Combat Medic Archive

OK, so, apparently, some people figured out that damaging an adversary in a way they can't be healed (Mind) is better than damaging them in a way that can be healed (Health, and Action). Sounds, I don't know, smart?

How do you defend against mind damage?

Put M -HIGHER- than HA, and bring a CM to heal your health and action pools as they take damage.

If you'renon-healable mind pool is less than or equal to my healable health and action pools, this is going to happen under the current system. Changing it means that people (well, the smart ones) will adapt again, and figure out what else is effective... and you'll have to learn to adapt to that too.

PS; and if they can incap you in one shot anyway, the point of what pool it targeted is pretty moot. If the healers can bring you back from incap, a smart player (or group of players) will drop the healer first, then incap the rest. And if it's a MOB and not another player, then you're taking on something beyond you, and shame on you for complaining about it.

You learned that mind damage sucks. Now apply that knowledge.

It'll be fun to see all those Mon-Cals with their uber mind-pools out swinging spray-sticks and spamming mind-shot at each other...

But not very star-warsy

and not very fun for the medics.


Expect it by the end of summer. Or get the designer's attention, and fix this problem.

honestly i feel that most the people screaming for mind heal are basically whining that I can do every thing...

mind heal has been and should always be in the realm of entertainers and mayeb chefs...

give entertainers a mind heal that takes from H and A, that way a medic/entertainer combo would be the ultimate healers in game which they should be...

give chefs food that are basically free mind heals...let the fact that u can only eat so much food govern how much i can mind heal..this will allow mind healing without making it overpowered for powergamers...

the fact is mind is probably the only thing making this game for one where everyone combat related is master of their profession in 3 days...fact is mind damage is porbably the one thing slowing up power xpers

i read the post..ncie format interesting idea...

didnt see how you are gonna prevent endless mind pools between 2 medics...

and thus endless HAM pools for everyone

TECalen, I applaud you for trying to develop a well meaning change. I don't happen to agree with you but I always like to see people who put that kind of thought in what they think is wrong. I still however don't grasp people's reasons why they think it needs to be changed however. It doesn't feel unbalanced to me however I don't participate in PvP (not yet anyway). If that's where the real gripe is, perhaps I can be swayed. But as far as NPC's, I don't see the problem.

mind healing screws riflemen, entertaineers, and chefs.

rifleman not only get a close ranged penalty, the exact opposite of pistol. but also get a 2.5x damage from melee distance damage. Rifles are very slow, Pistols have the highest DPS.

Entertaineers. lol there whole class is designed around mind pools.

Chefs - the major selling item for a chef is mind pool buffs. Why? because it cant be healed.

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So, let me break it down for you. If I wanted to pvp. let me seeeeeeee. Hmmmmmmmmmm. I got it!!1

1) stat. migration to raise my mind pool to max.
2) use the Doc's buffs to raise my health and action pool a +1500.
3) dont worry about 1 shot kills from rifleman. when they attack rush them. Get inside 35m. And I win.

*** This setup gets avoids the 1 shot kill by riflemen.**


People are so dumb. Mindless. Most get owned in PvP because they never really planned for it. Its easier to cry Nerf.

Hello Everyone,

Here's some comments for everyone:

"and thus endless HAM pools for everyone" - Elenora

I'm very aware of this issue, but I havent quite found the right balance between Usablilty (i.e. is it an ability that will actually be useful or will it be so restrictive that it will never be used/implemented is it's effectly broken), the Timer, and Cost of use. The way I see it, the Timer is to force its limited use, 30 sec. is probably to low, but that is one thing thats going through my head at the moment. "Cost of Use" is what I think everyone is concerned about. If its going to heal x points of damange then it needs to cost x*2 etc... that way there is no "endless HAM pools". The reality is you recover your mind pool fairly fast in a non-combat situation where you can sit down and wait.

One thought I've had behind this is that Mind is "transfered" between a medichealing classand their target.

If aCombat Medic heals the mind of aSurveyor thensits down next to their target and then only recasts this as the Surveyer gets low how often should the medic be allowed to "heal" their mind?Would the Combat Medic be able to recover the cost of previouscast before theycast it again?.

To make things balanced, you would need to make it so even if a player had a Zabrak maxed blue (since all three play a big part in this) that there isnt an exploit. One could state that they could only use it every 5 or 10 minutes... great for that Need to save the Player in PVE crisis moments or PVP, but over all will not sway the power of the medic. But in a non-combat situation, would it drastically affect the Surveyor from the previous example? Is a 5 or 10 minute timer to harse or to easy? If the Zabrak can recover the cost of casting this MindPack before the Timer runs out is it considered unbalanced?

Thoughts?



JoramHH,

I understand your situation. From my perspective its a case of a prolonged engagement (like the one that happened to me the other night) will kill players. Is that right? personally no. Is it a way to limit PvP battles from lasting to long, sure. But from my experiance (DAOC anyone?) you dont need to worry about it lasting two long as it never does. All im trying to do is to give a fighting chance to those that manage to live through the first shot from a rifle user.



RebalScum,

"mind healing screws riflemen, entertaineers, and chefs.

rifleman not only get a close ranged penalty, the exact opposite of pistol. but also get a 2.5x damage from melee distance damage. Rifles are very slow, Pistols have the highest DPS.

Entertaineers. lol there whole class is designed around mind pools.

Chefs - the major selling item for a chef is mind pool buffs. Why? because it cant be healed."

I debaited on if I would bother responding to a pointless post, but I will try to clarify a few things:

1) Mind Healing will not nerf Riflemen, Entertainers, or Chefs."

Entertainers heal Battle fatigue and MIND WOUNDS.

Chefs can buff your M stats, so can a Smuggler... but just like the Doctor can buff your HA stats. Personally, buff stats help you (in this game) take more damage and allow for you to use more special attacks/effects... but do not help you heal. If Buffs where the be all end all, there would be no healing.

Rifleman will not be Nerfed. Why? Prime example was posted by a Riflemen in the Medic forum on this same subject. He invalidated his entire point with his example which i will paraphrase here. He complained that he could not kill a 7k HAM creature with his rifle though he was shooting a 1k shot every time. Now I'm sure theres issues with PVE with rifles but that can be a seperate discussion within the realm of the Riflemen Forum. My point is a 1k shot? the only classes/races that will survive that are the medic professions and a few other professions that use the above formentioned buffs. But they will not survive the second shot.

Oh, and what about the Combat Medics own Mind Posion? I personally havent used it yet since C's are where it actually might get to be effective, but some people have stated that they can be powerful. (If the CM class ever gets fixed again).

"when they attack rush them. Get inside 35m. And I win."

What stops the Riflemen from running away from you while he/she waits for the timmer to shoot you again? I bring this up as I have read several guides on how Riflemen Kite eveything... hmmm....

"People are so dumb. Mindless. Most get owned in PvP because they never really planned for it. Its easier to cry Nerf. "

Sadly there is one bit of truth here. You do need a good sized mind pool to fight effectively in PVE or PVP. Eventually people will figure this out. But it is no excuse for not being able to at least do a limited heal (no 1100 M heals) to *try* to swing the tide of battle.

The big complaint to giving combat medics the ability to heal mind seems to be the fear that two combat medics could heal each other's mind giving them the ability to have endless HAM. But isn't this exactly what will happen if another class is given the power to heal mind? Now instead of two combat medics having endless ham, an entertainer and a medic will have endless ham. The same "problem" will occur with the same number of players needed to create the "problem". In fact, the problem will probably be worse if entertainers are given the ability because the ratio of their mind healing will probably be better than if combat medics were given the ability, since there has to be some motivation given to entertainers to come out of the cantinas and act as a "mana battery".

I think the problem is that we're all thinking too much in the traditional MMORPG mindset of health and mana. In eq, you can't die from running out of mana. In Swg, you can from running out of its equivalent. As long as the developers allow to target all three pools and allow players to die from all three pools, we need to get out of the mindset of treating mind as sacred as mana. It is merely just another damage pool that happens to be where medic and rifleman specials are derived.

As it stands now, zabraks practically have limitless mind, and if they are medics, limitless action and health to boot. If the dynamics of how pools are targets do not change, then the most efficient end game groups are going to be all zabrak groups. They will be able to withstand a fight the longest, as long as there are 1-2 medics in the group. No other race combination can compare.

Would giving combat medics the ability to heal mind nerf riflemen? Yes, but that could easily be compensated by letting rifles do much more damage. As pvp stands right now, the majority choice for weapons is rifle or pistols for bh's with mind shot. For pvp to stay fresh and fun, the classes participating in it must be diverse. This is sorely lacking in swg pvp as it stands.

Alternatively, I suggest that combat medics be given a mind heal, but only in pvm. This is all most medics want in the first place. We just want to keep our groups alive during pvm combat.

Muad'dib -- Gorath

2 classes working together to become the best healer isnt a exploit or issue...its part of a game that encourages class teamwork and cooperation...

problem is if something like that occurs inside within the same class...if 2 CMs could do what a medic/entertainer could do, I would say that CM was overpowered...

its about class balance really...

I'd like to throw this out there... People seem to want entertainers, or chefs to have this mind-healing ability.

I got no problem with chefs. I can buy their food.

But giving it to entertainers is the wrong answer. The designers said "no bards" early on. The entertainer profession was created to appeal to the "social butterfly" player. The kind of folks who use mmorpgs as a chat room. And it's good for that, lots of people come through the cantina, lots of chat, some roleplaying material too.
This was all pretty well covered in beta.

It just doesn't fit with the stated goal of the entertainer profession.

I followed the development of the entertainer profession very closely, It was NEVER meant to be an out-of-the-cantina profession.
Think of it more like a crafting profession. Necessary, appeals strongly to some people, Able to advance very far in the game... But not good in a firefight.

I don't have a perfect memory, and I don't have backups of those old posts, does anyone from beta have any supporting material they can back me up with?

I dont think adding the ability to mind heal would stop the entertainer from being the "social butterfly" of SWG. On the other hand depending on how u play ur character, anyone could spend all their time in the cantina being a social butterfly.

Just because they could doesnt mean they have to...i mean look at doctors...just because they heal wounds, they have to stay in the hospital? i think not...

adding an ability to the entertainer class would not prevent them from doing what they are already doing and on top of that they would have an added ability that would come in handy if they felt like leaving the cantina...not that they have too...

I'm just sayin'...

Don't expect it to happen. Maybe it should happen, but don't be surprised if it don't happen.

It is kind of immersion breaking though... having a dancer running around the field laying peace-of-mind upon the combatants.

Wounds make perfect sense, but the damage... I just don't see it.

Oh, and another thing, if those mind-healing-food items get the dev's attention. I'm going to need a way to give them to the fighters in the group. Can't trade in combat and all. Some kind of force-feeding skill.

Just kidding... It's Friday, have a good weekend.

omg heaven forbid fighters carry their own mind healing food?!!!!

nooooo u cant do that they have to carry all those...uh...well...uh...

well they have to carry something!

god i dont need to carry anymore crap...i have enuff junk as it is to carry around