Combat Medic Archive
Thread: A different approach about CMs
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Salacious_JR_
Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:39 pm
#1
Well, there's been a lot of nerfs cries since the combat balance is coming. Well im not a BH, nor a Jedi and I've been a CM and I didn't enjoy quite much being CM since for all the skill points we only get to area heal and area poison, and while they can be really powerful, and in my opinion game breaking, they're not that fun to play, so, why instead of nerfing poisons why dont we try to add more content to CMs? Here's my idea:
Ok we are medics, but also chemical warfare experts, and thus it would be great if we had all those things other combat professions have, for example:
Like other combat profs we could apply states:
- Carbon Dioxide bomb: Single/Area dizzy stims (names are just an example)
- Tear gas: Single/Area blind
- Sleeping gas: Single/Area Knockdown
- Paralyzing toxine: Maybe it should work like warcry or something like that
And we could add some more for states like stun or maybe intimidate
For those of you thinking in massive area Dizzy/KD think about area versions having a low probability of success and limited range. *Just think in Area KD of Pikeman* or a cone, or something like that, but you can throw it instead of being in melee range. So if theres 5 people in that area maybe 2 or 3 get knocked down, just try to balance the effect
Now, we need to stop relying in one one source of damage, and have more variety, like:
- Burning chemical agent: This could do fire damage and should not be a DoT, just do a bunch of fire damage
- Liquid Nitrogen stim: Same as above for cold damage?
- Toxic waste stim: Do some kind of damage and also apply dizzy and stun, not area, this is not a DoT
- Neurotoxine stim: Low to Mid single/area stun damage directed to mind bar
- Cardiac shock: Low to Mid single/area ...stun? damage directed to Health bar
- Spinal Cord paralyzing agent: Same as above but for action bar
...etc...
Special attacks:
Since theres a smuggler revamp i thought it would be cool if there would be some interaction between CM and smuggler by getting some high profile toxines only by means of a smuggler, and these ones getting it only by cheating Jabba in high profile missions and getting the risk of ending in the BH terms:
- Jellyfish venom stim: Dizzy/KD and adds health disease DoT. Enough to scare the poor guy laying in the ground unable to stand, just along the lines of Fireknockdown but with a Disease DoT
The jellyfish toxine would be available only to smugglers by getting some high profile mission.
- Disease bacteria stim: Adds disease DoT to Health, Action and Mind.
To get the bacteria, the same as above.
- Black widow poison stim: Adds poison DoT to Health, Action and Mind.
The damage level of these three should be balanced and not game breaking, and also hard to get.
Getting the chemical agents:
With these new big bunch of stims you open the door to a more diversified type of resources to do every stim, for example:
- Fish venom: get some of the agents by fishing, or using some of the fish already in the game
- Spider paralyze agent
- Dizzy Fungus
You get the point...
Healing Part:
Well, we can diversify this part by having some area state removing packs, like dizzy removing stims or something like that.
I even have some ideas here for the smuggler revamp like having some area stims or single stims that make you "stronger" for a limited time, just like spice but in gas/spray form for area use. To make these stimpacks we would need the drugs supplied by the smugglers. This is kinda "they make the drug, we make it ready for chemical warfare use". For example some of the poison reduction spices that are to come could be made into spray and make it half the power (so its not game-breaking). This would make CMs able to counter enemy poisons a bit, and help friendly doctors that usually have to run as hell applying curepoison to the group. We're not healing the poison but with the help of the smugglers drug we can make our group more resistant to it...
Well, this part is just some weird ideas and could make not much sense
Final word:
With this we get to be a COMBAT profession: we can apply states, and we can do different kinds of damage, most of those are not DoTs , so they would be like "specials" in other profs, but a bit more powerful since we use stims everytime we apply. So, no more having to rely on our big badass poisons but more like the bleed were before, we apply poisons and then we hit the HAM with other things, and can blind/stun our opponents making the fight more diverse and strategic and fun...
CMs should have to rely to OTHER profession in order to play in the GCW. So nerf the poisons, add more content!
Sorry for the long post, what do you guys think?
Ok we are medics, but also chemical warfare experts, and thus it would be great if we had all those things other combat professions have, for example:
Like other combat profs we could apply states:
- Carbon Dioxide bomb: Single/Area dizzy stims (names are just an example)
- Tear gas: Single/Area blind
- Sleeping gas: Single/Area Knockdown
- Paralyzing toxine: Maybe it should work like warcry or something like that
And we could add some more for states like stun or maybe intimidate
For those of you thinking in massive area Dizzy/KD think about area versions having a low probability of success and limited range. *Just think in Area KD of Pikeman* or a cone, or something like that, but you can throw it instead of being in melee range. So if theres 5 people in that area maybe 2 or 3 get knocked down, just try to balance the effect
Now, we need to stop relying in one one source of damage, and have more variety, like:
- Burning chemical agent: This could do fire damage and should not be a DoT, just do a bunch of fire damage
- Liquid Nitrogen stim: Same as above for cold damage?
- Toxic waste stim: Do some kind of damage and also apply dizzy and stun, not area, this is not a DoT
- Neurotoxine stim: Low to Mid single/area stun damage directed to mind bar
- Cardiac shock: Low to Mid single/area ...stun? damage directed to Health bar
- Spinal Cord paralyzing agent: Same as above but for action bar
...etc...
Special attacks:
Since theres a smuggler revamp i thought it would be cool if there would be some interaction between CM and smuggler by getting some high profile toxines only by means of a smuggler, and these ones getting it only by cheating Jabba in high profile missions and getting the risk of ending in the BH terms:
- Jellyfish venom stim: Dizzy/KD and adds health disease DoT. Enough to scare the poor guy laying in the ground unable to stand, just along the lines of Fireknockdown but with a Disease DoT
The jellyfish toxine would be available only to smugglers by getting some high profile mission.
- Disease bacteria stim: Adds disease DoT to Health, Action and Mind.
To get the bacteria, the same as above.
- Black widow poison stim: Adds poison DoT to Health, Action and Mind.
The damage level of these three should be balanced and not game breaking, and also hard to get.
Getting the chemical agents:
With these new big bunch of stims you open the door to a more diversified type of resources to do every stim, for example:
- Fish venom: get some of the agents by fishing, or using some of the fish already in the game
- Spider paralyze agent
- Dizzy Fungus
You get the point...
Healing Part:
Well, we can diversify this part by having some area state removing packs, like dizzy removing stims or something like that.
I even have some ideas here for the smuggler revamp like having some area stims or single stims that make you "stronger" for a limited time, just like spice but in gas/spray form for area use. To make these stimpacks we would need the drugs supplied by the smugglers. This is kinda "they make the drug, we make it ready for chemical warfare use". For example some of the poison reduction spices that are to come could be made into spray and make it half the power (so its not game-breaking). This would make CMs able to counter enemy poisons a bit, and help friendly doctors that usually have to run as hell applying curepoison to the group. We're not healing the poison but with the help of the smugglers drug we can make our group more resistant to it...
Well, this part is just some weird ideas and could make not much sense
Final word:
With this we get to be a COMBAT profession: we can apply states, and we can do different kinds of damage, most of those are not DoTs , so they would be like "specials" in other profs, but a bit more powerful since we use stims everytime we apply. So, no more having to rely on our big badass poisons but more like the bleed were before, we apply poisons and then we hit the HAM with other things, and can blind/stun our opponents making the fight more diverse and strategic and fun...
CMs should have to rely to OTHER profession in order to play in the GCW. So nerf the poisons, add more content!
Sorry for the long post, what do you guys think?
Salacious_JR_
Tue Jul 06, 2004 4:44 pm
#2
Darn edit button, i meant CMs SHOULDNT have to rely on other profession in order to fight.
We wouldnt be as powerful at doing damage like ranged/melee but we can control the crowd and scare the hell out of the enemies with some ranged area KD and some nasty stims.
CMs get their poisons nerfed a bit but in exchange get a more diversified playstyle...
We wouldnt be as powerful at doing damage like ranged/melee but we can control the crowd and scare the hell out of the enemies with some ranged area KD and some nasty stims.
CMs get their poisons nerfed a bit but in exchange get a more diversified playstyle...
Seph_Iroth
Tue Jul 06, 2004 5:20 pm
#3
yeah now CMs can be THAT much more overpowered! good thinking! having one CM come in and poison/disease all stats, area kd, area dizzy, area blind, and area stun would be great! WOOT for you! good thinking!
Salacious_JR_
Tue Jul 06, 2004 5:52 pm
#4
No mate, you dont get it. Now CMs are overpowered because of the big nasty poisons, BUT if you nef the poisons theres nothing left in the CM profession, so, why dont we make it a more fun profession to play and lower the poison nastyness.
- Pikemans do Area KD and are NOT overpowered
- EVERY combat prof can dizzy,stun,blind and are NOT overpowered by that
It just depends on the implementation. If they make a big area KD that throws you down ALWAYS, then that's overpowered. If they make it more like Pikeman then its quite ok. You can also play with the times so if you throw area KD you have a big penalty time to toss another thing.
And well, if you dont like the area effects just make the single ones.
Ok, now try again and say something else than "Nerf the CMs!"
- Pikemans do Area KD and are NOT overpowered
- EVERY combat prof can dizzy,stun,blind and are NOT overpowered by that
It just depends on the implementation. If they make a big area KD that throws you down ALWAYS, then that's overpowered. If they make it more like Pikeman then its quite ok. You can also play with the times so if you throw area KD you have a big penalty time to toss another thing.
And well, if you dont like the area effects just make the single ones.
Ok, now try again and say something else than "Nerf the CMs!"
Brainplay
Wed Jul 07, 2004 4:13 am
#5
Now see this is a GOOD post. Good brainstorming dude. If they increased the power of states so that a doctor could cure it with a gimpy A pack and the effects were a bit more debilitating I'd give up my poisons in a heartbeat. Try introducting new states as well. Instead of a KD on the "sleeping gas" make it a "slow" effect to slow down their attack rates/specials. Make blind cut their "current" accuracy in half. Neurotoxin that does an intimidate with high potency.
That would put us in a real "support" role and still be a viable combat profession. Defense stackers would hate us since we negate their defense. They'd grief us for that instead of killing off their MIND's at least.
That still leaves us short on thepositive medicalabilities though and doesn't address the MIND vulnerability issue. Granted with the revamp general healing is probably going to be needed alot more than it is now. Wonder if we'll get something that can reset the HAM size when we toss it? Bah, I'd still get griefed after dropping a stun on a defense stacker and owning them with a DXR-6b.
Salacious_JR_
Wed Jul 07, 2004 3:17 pm
#6
Great idea about changing the KD stim to slow people instead of Knockdown, cool feedback.
In fact my original post is just brainstorm, im sure theres a LOT that can be changed and NEW interesting ideas you people can add.
Remember, the whole thing is to make CM something more than just tossing poisons. It would be great to be able to play it with more strategy.
Again:
* Ok, everybody want to nerf the poisons, and we might see a nerf in the combat balance
* PROBLEM: Nerf poisons and CMs get almost useless
* SOLUTION: ADD CONTENT to combat medics like those I proposed and THEN you can nerf the poisons, since CMs will have more things to play with and feel more like a combat prof.
Problem is, i think this idea is almost a CM revamp so its gonna be hard to get it...
In fact my original post is just brainstorm, im sure theres a LOT that can be changed and NEW interesting ideas you people can add.
Remember, the whole thing is to make CM something more than just tossing poisons. It would be great to be able to play it with more strategy.
Again:
* Ok, everybody want to nerf the poisons, and we might see a nerf in the combat balance
* PROBLEM: Nerf poisons and CMs get almost useless
* SOLUTION: ADD CONTENT to combat medics like those I proposed and THEN you can nerf the poisons, since CMs will have more things to play with and feel more like a combat prof.
Problem is, i think this idea is almost a CM revamp so its gonna be hard to get it...
Fitzhume
Wed Jul 07, 2004 11:11 pm
#7
Salacious_JR_ wrote:
Great idea about changing the KD stim to slow people instead of Knockdown, cool feedback.
In fact my original post is just brainstorm, im sure theres a LOT that can be changed and NEW interesting ideas you people can add.
Remember, the whole thing is to make CM something more than just tossing poisons. It would be great to be able to play it with more strategy.
Again:
* Ok, everybody want to nerf the poisons, and we might see a nerf in the combat balance
* PROBLEM: Nerf poisons and CMs get almost useless
* SOLUTION: ADD CONTENT to combat medics like those I proposed and THEN you can nerf the poisons, since CMs will have more things to play with and feel more like a combat prof.
Problem is, i think this idea is almost a CM revamp so its gonna be hard to get it...
I am sorry.. I completely disagree with this post. Why? Because I think that the developers are completely misguided on one single point. Just because the word 'combat' is in the title 'combat medic' does not, in any way shape or form, imply OFFENSE. Seriously.. think about this.. in any age/era/time/history combat medics are simply people who HEAL others in a time of BATTLE. Thats it.. they didnt have a special weapon, they weren't using blowguns to poison people from afar.. and for the most part, barely picked up their own weapons unless they were in mortal danger.
My point is this.. what makes a combat medic tough is that they have great defenses. They can go out into battle, heal the soldiers who are fighting/wounded fearlessly and move on to others in need. Granted, I don't think you should lose your DoT's.. because developers don't put things in the game to take them out completely. But I think they SHOULD be completely reworked so that they are REMOTELY fair. BUT, what I do think CMs should get, are really good defenses. What this means is this.. you essentially are NOT very strong offensively, but you can heal others with very little risk to getting KD/DZ ect.. ect..
Please.. my fundametal point here, and it was an error on the developers judgement here.. COMBAT MEDIC does not equal OFFENSIVE.. what they do.. is HEAL people.. thats it. I'm sorry to burst the bubble. So 'adding' new offensive power to this profession is probably the most unrealistic and least productive thing the developers could do to this game. Judging on most other 'revamps' and 'fixes', I am sure you will get everything you are asking for.
-Fitzhume
Message Edited by Fitzhume on 07-07-2004 11:13 PM
Gnuut
Wed Jul 07, 2004 11:39 pm
#8
Fitzhume wrote: My point is this.. what makes a combat medic tough is that they have great defenses.
CM has defenses? What game are you playing?
Pahdbacca
Wed Jul 07, 2004 11:53 pm
#9
Gnuut wrote:
Fitzhume wrote: My point is this.. what makes a combat medic tough is that they have great defenses.
CM has defenses? What game are you playing?
OMG!!!! Sooo much pop to clean off the monitor.
About the title combat medic and RL....It's kinda a dead horse. This topic has been brought up time and time again. If you want realism, perhaps a game other than one with rancors, lightsabers and laser rifles.
Again, the Devs will never paint themselves into a corner and admit to the CMs role in combat one way or the other....an answer to one of your bi-weekly questions is here
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