Commando Archive
Thread: Commando Verbatim
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StarNick
Mon Sep 12, 2005 4:32 pm
#1
[Just posted this over in the you know where, Sorry that this was a bit late...was busier than I thought I would be, plus editing this all proved to be...a hassle. Boo to Internet Explorer! Learning to code better in firefox FTW!]
To start off, this isn't to bash anyone or anything but is a cumulation of what the Commando Community right now is feeling and saying that may simply not be heard by some folks internally. I've tried my best in relaying concerns as well issues of the profession and trying to get something back to the folks who, like me, love to play as a commando. Right now the only news we have is from Jo-don, that our AoE is being worked on, and it can be very frustrating asking for direct feedback on some of our issues and getting absolutely nothing in return.
As a result, the community is frustrated and unhappy, combine that with a lack of hope due to zero developer feedback and its not a wonder why many have left the profession since the Combat Upgrade went live. I would very much wish this be forwarded internally, and without further ado:
General Impressions of a Returning Commando
My intial impressions: I really like the combat upgrade. I have enjoyed it thusfar, and I think the devs did an overall good job. I like the new icons, the cross-class specials, and the stackability. I think class balance has been greatly improved, and the con system works outstandingly now. I also love the new HAM bar.
After screwing around with the system for 30+ hours, I have only one question:
Why the HELL would anyone choose commando?
Seriously! Has anyone seen the movie "Twins?" Scientists genetically engineer 2 twins, and the Governator (Arnold) gets all the good traits and Danny DeVito gets all the leftover crap?
My friends, WE are Danny DeVito...
Where do I even start:
(1) DPS not that much better than other classes - Sure commando pure damage is a little better on most weapons. However, in the pure TH tradition, it appears that the devs are STILL ignoring DPS and delay timers. Bumping a weapons' damage up several notches and increasing the delay timer does nothing....why is this so hard to comprehend? I thought we were supposed to be a 5 in damage...since when does 5=3?
(2) Our AOE...are you KIDDING me - Ok...ignore for a second that AOE is currently broken on ALMOST EVERY SINGLE weapon we have (and the fact that it appears it has been that way for 6+ months)...
What good is our AOE?
Has anyone ever run into a group of Storm Troopers (or any other NPC with guns for that matter) and tried to keep them in a 6m radius of each other? Obviously the developers haven't. It's like freaking cat herding...NPCs scatter in every direction upon attack.
The result of this change is that (1) commandos' initial shot aggros the intended mobs PLUS every other mob in a 6 mile radius, and (2) if they are NPCs or creatures with ranged attacks, those mobs then scatter in every direction so you can never use AOE on them again. You get WAY to many mobs shooting/attacking you from the start, and likely can't use your AOE to attack them because of the AOE radius.
Again...this assumes that the AOE even works (which I guess is too much to ask).
AOE needs some sort of ON/OFF button so we can control aggro better. Maybe ALL our heavy weapons should be single-mob attacks, but the devs could give us a buff that makes heavy weapons (not regular weapons) AOE for 10 minutes. At least then we could turn it on and off as needed.
(3) State Effects - What's with this "might" stick crap? Either our weapon has a state effect, or it doesn't. I spent a couple of hours playing with different classes abilities and templates...each of the other classes was able to blind, stun, dizzy, etc. almost EVERY SINGLE TIME I tried it (at least 90%). Why can't we? If our weapons are our "specials," why do our specials have to suck so bad compared to other classes?
What good is blind if you have to shoot the mob until it gets down to 10% health to get the effect to stick (thereby eliminating the benefit of the effect).
Worst case scenerio, our weapons need to be sticking their state effects 75% of the time. I can accept that I may have to shoot twice to get an effect to stick...more than that is just stupid.
Additionally, there are only 6 or so state effects so our weapons' effects overlap all over the place. Why to we need multiple weapons that all do the same thing?
(4) Weapon switching - I realize that it appears the purpose of the commando profession appears to be to provide some strong (yeah right) weapons that other classes can pick up and use with their ranged templates. I'm fine with that.
HOWEVER, for fuller commando templates the effect of our 15 different weapons, most with their own little niche/effect, is ridiculous. Battle becomes a constant weapon switching extragavanza, during which you are (a) concentrating on whether the desired effect icon appears under the mob's HAM bar, and (b) concentrating on quickly switching weapons between effects because no weapon does everything you need.
How much fun is a battle if you never get to look down at it?
Sum - To me....what the devs did to commando beyond comprehension. Even if AOE is fixed, the commando class sucks and doesn't even begin to be a worthwhile class (even with stacked abilities from other classes). Feel free to comment and disagree if you like, but I doubt there will be many dissenters.....
(NOTE: I said WORTHWHILE...not viable.I'm sure commandos can kill things...my point is that there are tons of other classes that can do it better and more efficiently, thereby making it silly to choose commando)
In the meantime, I am seriously considering /respec'ing to BH instead of commando. I am a die-hard commando fan, but this is too much...
Help me out here! Is there something I am missing?
[Editor's Note: This commando went on further by suggesting some really cool ideas to improve the profession, since this is verbatim that was edited out. Those ideas will be in a proposal thread post.]
Impressions of our Role as a Damage Dealer
Everyday I keep fighting with my Commando weapons and they are crap, but I love them. I love the fire, the explotions ect. But Commando need to be like the other professions. And removed from Tank to Damage dealing.
I might be wrong but I do not see a Commando as a Tank, more like an Elite soldier doing alot of damage and having good protection against damage.
Just look at our weapons. A Rocket Launcher, thats rockets we shoot. NOT softballs. Its just silly how poor damage we can do with that weapon. A rifle is better against a Torrent. And thats BULLETS. Thats wrong. Then we have Plasma flame thrower, also a weapon that can do much more damage. That thing burn stuff. Ok?
All of our weapons look powerfull but are not. They are poo. And remove the special attacks inside them and let us have special attacks like other profession have.
And maybe give us a new weapon. A SWG minigun. That would be cool.
But do not make us UBER when you start working on Commando. Just give us a buff on our weapons and damage dealing. And give us special attacks like the others. You can even keep the ones we have, just place them outside the weapons. I do not like that I cant do blind attack if I feel like or knock down. I'm forced to change weapons over and over, or do other profession to get special attacks.
Thank you.
I never felt Commando is anywhere being close to consideration as a damage dealer.
I can be faster, more accurate, a better damage dealer, land some very reliable states, and perform these actions with almost half the SAC cost of Commando weapons. I can do all these abilities better than Master Commando with area or single target attacks. I can do it with Master Carbineer.
im not asking for too much. im asking for stuff that would make commando useful. Cause right now its 'mostly harmless'
I personally LOVE the AoE and state attacks of our weapons. It gives me a comfy feeling that I can blind and put another state on someone at the same time, and that I can do it to an area of targets.
Right now, commando is only good for medium damage dealing and laying weapon-specific and other-profession-specific states, like smuggler.
Once they fix AoE damage to the correct levels, we will see the DAMAGE dealing part of this profession surface, because it is seriously lacking right now. The AoE for laying states is WONDERFUL!
Our Weapons being our Specials (with nothing else to produce damage)
The issue of 100/40 appears to be the SOE design intent for most Commando weapons (LBC seems to be 100/100 I understand).
If the commando AOE with Legshot were to be effective, the splash damage we deal would need to be larger than the AOE damage caused by other professions AOE specials (aka pistoleer fanshot). Commando firing Legshot > Pistoleer firing Fanshot over the same period of time. Whether 100/40 is enough to do that remains to be seen. Maybe someone can run the math.
But a commando that has pistoleer fanshot should be able to do pistoleer fanshot 100/100 with a commando weapon just like he could with a pistol, don't you agree? It seems like that is not the plan, that our 100/40 will override the fanshot. That means, we will do less damage for a special we EARNED by dabbling. That seems unfair to me.
Now if part of fixing the AOE is the unexpected nerf of all the OTHER professions AOE attacks to do 100/40 levels of damage, then maybe we are on an even footing. But that's not how anyone in this community would want the AOE fix to work. But given past performance, I wouldn't discount SOE's ability to nerf where no nerf is needed.
Uh... have you noticed other ranged proffessions also have aoe (which works now btw..full damage) AND can use it with much, MUCH higher damage output? Go stand next to said mr. rifleman using spray shot or fan shot when your aoe is working and you'll see just how sadly outdamaged you will be.
The only thing about our AOE is that it puts a fire dot. thats it. Working AOE for commando means diddly SQUAT as pistoleer/carbineer/BH already have working AOE.. with ANY weapon. without switching weapons. For much higher damage.
And please admit it, the only reason why you would want working aoe is to do damage to multiple targets...not to put insignificant debuffs on them (you can do that now for all the good it does...zilch). Grab an advanced laser rifle and start spamming fan shot and you'll get your aoe high damage. COMMANDOS HAVE NO ROLE AS AOE WARRIORS BECAUSE OTHER PROFFS HAVE IT.
This BS notion that our specials are built into the weapons is ludicrious. There is ZERO advantage to be forced to switch weapons to KD or Blind or DOT compared to other proffessions that can KD blind and stun and dizzy and bleed and snare and root and slow attack speed you without switching their weapon.
And when it comes down to it, its DAMAGE that rules a fight not how well you can debuff the other guy... cause while you apply the miserable short lasting, unnoticable effect of most debuffs (especially blind) te other guy is nailing your health down hard.
Impression of being an AoE-only Profession (and little else)
Given our high SAC and lower speed, that alone would balance our ability to outspam damage than other professions AOE specials. So, in my book, the solution is 100/100 AOE damage on commando weapons.
We will deal some pretty heavy hits on a large number of targets, then we'll be out of action pool and left to marksman specials for a while. Our friends the pistoleers, spray shotters, and all other AOE special wielding professions will be able to keep firing off their AOE specials, since they will still have action, since they don't have insane SAC.
Once AOE works, then adjust weapon damage ranges (seems complicated) or speed (add a little general/HW speed in a tree, seems easy) so that we come out X% (you pick the number) higher than the other professions AOE damage over the same period of time and then we will be the AOE damage dealing profession. The key is measuring the damage output over the same period of time, not per shot.
Test it. Get an MBH/MCommando/Carb and a MBH/MPistoleer/Carb out on the firing range. Both start blasting target. Commando fires Improved Legshot with PFT (our best weapon, but can't PUP). Pistoleer fires Improved Fanshot with his best weapon (with PUP). When Commando is out of action pool, start firing marksman specials. Both keep firing until Commando action pool is full again. Both stop firing. Add up damage to main target and splash targets for both the commando and the pistoleer. The result should have the the Commando X% more total damage dealt to the splash target than the pistoleer. Keep running the test and adjusting the results until you achieve the design objective, where commando does somewhat more damage than a pistoleer (X%). Rinse and repeat for other weapons, professions, PUP combinations, skill tape mixes, etc. Now SOE has a real way to test it's design before asking us to check it out on Test Center.
It's fair, it's balanced. Is is likely?
One Commando's Impression when he asked that the Plasma Flamethrower (our CL54 weapon) could not be power-uped
I just had crafted for me one nasty PFT
However i could not put my pups on it...
I have only used the proton rifle till this point and it took my pups.
So when I finally get the PFT I wanted ... it will not take pups?
Is this a bug? do i need melee pups for the PFT (odd but asking)? or can you simply not pup this?
When he recieved his answer, his reply was this:
Wow... that is so lame
This is only a sampling of the many, many thoughts and opinions that generate in the Commando Forums, and in my opinion provides a fairly accurate overview. The majority are frustrated with the lack of...anything, some (I have to include myself on this too) are optimistic that AoE if made into 100% splash damage, exactly like AoE specials from other professions, will greatly improve our current situation.
However, we all pretty much agree that the Commando Profession is not what the Combat Upgrade pitched to the community and when it comes to our role of a damage dealer or our pairing in a melee template...we do not come up to standards. In this, we are inflexible...where we should be flexible.
To start off, this isn't to bash anyone or anything but is a cumulation of what the Commando Community right now is feeling and saying that may simply not be heard by some folks internally. I've tried my best in relaying concerns as well issues of the profession and trying to get something back to the folks who, like me, love to play as a commando. Right now the only news we have is from Jo-don, that our AoE is being worked on, and it can be very frustrating asking for direct feedback on some of our issues and getting absolutely nothing in return.
As a result, the community is frustrated and unhappy, combine that with a lack of hope due to zero developer feedback and its not a wonder why many have left the profession since the Combat Upgrade went live. I would very much wish this be forwarded internally, and without further ado:
General Impressions of a Returning Commando
My intial impressions: I really like the combat upgrade. I have enjoyed it thusfar, and I think the devs did an overall good job. I like the new icons, the cross-class specials, and the stackability. I think class balance has been greatly improved, and the con system works outstandingly now. I also love the new HAM bar.
After screwing around with the system for 30+ hours, I have only one question:
Why the HELL would anyone choose commando?
Seriously! Has anyone seen the movie "Twins?" Scientists genetically engineer 2 twins, and the Governator (Arnold) gets all the good traits and Danny DeVito gets all the leftover crap?
My friends, WE are Danny DeVito...
Where do I even start:
(1) DPS not that much better than other classes - Sure commando pure damage is a little better on most weapons. However, in the pure TH tradition, it appears that the devs are STILL ignoring DPS and delay timers. Bumping a weapons' damage up several notches and increasing the delay timer does nothing....why is this so hard to comprehend? I thought we were supposed to be a 5 in damage...since when does 5=3?
(2) Our AOE...are you KIDDING me - Ok...ignore for a second that AOE is currently broken on ALMOST EVERY SINGLE weapon we have (and the fact that it appears it has been that way for 6+ months)...
What good is our AOE?
Has anyone ever run into a group of Storm Troopers (or any other NPC with guns for that matter) and tried to keep them in a 6m radius of each other? Obviously the developers haven't. It's like freaking cat herding...NPCs scatter in every direction upon attack.
The result of this change is that (1) commandos' initial shot aggros the intended mobs PLUS every other mob in a 6 mile radius, and (2) if they are NPCs or creatures with ranged attacks, those mobs then scatter in every direction so you can never use AOE on them again. You get WAY to many mobs shooting/attacking you from the start, and likely can't use your AOE to attack them because of the AOE radius.
Again...this assumes that the AOE even works (which I guess is too much to ask).
AOE needs some sort of ON/OFF button so we can control aggro better. Maybe ALL our heavy weapons should be single-mob attacks, but the devs could give us a buff that makes heavy weapons (not regular weapons) AOE for 10 minutes. At least then we could turn it on and off as needed.
(3) State Effects - What's with this "might" stick crap? Either our weapon has a state effect, or it doesn't. I spent a couple of hours playing with different classes abilities and templates...each of the other classes was able to blind, stun, dizzy, etc. almost EVERY SINGLE TIME I tried it (at least 90%). Why can't we? If our weapons are our "specials," why do our specials have to suck so bad compared to other classes?
What good is blind if you have to shoot the mob until it gets down to 10% health to get the effect to stick (thereby eliminating the benefit of the effect).
Worst case scenerio, our weapons need to be sticking their state effects 75% of the time. I can accept that I may have to shoot twice to get an effect to stick...more than that is just stupid.
Additionally, there are only 6 or so state effects so our weapons' effects overlap all over the place. Why to we need multiple weapons that all do the same thing?
(4) Weapon switching - I realize that it appears the purpose of the commando profession appears to be to provide some strong (yeah right) weapons that other classes can pick up and use with their ranged templates. I'm fine with that.
HOWEVER, for fuller commando templates the effect of our 15 different weapons, most with their own little niche/effect, is ridiculous. Battle becomes a constant weapon switching extragavanza, during which you are (a) concentrating on whether the desired effect icon appears under the mob's HAM bar, and (b) concentrating on quickly switching weapons between effects because no weapon does everything you need.
How much fun is a battle if you never get to look down at it?
Sum - To me....what the devs did to commando beyond comprehension. Even if AOE is fixed, the commando class sucks and doesn't even begin to be a worthwhile class (even with stacked abilities from other classes). Feel free to comment and disagree if you like, but I doubt there will be many dissenters.....
(NOTE: I said WORTHWHILE...not viable.I'm sure commandos can kill things...my point is that there are tons of other classes that can do it better and more efficiently, thereby making it silly to choose commando)
In the meantime, I am seriously considering /respec'ing to BH instead of commando. I am a die-hard commando fan, but this is too much...
Help me out here! Is there something I am missing?
[Editor's Note: This commando went on further by suggesting some really cool ideas to improve the profession, since this is verbatim that was edited out. Those ideas will be in a proposal thread post.]
Impressions of our Role as a Damage Dealer
Everyday I keep fighting with my Commando weapons and they are crap, but I love them. I love the fire, the explotions ect. But Commando need to be like the other professions. And removed from Tank to Damage dealing.
I might be wrong but I do not see a Commando as a Tank, more like an Elite soldier doing alot of damage and having good protection against damage.
Just look at our weapons. A Rocket Launcher, thats rockets we shoot. NOT softballs. Its just silly how poor damage we can do with that weapon. A rifle is better against a Torrent. And thats BULLETS. Thats wrong. Then we have Plasma flame thrower, also a weapon that can do much more damage. That thing burn stuff. Ok?
All of our weapons look powerfull but are not. They are poo. And remove the special attacks inside them and let us have special attacks like other profession have.
And maybe give us a new weapon. A SWG minigun. That would be cool.
But do not make us UBER when you start working on Commando. Just give us a buff on our weapons and damage dealing. And give us special attacks like the others. You can even keep the ones we have, just place them outside the weapons. I do not like that I cant do blind attack if I feel like or knock down. I'm forced to change weapons over and over, or do other profession to get special attacks.
Thank you.
I never felt Commando is anywhere being close to consideration as a damage dealer.
I can be faster, more accurate, a better damage dealer, land some very reliable states, and perform these actions with almost half the SAC cost of Commando weapons. I can do all these abilities better than Master Commando with area or single target attacks. I can do it with Master Carbineer.
im not asking for too much. im asking for stuff that would make commando useful. Cause right now its 'mostly harmless'
I personally LOVE the AoE and state attacks of our weapons. It gives me a comfy feeling that I can blind and put another state on someone at the same time, and that I can do it to an area of targets.
Right now, commando is only good for medium damage dealing and laying weapon-specific and other-profession-specific states, like smuggler.
Once they fix AoE damage to the correct levels, we will see the DAMAGE dealing part of this profession surface, because it is seriously lacking right now. The AoE for laying states is WONDERFUL!
Our Weapons being our Specials (with nothing else to produce damage)
The issue of 100/40 appears to be the SOE design intent for most Commando weapons (LBC seems to be 100/100 I understand).
If the commando AOE with Legshot were to be effective, the splash damage we deal would need to be larger than the AOE damage caused by other professions AOE specials (aka pistoleer fanshot). Commando firing Legshot > Pistoleer firing Fanshot over the same period of time. Whether 100/40 is enough to do that remains to be seen. Maybe someone can run the math.
But a commando that has pistoleer fanshot should be able to do pistoleer fanshot 100/100 with a commando weapon just like he could with a pistol, don't you agree? It seems like that is not the plan, that our 100/40 will override the fanshot. That means, we will do less damage for a special we EARNED by dabbling. That seems unfair to me.
Now if part of fixing the AOE is the unexpected nerf of all the OTHER professions AOE attacks to do 100/40 levels of damage, then maybe we are on an even footing. But that's not how anyone in this community would want the AOE fix to work. But given past performance, I wouldn't discount SOE's ability to nerf where no nerf is needed.
Uh... have you noticed other ranged proffessions also have aoe (which works now btw..full damage) AND can use it with much, MUCH higher damage output? Go stand next to said mr. rifleman using spray shot or fan shot when your aoe is working and you'll see just how sadly outdamaged you will be.
The only thing about our AOE is that it puts a fire dot. thats it. Working AOE for commando means diddly SQUAT as pistoleer/carbineer/BH already have working AOE.. with ANY weapon. without switching weapons. For much higher damage.
And please admit it, the only reason why you would want working aoe is to do damage to multiple targets...not to put insignificant debuffs on them (you can do that now for all the good it does...zilch). Grab an advanced laser rifle and start spamming fan shot and you'll get your aoe high damage. COMMANDOS HAVE NO ROLE AS AOE WARRIORS BECAUSE OTHER PROFFS HAVE IT.
This BS notion that our specials are built into the weapons is ludicrious. There is ZERO advantage to be forced to switch weapons to KD or Blind or DOT compared to other proffessions that can KD blind and stun and dizzy and bleed and snare and root and slow attack speed you without switching their weapon.
And when it comes down to it, its DAMAGE that rules a fight not how well you can debuff the other guy... cause while you apply the miserable short lasting, unnoticable effect of most debuffs (especially blind) te other guy is nailing your health down hard.
Impression of being an AoE-only Profession (and little else)
Given our high SAC and lower speed, that alone would balance our ability to outspam damage than other professions AOE specials. So, in my book, the solution is 100/100 AOE damage on commando weapons.
We will deal some pretty heavy hits on a large number of targets, then we'll be out of action pool and left to marksman specials for a while. Our friends the pistoleers, spray shotters, and all other AOE special wielding professions will be able to keep firing off their AOE specials, since they will still have action, since they don't have insane SAC.
Once AOE works, then adjust weapon damage ranges (seems complicated) or speed (add a little general/HW speed in a tree, seems easy) so that we come out X% (you pick the number) higher than the other professions AOE damage over the same period of time and then we will be the AOE damage dealing profession. The key is measuring the damage output over the same period of time, not per shot.
Test it. Get an MBH/MCommando/Carb and a MBH/MPistoleer/Carb out on the firing range. Both start blasting target. Commando fires Improved Legshot with PFT (our best weapon, but can't PUP). Pistoleer fires Improved Fanshot with his best weapon (with PUP). When Commando is out of action pool, start firing marksman specials. Both keep firing until Commando action pool is full again. Both stop firing. Add up damage to main target and splash targets for both the commando and the pistoleer. The result should have the the Commando X% more total damage dealt to the splash target than the pistoleer. Keep running the test and adjusting the results until you achieve the design objective, where commando does somewhat more damage than a pistoleer (X%). Rinse and repeat for other weapons, professions, PUP combinations, skill tape mixes, etc. Now SOE has a real way to test it's design before asking us to check it out on Test Center.
It's fair, it's balanced. Is is likely?
One Commando's Impression when he asked that the Plasma Flamethrower (our CL54 weapon) could not be power-uped
I just had crafted for me one nasty PFT
However i could not put my pups on it...
I have only used the proton rifle till this point and it took my pups.
So when I finally get the PFT I wanted ... it will not take pups?
Is this a bug? do i need melee pups for the PFT (odd but asking)? or can you simply not pup this?
When he recieved his answer, his reply was this:
Wow... that is so lame
This is only a sampling of the many, many thoughts and opinions that generate in the Commando Forums, and in my opinion provides a fairly accurate overview. The majority are frustrated with the lack of...anything, some (I have to include myself on this too) are optimistic that AoE if made into 100% splash damage, exactly like AoE specials from other professions, will greatly improve our current situation.
However, we all pretty much agree that the Commando Profession is not what the Combat Upgrade pitched to the community and when it comes to our role of a damage dealer or our pairing in a melee template...we do not come up to standards. In this, we are inflexible...where we should be flexible.
Message Edited by StarNick on 09-12-2005 07:58 PM
MrAndrson
Mon Sep 12, 2005 6:36 pm
#2
Awesome message you put together! Very well written and you took
messages from different people that cover the viewpoints we share.
I hope a reply comes soon, my respec message looks larger on my
screen each time I log........ Yes...we are all Danny DeVito..............
M. Commando
Raptor2k1
Mon Sep 12, 2005 6:55 pm
#3
Pretty accurate, IMO. Though this did make me think of how much better off we'd be if they left weapon specials obtained in the same boxes, but took 'em off the guns (ie. commando skills would be activatable AE specials w/ states). It'd vastly increase our stackability with other ranged professions, and this would let our guns get some well-deserved treatment too.
And really, can we please get a rocket launcher that hits like a rocket launcher? Is that too much to ask?
Edit: Left out an 'a' on accident, confusing sentence grammar.
Message Edited by Raptor2k1 on 09-12-2005 08:39 PM
StarNick
Mon Sep 12, 2005 7:25 pm
#4
For this, getting word that it was passed on internally will be golden. Either they're working on lots of cool stuff that they're not telling us about, or they are really unaware what you guys think of "their" vision of commando. Im hoping for the former honestly, but either way...this might do some good.
If nothing...there will be more verbatims.
If nothing...there will be more verbatims.
nbd9k
Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:27 am
#5
you might point out that in the YEARS leading up to the combad upgrade, every complaint was answered with "wait for the combat rebalance, it will fix all of your problems." thats how long it took for them to get to us, and in the end it seems to have made things worse.
i will point out, however, that commando in a supporting role (not the primary damage dealer) is reasonably effective. when i still played, i joined a group that had a Jedi as the tank/ damage dealer, a rifleman, a pistoleer, and myself. between the pistoleer and i, we were able to keep so many effects on our targets that the jedi had little trouble dispatching them, and since my attacks were the weakest of the bunch, i was never agro'ed. It doesnt follow the proposed commmando schema, but it's something. we are more like: damage 2, crowd control 4, defence 4.
Latenighter
Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:56 am
#8
Great idea and great job Nick.
I doubt there will be any response whatsoever. But I'm a in a pessimistic mood.
I doubt there will be any response whatsoever. But I'm a in a pessimistic mood.
Message Edited by Latenighter on 09-13-2005 11:11 PM
"If they can be fooled, they can be killed."
zRhyno
Tue Sep 13, 2005 8:45 pm
#10
I have my 3 Heavy Weapon +25 mods(on mando now), just waiting to come back when its worthwhile again 
A I M E S
RankorCity
Tue Sep 13, 2005 10:11 pm
#11
Great post, Nick...Seems you've picked up a bit of my sarcasm in your wording!
Cat hearding - CLASSIC
Commando = Danny DeVito - CLASSIC
On a more serious note, it is an EXCELLENT post...
The CU, when you take a step back and look at it, really didnt "balance" anything...
PreCU: Ranged king was rifles, with defenses from TKM / Pistoleer, and some medic. Melee king was fencer/tkm/doc
PostCU: Ranged kingis MBH/mix/CM......Melee kingis TKM/Swords/CM or Doc
And people arent just BH for Jedi missions/NPC loot....They're BH's because it has the best attacks and best mods. People are TKMs/Swords/Doc because it has the best chance to deal with Jedi in PvP (defenses, and healing ability) - same as defense stackers preCU. Heal stackingis the "new" old defense stacking. The CU, as it applies to Commando, has made it more obsoleet than it was preCU. Every other prof does everything a Commando can do, and better.
Simply, there is NO reason to go Commando, unless you want to hinder yourself....
StarNick
Wed Sep 14, 2005 3:50 pm
#12
I had to tone it down a bit, probably why it took an extra day as every time I went to write the bloody preface it turned out hideously sarcastic...
And nothing to report on yet.
And nothing to report on yet.
evfields
Wed Sep 14, 2005 4:10 pm
#13
/prod Devs
I don't like being killed by critters 4 levels below me when I use commando weapons
I don't like being killed by critters 4 levels below me when I use commando weapons
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