Combat Medic Archive

Cm's, it's time to take the bull by the horns.

Lately we've had to deal with the likes of Bob the Tomato, JediMasterAlagorn and IlyaMatool trying to get our poisons nerfed, especially mind.

Now however the tone has been ramped up, witness this...

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Development&message.id=499120&page=9

In two posts on page 9 of this thread Ilya has put forth some incredibly damning suggestions, ways to basically wreck the cm class. It has to stop, we need to go on the offensive ourselves in order to keep the doctors.

There are morons in both professions. Don't lump everyone into one category.

Look at Zarlor--he's doing the best he can for us.

I will, because the same is being done to us.

The non-morons arent the ones posting the loudest and the longest for the nerfs, rather than sit by and hope for some good judgement from the devs (ya right), I'd rather we push to save what we are.

lol they are morons..

just look at their arguments...ive read them a million times....

its always the same..its always about mind poison...

mind poison problems dont come from them being in the CM class...

mind poison is a mind damage problem...

people will complain about it and blame CMs for it...

but the are missing the point...

they never say omf i just got hit by a 600 damage health poison...

The funny thing about the whole mind healing thing is that if they really do allow mind to be healed (rather than simply buffed or increase regen), then CMs may actually become more powerful. Suddenly area diseases will become the only way in PvP to do any real, semi-permament damage. I can already see the nerf cries... instead of a handful of mind-damaging classes dominating PvP, a much smaller collection of wounding classes will take their place.

This sort of thing makes me sad. Both Doctors and CM's have been neglected as of late. It's a shame that some members in both camps have decided to lay into each other and scream nerf (though no one is really screaming Nerf docs). I wish people would consider additions to a class rather than deletions from a classfirst. I for one have no problem with a line of stronger 'cures' being produced by doctors to allow them an easier time healing CM toxic attacks. And I hope this is the path that the devs choose rather than listening to the rather vocal minority that fails to take the time to think of a solution for the problem and instead opts the easy road and screams 'nerf nerf'.

Well, Docs have been seeing a bit of backlash lately that suggest Buffs get nerfed. So we are seeing it over there as well as here.

I will ask that you please not lump entire professions together based on the words of a few. You want to keep CMs viable, fight for them and present proper counter-arguments in those places where someone is screaming for a CM nerf.

And I would always remember to look outside the issue. Screming for a CM nerf because of Mind Poison really isn't the issue, and folks who look at it that way really need to be reminded that the issue is not the poison or Combat Medics, it's Mind Damage.

I think the only reason you don't see more complaints about stacked mind bleeds (and rember taht our poisons do not stack) is that there are just a lot less Riflemen out there, for one, and because Poisons are a bit flashier and more obvious about striking fear into the hearts of other players. Personally i fear a stacked bleed FAR more than a CM poison. At least with the poison I carry a cure that I know will work within a few tries. That bleed may take downright forever to fix!

Fair enough and I will try.

My notion isn't regen rate against poison, but basically pools and regen rate as a method to not need CM's AOE heals in combat.

A CM should be a better healer than a doc in combat due to range and area. Leave rez out of it for a moment.

If you look at two identical say 6-10 man teams. Each group has 1 healer. A has a Master CM. B has a Master Doc. Doc in B buffs each person in team B to the point that during combat the fact he can't throw for range is irrelevant. He has such higher pools and toll-like regen on each party member that the advantage to range and area healing for the CM is moot.

If doc buffs approach this point, I think there's a serious problem. Having docs around for revive and buffs is one thing, but if they invalidate a CM's healing mandate I've got an issue.

Jacore

Ah, I see. Not sure that's too much of an issue. The reason I say it is that as an MD/MCM I find that I genreally rely on my ranged and AoE heals more than trying to run and gun heal. The primary reason is flexibility of tactics. I don't need to be in any given place to heal. The group can spread out if tactics require it or I can spread out as well if my (admittedly small) firepower is needed. So I, and my group, like to be abel to rely on my CM skills to provide healing. This is especially true in hilly areas where my ability to run-and-heal someone can be seriously hampered without terrain negotiation skills.

Well put Z.

I'm a Master Doc as well, with a lot of CM also. In a group setting, I always rely on ranged and area stims for healing. Always.

The range itself is enough to counter the run and gun healing of a doctor, add in the area heals and the run and gun is beyond obsolete.

Regen rates, even when sub stats are buffed, aren't enough to offset Ranged/Area heals of a CM.

and, side note, please don't lump us all into the same nerf crying group. Almost everything I post in the discussion board regarding medical profession concerns takes into account ALL medical profession, not simply Doctor.

Some of us do think of the others medical healers y'know...

Oh I guess I should add that my current weapon has an optimum range of 35. The rest of my group also understands the usefulness of that optimal range number that thei weapon has and that it is listed in teh stas for a reason, and there's happen to be different than mine. So there is a defintie tactical advantage to being at different ranges, not to mentione the potential to confuse a mob by attacking it from different sides and spreading the damage around. SO many tactical reasons for not clumping up. I just never use a standard stim (and why I REALLY wish they would fix Ranged Stim Es!) in combat, only after the fight.

And I don't care hoe buffed my groupmates are, how quick I am with heals, etc... They someties still go down. There are some really bad mama-jamas out there that will take doen a fully buffed bar in 3 hits in 3 seconds flat. Not to mention getting close to the tanks when they fight a Kimo or Kraty is certain death for a Doc. Especially if your mind is getting low there is a darned good chance one of those will aggro on you or toss in some AoE states that will put you down for getting close in a heartbeat. No way I want to get in there without a ranged heal. I just can't resist that stuff and wouldn't have the mind to do it anyway. (You might be able to get away wtih t as a Zabrak, but we cannot assume a single profession is built around a single race. We all want to join in even if we aren't Zabrak.)

Zarlor,

Well hey I'd like your personal opinion about something regarding buffs then.

I don't have a problem wtih doc duration. I thing chefs and smugglers need a pass to get doc but so be it.

I don't have a problem wtih potency on the pools, but I have serious reservations to the potency of Master Doc Regens.

It seems to me that these things in part a level of regeneration that is a serious encroachment upon the AOE abilities of a CM, to the point that a Master Doc who has buffed an entire party is strongly preferable to a CM because the party never has to worry about range to the CM anymore.

What'sregen rate in health and action per second bonus for a well crafted Master doc regen?

Jacore

Well,best buffI think I've had (Master Doc using a couple of decent advanced components and fairly good resources and luck in the variability heal roll) on a secondary would probably be about 2800 on Con. I think it put that particular person (luckily our primary puller) up into the 3500 range on Con. Regen rate was noticeable, but nowhere even close enough to be able to counter a top-level (or even a low level) poison tick. It's still kind a slow. The difference is that insted of not appearing to regen at all during an entire combat, you may actually notice them getting some small amont of health back.

For example, on this particular individual i gave him a pretty goad full set of buffs while on Dantooine. He wen in to pull a single stormtrooper out for our very small group (3 PCs, including myself, and 2 pets.) He got hit once, probably for about 200-400 health at the outset. After that the NPC was too busy with pets to ever shoot at him again. By the end of the combat he had JUST regenned all of that lost health, since I never bothered to stim him for so small a loss. Combat lasted at least 2 mins,I would guess. Not overly quick. So 200-400 health in 2 mins, whereas most normal regens are likely to be closer to 1/3-1/4 of that,I would say.

A good way to try it out might be to do something that caosts you action, for example, such as doing a tumble or a sample. Note the time (or just turn it on in the chat log in your options, is the best way.) Not how much action you lost with that function. Then not how long it takes you to regen that action. A Master Doc level buff will probably triple, but probably not quadruple,that regen rate.

I don't think any poison will tick that slowly that the regen rate is enough to make an overly significant difference.