep armor prevented 103 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:24:21 a squill misses you!
[Chat] 22:24:25 a squill misses you!
[Chat] 22:24:28 a squill hits you for 154 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:28 Your Advanced Composite Armor Right Bicep armor prevented 113 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:24:33 a squill misses you!
[Chat] 22:24:36 a squill hits you for 88 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:36 Your Advanced Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 64 points of damage.
SB:
[Chat] 22:24:41 a squill hits you for 116 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:45 a squill hits you for 101 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:49 a squill hits you for 110 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:52 a squill misses you!
[Chat] 22:24:57 a squill hits you for 86 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:24:57 Your Advanced Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 62 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:25:00 a squill hits you for 85 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:25:05 a squill misses you!
[Chat] 22:25:10 a squill hits you for 95 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:25:10 Your Advanced Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 69 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:25:14 a squill misses you!
[Chat] 22:25:17 a squill hits you for 117 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:25:20 a squill hits you for 111 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:25:20 Your Advanced Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 82 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:25:25 a squill hits you for 102 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:25:25 Your Advanced Composite Armor Chest Plate armor prevented 74 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:25:29 a squill hits you for 100 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:25:29 Your Advanced Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 73 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:25:33 a squill hits you for 155 points of damage!
[Chat] 22:25:33 Your Advanced Composite Armor Boots armor prevented 115 points of damage.
[Chat] 22:25:38 a squill hits you for 141 points of damage!
I tried it multiple times; there is no difference between the two. You don't have any penalty with a LP compared to any other pistol.
That means we all have to have a switch weapon key now.
And get the fastest flamethrower around instead of the most powerful.
I didn't think you were implying that they were false... As far as getting your chatlog into your post:
For me they are in Program Files\StarWarsGalaxies\profiles\<your account name>\<your server>\character name_chatlog.txt
Just open it up with notepad or whatever and highlight and cut as usual. Then in the little posting box, just use right-click to bring drop-down out and paste. Its a little screwy with the way these forums don't allow editing, but you will figure it out. I usually preview post just to make sure it went through before I submit.
Couple obs:
1) Great post....nice to see some data about this problem.
2) You're data is pretty consistent, but the sample size is a little small. We've all had the phenomenon that mobs hit once for 200, and another time for 700. Since the trend is pretty consistent I'll buy it however.
3) Seems like your unarmed toughness kicks in immediatly after you unequip. I'm wondering if that would be the same for us without TK...ie, is this the ua toughness modifying a 2.5x dmg, or is this a wep shift from 2.5x to 1x with ua toughness added on. Seems like you were getting hit for 770 dmg equipped with ft (actual dmg plus that absorbed), then for 3-400 without. Seem like if you loose a 2.5x and add a 34% dmg reduction the final dmg should be more like 105 before armor.
4) Your armor is blocking everything. What a lucky duck....1 in 5 shots bypass my ubese and I take full dmg.
I've always stated 9 for my flame thrower ( 4.3 sec )
However, I've said TWENTY ( 20 ) for my HAR ( Heavy Acid Rifle ), which is completely true - at least for a 5.2 sec HAR.