Commando Archive
Thread: I would like to take up Garibaldi's sword...
Your introductory should list all the problems you see, and how you are going to present them to SOE in representation of the commando class. we dont care about anything else and neither does SOE."
A great list of issues has already been provided by you all and Garibaldi - relisting it here would not be productive. I have interest in building on what he started, and as such, felt it more appropriate to introduce myself moreso that reiterate many things that have been said.
The correspondent's job is to verify and index the class problems, absolutely, but the profession's situation varies wildly by server depending on resources. Your flamethrower problem might be unknown to me, and while you have frustrations with the 0.0 ideal range (which is a problem), many of us would be thankful to be able to get a single point of heavy weapons exp.
With that in mind, I see the correspondent as the grand coordinator and representative to the community. While I would certainly be obligated to take personal initiative and root out problems, I consider it equally (if note more) important to turn a well-tuned ear to you all. Representatives are the singular voices of the people's collective voice , and that's precisely what I intend to be.
My first post outlines a few simple ideas about how to communicate these issues and publicly invite feedback and additions. As time progresses and my potential exchange with SOE begins, I am sure that other inroads will present themselves about how to best communicate.
Sorry, the class doesnt suck and technically not broken just severely out of balance. It has faults that can only be fixed by testing and presenting to the devs.
In my eye you only want to repost garibaldis lists of issues. That is fine maybe until tommorrow, when supposedly a good handful of those issues get fixed.
What happens when new issues appear, what are you going to do about it? The correspondent needs to be able to test everything. Not necessarily to pinpoint new issues, but also be able to test existing ones. You say you dont have resources on your server to progress and try new weapons. Well right there I dont think your the right person for the job under those circumstances.
MaDCoW8Me wrote:Sorry, the class doesnt suck and technically not broken
You are obviously not a commando.
dopkick wrote:
MaDCoW8Me wrote:
Sorry, the class doesnt suck and technically not broken
You are obviously not a commando.
Wrong. The class works sinceyou can advance once the weapons are available. Its not broken, its out of balance in respect to damage.
Do I think you'd do a better job than most? No. Do I think anyone would? No.
Sorry, if and when SoE decides to replace Garibaldi, I'm certain the flood of applications from this forum will be incredible.
"Wrong. The class works sinceyou can advance once the weapons are available. Its not broken, its out of balance in respect to damage."
Yes, that's one situation. Another is that some servers cannot advance at all. That's the reason we have a public, community forum - because the problems, testing, and subsequent findings will vary from galaxy to galaxy. Your feedback is one important component, mine is another, as is everyone else's.
But the problem with the Commando goes well beyond "damage balance". As with many professions in this game, there is no clear understanding of what the role of the profession really is. Right now it's very hard to pinpoint how a Commando would fit into a group, interact in PvP, or otherwise fill a need in the universe.
There has been a lot of speculation on the matter. My personal take is that the Commando should be the one stop firepower shop when it comes to combat. They should be positioned in the support positiondealing immeasurable amounts of damage. We are the proverbial big guns.
The problem with this vision is that we're nowhere close to it. Nevermind broken accuracy, damage and availability - we're not positioned to be the heavy damage dealers and experts in large weaponry. We require unarmed combat, which totallybetrays the rest of our tree. We master 3 weapon types with Master Marksman, but use none of them in our final profession. We're grossly underdeveloped in the realm of specials, passive bonuses and defenses relevant to our trade. A pistoleer can outdamage us over a given period of time, and that's just incorrect.
This is about so much more than the math. It's about slotting the Commando into the universe in a meaningful, useful way such that being one is a gratifying experience, but an experience that takes hard work and diligence to achieve. Right now we work hard and get stonewalled, or met with more painful labor. There is no payoff to being a Commando, even if you have a flamethrower. If you fix the damage, you still won't be much more than a sub-optimal pistoleer clone with flame effects.
So many professions in this game seem arbitrarily included - the designers seem to add professions just because they think they ought to, not because they make sense. We know that it's probably not the case, but I feel like they need some help implementing the idea - there needs to be work done to shape it into something worthwhile.
I'm afraid it is the case in several places that they put in prof's because it "seemed to fit" in name but did not flesh out how they fit. Rangers seemed a bit of an after thought... "oh, we got to add them in too, people will ask for them". They are Super-Scouts. No point it seemed... I think they did the Commando even worse, at least they seemed to have tested rangers in detail... why do I get the feeling Commandos were untested? Commandos aren't even "Super-Marksman" or "Super-Unhanded"... and they have the TKA classalready! Really REALLY sad to spend MORE points to go BACKWARDS! No, I don't mean to flame here but I get the feeling they did just that: put in a class because they had it in the stories and didn't give it the detail needed.
Ibiro wrote:
...many good things - snip...
So many professions in this game seem arbitrarily included - the designers seem to add professions just because they think they ought to, not because they make sense. We know that it's probably not the case, but I feel like they need some help implementing the idea - there needs to be work done to shape it into something worthwhile.
Thank you. I also appreciate you being critical and not settling for "not good enough".
More on the Commando vision; a few more possibilities:
1) Commando as Rambo
In this case, Marksman and Unarmed Spec would make perfect sense. If you consider the myth that is "Rambo", he was a jack of all trades chaos maker. He blew things up, shot lots of people, threw knives, and caused so much mayhem that it achieved results.
He could snipe an enemy, turn and stab another, hit the C4 and drop an armored vehicle and still look good doing it (though his hair was really lame).
This version of the Commando is a master of crowd control, which is an honor currently owned exclusively by the Creature Handlers (and arguably some Bounty Hunters). Fast and quick responses to changing battlefield conditions, ability to bounce between weapon types, and a seemingly supernatural ability to be prepared for anything - that's what this Commando would be about.
That means a few things. Bonuses to speed associated with switching tasks, multi-weapon special attacks (wouldn't that be slick; you hit aspecial move called One-Two hitand it pulls your pistol, kneecaps someone, then goes rifle and gives em a headshot), and an increased level of damage resistance and avoidance. The Field Tactics tree would be a great repository for many of these passive additions and its currently underdeveloped considering the difficulty behind getting Combat Exp.
Grenades and more advanced explosives are a must, and bonuses to accuracy while moving would be an appropriate addition. This is a mobile, agile, and hostile Commando that can really mix it up.
2) Commando as Battleship
This is the aforementioned artillery piece. In this case, Unarmed Spec is a worthless skill and should not be included. Master Marksman is arguably worthless too, unless some of the specials can be rolled into the Commando weapons suite.
In this scenario you might consider re-introducing the Engineering line as justification for improving understanding and operation of the heaviest of weaponry, and also introduce the ability to make one's own grenades and weapon powerups. The Commando specific-crafting can be introduced in the Support Weapons line which can function as an adjunct to understanding of complex weapons systems.
This Commando drops the big damage. He/she'll probably be slower and much less mobile, but it's all about the Hail Mary, and the Commando has it in spades. Positioned at the bank of most groups near the healers, this trooper would offer advanced fire support on the largest threat level targets, and offer some much needed workarounds (and versatility) for advanced armor and resistances.
Current Commando weapons do this well with the flame and acid damage (grenades, too), and being able to pick the right big gun for the job would be a critical part of being effective.
I would like to see more specials that not only augment damage, but that introduce additional special state effects that help control crowds. Why not have a damaging blast that does AoE, but also has a chance to intimidate? It would be slow and expensive, but it's befitting of what would happen if someone dropped an acid bomb on your squad's head. You'd freak out, burn, and hopefully die.
These are two ideas. There are many more (how about Commando as saboteur and infiltrator?) and I'm sure you all have some great ideas. Even if you're not supportive of me in the correspondent role, let's turn this thread into a more freeform brainstorming session. Let's start thinking about what we can do with what we have been provided, and let's start adding some things that are off the wall and new. The answer lies in the middle.