Combat Medic Archive
Thread: My theory on why 75% Reduction is fair.
So your saying the best poison should be less effective then a cdef pistol? That doesn't seem very fair.
the dps break down on that is not worth it. It would be more effective to just shoot with the worst pistol in the game. Is that what you are proposing. If so that hardly seems worth the skill points (169).
Wookiee of Flurry
I suspect it's because the FoTM crowd likes to run around PK'ing, and CM isn't too great at that compared to stacking a few elite combat profs. There's some places where CMs are dominant and some places where they're pretty useless.. A lot of it comes down to CMs being able to take great advantage of some crappy mechanics in the current combat system in the right situations, IMO. I don't think a 75% PvP reduction is appropriate but I do think working some kind of resistance (and not rare loot drops) into the game through some crafter profession would be appropriate.
Happymob wrote:
Agreed. I suspect there are more now, but it still is low. Combat medics are certainly very memorable in some battles, but there is clearly something about the profession that is keeping most of the flavor of the month crowd from signing up (and it's not the initial grind since it's an easy profession to master). In my mind, that indicates that the profession is essentially balanced (when considering the totality of gameplay). It may need some tweaks here and there, but overall we're ok.
daymeeuhn wrote:
A) We can hit from 76m.
Not for long --Devs meant to cap this at 64m, and are sure to do so on the next publish.
B) Disease/Poison incaps, and only doctors can stop that.
And pretty much any combat class can KD me, and pound the crap out of me before I even come close to throwing that second poison or disease, and any doctor that tries to stop that will likely suffer the same fate. And since that firstpoison won't incapmy target, hecan incap camp me allday if he wants. Oh, and by the way, this is also a likely "bug" that will get fixed in the next publish.
C) We never miss.
This is both wrong (I am a master with 120 potency poisons, which have, on occassion been resisted), and beside the point. I honestly can't remember the last time a master rifleman, pistoleer, or carbineer ever missed me either.
D) We can hit your entire group in one shot.
If your group is stupid and stands around with their thumbs up each other's butts, yes. If they have half a brain and stay spread out, no. And the CMs in your group (you do have at least one in your group, don't you?) also can hit me with mind poison, making me utterly unable to do anything.
Don't get me wrong, I think there are a million things they could changeso thatCM makes more sense. But gimping the class is not the answer. I say, sure, give us the 75% penalty, limit the range, create additional ways to counter poisons and disease,even make mind easier to heal. But if all those things are implemented, they need to bring back the incap for poisonalone(not just for us, but for all DOTS), and also allow us to apply states with our poisons. It makes perfect sense.
daymeeuhn
I ama CM on Starsider, and was one of the 1st with Moon. To say CMs are all over Starsiders is Dewback **edit**e.
1on1 Any good combat prof can take down a CM before the poison incaps. And if your in a group you should have a Doc.
Combine that with 2 other words: Combat Revamp and you got the fact that a whole lot of people on this forum keep bringing up a whole lot of stuff that just might mean diddley squat in the next few months.
DoTs are being "brought in line" with other combat forms. Likely that means that resists will get raised, range will be cut back to 64m maximum (we already know that one is happening) and so on.
The cmbat revamp will remove the reason Mind Damage Healing was removed from stims in the first place, so Mind damge will no longer be anything special and we'll likely be haling it the exact same way we heal Health and Action now.
So most of these threads talking about nerfs and changes are basically of no use whatsoever because the changes are already in the works. You just need to sit tight for a few months to see what happens before offering a bunch of changes that just don't mean anything right now. AFTER the revamp, then we can talk about what need sto be done, but until we see it in action all of this discussion doesn't even amount to a hill of beans.
Rennyn wrote:
I can't believe people think CMs are balanced. Its totally hilarious. I can straight up tell you I earned THOUSANDS of faction points PVPing (myself vs 1-10 other people depending on which town I was invading) as a CM. I NEVER lost a 1v1 battle. Not even ONCE while I was a CM. We had a decent sized PVP tournament on Intrepid. My first match was against the person who basically everyone considered the toughest to beat on the server. The result? Probably less than a 30 second match, I had lost no more than 1/10th of my mind pool, and thats it.
*watches someone coming towards him* *lobs a poison.. lobs a disease*.. *sits there and laughs as 10 seconds later the other guy is incapped while trying to shoot through 80% composite. Going vs a doc? You can STILL outthrow their disease/poison cures, and ONE tick will do enough damage to screw them up BIG time.
Furthermore people complaining about someone hitting with stopping shot for 600 in pvp needs a reality check. 600 damage * 0.50 for light armor * 0.20ish for good acid/heat/whatever armor = piddly amounts. Not wearing armor? Might as well toss your weapons away too if you wanna be stupid about it.
So you were only fighting novice marksmen right? Or novice brawlers from 64m away? Becasuse there is no way you can have 80% resist to everything, stun layers are broken so the best you can get there right now is 11% special resists, so if you were to fight any riflemen you'd be owned before you could even toss your second poison/disease. Also, did these people just run away from you or something? There's no way that if combat started at 64m that you'd be able to toss 2 poisons and watch the person die while they just did nothing to you. And as for the doc thing, you can't out throw their heals, they can heal just as fast as you can toss, so against a non lagging doc you'll never even see 1 poison even get a chance to tick once against a master doc.
Not alot of Starsider players as CM?
Maybe back in the day of FATAL. If you did play with FATAL, you havent probably played in a while.
They are EVERYWHERE right now. As a CM I CONSTANTLY get messages about training, stores, advice blablabla nonstop. Because people have finally given up trying to beat them and figure, if you cant beat them, join them.
As for us always hitting, Im sorry but in good pvp nowadays if youre not a CM youre a defense stacker, and my buddy can have a Bounty Hunter, Commando Riflemen whatever shoot him 25 times, and theyre lucky to hit twice. Missmissmissmissmissdodgemisscounterattackmissmis**edit**mis**edit**.
I would agree with Zarlor. If applying a 75% DR to poisons makes them useless then they need to rethink how the system works. I don't want poison removed. that was never an issue. Either they have some sort of DR for PVP or change the system to set some sort of balance. As far as PVE is concerned this is not an issue...poison away.
When people within the profession can be honest and post that something is a bit broken there is a problem. It's responsible to ask for some sort of examination of the issue and come to a reasonable solution before it's taken out of your hands and nerfed to heck by developers who have the teaming masses crying for a nerf tothe CM.
Rennyn wrote:I can't believe people think CMs are balanced. Its totally hilarious. I can straight up tell you I earned THOUSANDS of faction points PVPing (myself vs 1-10 other people depending on which town I was invading) as a CM. I NEVER lost a 1v1 battle. Not even ONCE while I was a CM. We had a decent sized PVP tournament on Intrepid. My first match was against the person who basically everyone considered the toughest to beat on the server. The result? Probably less than a 30 second match, I had lost no more than 1/10th of my mind pool, and thats it.
*watches someone coming towards him* *lobs a poison.. lobs a disease*.. *sits there and laughs as 10 seconds later the other guy is incapped while trying to shoot through 80% composite. Going vs a doc? You can STILL outthrow their disease/poison cures, and ONE tick will do enough damage to screw them up BIG time.
Furthermore people complaining about someone hitting with stopping shot for 600 in pvp needs a reality check. 600 damage * 0.50 for light armor * 0.20ish for good acid/heat/whatever armor = piddly amounts. Not wearing armor? Might as well toss your weapons away too if you wanna be stupid about it.
I've got to say, I love it when someone who obviously wasn't a CM decides to post. In groups CMs are not only the the first targets but rarely survive past a KD, and even if they manage to somehow survive odds are they're nowhere close enough to make the deathblow.
Manimal -
I fought Riflemen also. One of them finally took me out using a Jawa. After I killed her 5 times, along with about 5 of their guildies. Jawa's do such pitiful damage, and I had 35% stun resist on my effectiveness sliced PSG, so don't start about Composite lacking stun. Generally with them you just toss a poison, go hide behind a building.. if they're dumb enough to chase, burst run up to them and they're dead. *shrug* they were NEVER a problem solo.
Tarchais -
You're a fool, I played at 4304CM for quite some time, EXTENSIVELY pvp'ing. Even went on to Master the profession before dropping it. You die after 1 knockdown? Crappy armor, and crappy doc skills I guess. I've been dizzy/knocked down numerous times.. kneel/heal state dizzy/laugh as you reapply a poison or disease. I was not exaggerating when I said I made THOUSANDS of faction points by killing rebels as a CM. I could spend an hour or two in a city killing rebels in their own town and come out 500-1k richer in faction, killing them too many times to count. I've killed other CMs, doctors, TKAs, riflemen, swordsman, fencers, whatever.
Do I think I'm the best PVPer ever? Heck no. I do know what I'm doing, and I do know how to build a decent template. I know which spices to bring, which foods to eat, and I'm intelligent enough to wear good armor and get good buffs before PVPing. The reason I won so much and killed so many? Overpowered poisons and diseases.
A) We can hit from 76m.
B) Disease/Poison incaps, and only doctors can stop that.
C) We never miss.
D) We can hit your entire group in one shot."
Okay:
A) Known bug which should have been fixed last pass, and will get fixed in combat pass.
B) DOT bug which should have been addressed.
C) How can you miss with a chemical warfare grenade? It doesn't have to land on your head to be effective. That said, resists are in effect with every throw. Until master, it's at least a 50% chance of resits. And even with master, there's a chance.
D) as can any AOE attack (Pistoleer, Commando, others)
2 of your concerns are known bugs that will be fixed in the next publish, hopefully. The other two are nonissues. So, why do we need a 75% reduction when other DOT's don't, we do less Damage Per Second than any combat class, and we spend a lot of skill points to be second class healers, and second class combatants?
Same old arguments as before...You just phrased yours in a more antagonistic way. Enjoy pikeman.
rLHitman writes:
"Another point.....you guys are a support class"
...Oh?
Thanks for clearing that up.
In a classes environement (which SWG purports to be), I am whatever I want to be. You see medic, and think support. i see combat, and think...err...COMBAT.