Combat Medic Archive

Thread: Since we get a nerf...My idea's to make it better.

ZP-3O
Sat Jul 10, 2004 1:08 pm
#1
Take out the Ranged Support 4 in Marksman.


With that pre req, it prevents from bein a master in any melee skill. And I know CM is all ranged, but still...You can learn it in the CM line.


Poisons should Incap.


Reduce the wounds givin from the Mindheal to just Mind, not willpower or anything.



-------------------------------------------------------
TCarter TheGreat
Master Teras Kasi, Master Weaponsmith!
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jfang
Sat Jul 10, 2004 2:14 pm
#2
Combat medics weren't nerfed, they were fixed. To empower them in some way after this fix implicitly assumes they were balanced before the change. As the range issue was a known bug, and the halva was considered game breaking, this is likely a false assumption. (This is the same fallacy in regards to the "combat medics deserve a 75% PvP damage reduction that everybody else got because everybody else got it" argument.)


Poison incapping is a whole other issues I don't want to get into, because it is begging to start a trolling post. (Not quite proper terminology, but you know what I mean.) Suffice it to say though, the devs intentionally took that out, and probably had their reasons. Has the situation changed substantially since then?


In regards to skill point changes, I have my opinions. So do others. If you care to read them, you can check the following thread (as listed in the "useful threads links" post STICKIED on the top of the CM forums):




I wonder how many people who think that combat medics got "nerfed" are really CMs, and how many of the remaining are FotM versus "real" combat medics... Not that there is anything right or wrong with either of course.

Message Edited by jfang on 07-10-2004 05:15 PM

Eldrikk
Sat Jul 10, 2004 4:45 pm
#3




ZP-3O wrote:

Take out the Ranged Support 4 in Marksman.


With that pre req, it prevents from bein a master in any melee skill. And I know CM is all ranged, but still...You can learn it in the CM line.


Poisons should Incap. No dot should incap including diseases or fires. To top it off poison and disease shouldnt stack.


Reduce the wounds givin from the Mindheal to just Mind, not willpower or anything. Moot point since the combat rebalance will include HAM balancing and all Stim's will heal Mind at the cost of special points.



Your profession is a hybrid profession just like Commando, Bounty Hunter and smuggler thats the reason why you have to master one basic profession and a line of another in order to open up combat medic.

Message Edited by Eldrikk on 07-10-2004 04:47 PM



BH Loot drops vendor located at -729 1508 Dantooine.
Bamboozle
Sat Jul 10, 2004 8:31 pm
#4




jfang wrote:

Combat medics weren't nerfed, they were fixed.




If "nerf" means "to make worse", then yes, we were nerfed.

Our range has always been 2x the listed range on poisons. Just because the devs tried to change it and didn't do it right doesn'tsuddenly make itabug, no matter what TH says.

...but don't mind me. I'm just a bit grumpy.







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Brainplay
Sun Jul 11, 2004 4:46 am
#5




Bamboozle wrote:




jfang wrote:

Combat medics weren't nerfed, they were fixed.




If "nerf" means "to make worse", then yes, we were nerfed.

Our range has always been 2x the listed range on poisons. Just because the devs tried to change it and didn't do it right doesn'tsuddenly make itabug, no matter what TH says.

...but don't mind me. I'm just a bit grumpy.








/agree


I wish they could have come up with some other way than revamping our range modifiers. It was hard enough for those that didn't have super good resources that spawn twice a year to make it past the 64m mark. Now we have to wait and draw voodoo magic symbols in the dirt while sacrificing animals in hopes that the spawn rates will increase. Now we also have to take a serious hit in our ranged/area stimpack power if we use our own 5point subcomponents if we want to reach the 64m mark as well.


Considering we had to do our own crafting tree, is it too much to ask that the devs give us another 5 points of medical assembly to use for our stim subcomponents? I know doctors would whine about it since they make L337 phat cash off stimB's when they dont want to stand in a starport and buff but its kinda needed for us now. Especially if there's going to be a bigger emphasis on healing HAM's after the combat revamp.







Keorythe

h Combat Medic h


/Forcing Counterstrike PvPers to PvE since 2003 \






A Combat Medic Alpha tester who never got the chance to alpha test

jkray8472
Sun Jul 11, 2004 3:56 pm
#6




Bamboozle wrote:




jfang wrote:

Combat medics weren't nerfed, they were fixed.




If "nerf" means "to make worse", then yes, we were nerfed.

Our range has always been 2x the listed range on poisons. Just because the devs tried to change it and didn't do it right doesn'tsuddenly make itabug, no matter what TH says.

...but don't mind me. I'm just a bit grumpy.









"nerfed" means made ineffective. Creature Handlers were obviously nerfed. How many CHs do you see in PvP anymore? None...b/c they were nerfed. You will still see Combat Medics in PvP. They will always have a place.


Combat was never meant to take place in a sphere greater than 64m around your person. The devs have said this several times, and even tried to fix that earlier. This time they have succeeded in fixing the range. However, they may have gone a bit overboard...the tests are still out on that.


As far as havla, all the non-FOTM Combat Medics on this forum agree that it was game-breaking. It was not intended that CMs be able to throw that quickly...and as such it was fixed.


If the delay was changed to 30 seconds between each toss...then that would be the equivalent of a nerf. Or perhaps if we could only throw at melee range...that would be a nerf. It would totally cripple the class from the way it currently it handled. These changes are fixes. Do you see the distinction?




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jfang
Sun Jul 11, 2004 4:49 pm
#7


If you look at from the strict definition that any reduction in power is a nerf (which is a valid definition), then yes, this is a nerf. However, I draw a distinction between a 'nerf' reduction in power, and a 'fix' reduction in power. As I view it:


Nerf: "This is working as we designed but is unbalanced, so we should 'nerf' it."

Fix: "This is not working as we originally designed, we should 'fix' it to balance it."


So, when they changed charge shot so that if you were hit by it once you weren't pinned down, yes this noticeably weakened carbineers. As this was an unexpected bug though, I classify this as a 'fix', and not a 'nerf'.


When they changed how bleed shots work (initial damage, but less dot damage), bleeds were originally working exactly as they were designed to. However, this was considered unbalanced, so (assuming you consider it worse now than before) this was a nerf.


Put another way, a nerf reduces the strength were supposed to you have, where as a fix removes strength you shouldn't have had in the first place. Functionally they are similar, but both terms carry very different implications (about the cause of the change, and the repercussions of the change).
TsunamiKata
Mon Jul 12, 2004 8:16 am
#8




Bamboozle wrote:




jfang wrote:

Combat medics weren't nerfed, they were fixed.




If "nerf" means "to make worse", then yes, we were nerfed.

Our range has always been 2x the listed range on poisons. Just because the devs tried to change it and didn't do it right doesn'tsuddenly make itabug, no matter what TH says.

...but don't mind me. I'm just a bit grumpy.



I concur. The range bonus has always been based on the Ranged Healing Distance skill tree. It's formula is very precise and calcuable. Now, with this nerf, I am not quite sure the end result would be.





TsunamiKata Hunter
The Dark Messiah
I'm the new evil, F3aR m3!
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