Combat Medic Archive
Thread: Thyroid Rupture Comprimise
SpunkyKuma wrote:
Pikeman's warcry and Smuggler's lowblow are 20 seconds, with 2 minute Thyroid it gives you ALL the time to keep yourself healed with 3 different heals while your target tries hitting you at twice as slow, warcry and lowblow gives you enough time to recover then it's back to normal speed again and 20 seconds isn't that critical.
This is incorrect. Against all of my test subjects, the -40 speed debuff took 25% from my targets' attack speed.
Second. I think the Jedi's Armor Break is MUCH, MUCH, MUCH more effective and powerful than our attack speed debuff.
Nerf Jedi Armor Break!!!!!
Die26 wrote:
what i like is the stims that are used to give you 1700 Heals every few secs compared to the 1500 i can do every 6 seconds. TBH the debuff was balanced when I could stack doc buffs and Force speed now it is overpowered I have had CM's with max tapes apply a 50 point speed reduction that is a lot when all i can apply is a +20 force speed. Armour break is not overpowered as you can easily apply 75% armour break reduction with the new slicing. and these items drop from the NPC missions I knwo I have some on my bh alt.
had a great fight with a BH I ran when his mate turned up to stop my stasis. jsut because it pwned his 13 sec paralise lol
First off, Thyroid Rupture enhancers only change the DURATION of the debuff, not the strength as you claim.
Second, the Armor Break Reduction slice provides a 75% CHANCE that an armor break effect will be MITIGATED. The degree of this mitigation is really unknown to me, but it does NOT mean that 75% of the armor break is reduced. I own 8081 energy resist armor sliced to 75% armor break reduction slice. I was hit by a Jedi for almost 1500 damage while I was STANDING UP. I think this should prove my point nicely.
Third, as I have said all throughout this thread and others, a -40 combat speed debuff seems to affect a target's attack speed by ONLY 25% measly percent.
Die26, with your +20 speed and the combat speed enhancing food, you are going to only have your speed reduced by -10, which probably equates to a quarter, or 6% decrease in your attack speed.
Considering that even if my armor mitigates your armor break, you will STILL break my armor at probably 30-70%, which is INCREDIBLY HUGE compared to a PALTRY 6% reduction in attack speed.
I think you need to get a perspective on things before you nerf yet another profession absolutely useless.
Before you retort, please answer if you think that a 25% reduction in attack speed is inbalanced. I want to hear what you have to say. Also remember that intimidate causes a 20% reduction in a target's damage output and that armor break causes a much larger decrease in the ability of people wearing armor to defend against damage.
Ternque01 wrote:
SpunkyKuma wrote:
Pikeman's warcry and Smuggler's lowblow are 20 seconds, with 2 minute Thyroid it gives you ALL the time to keep yourself healed with 3 different heals while your target tries hitting you at twice as slow, warcry and lowblow gives you enough time to recover then it's back to normal speed again and 20 seconds isn't that critical.
This is incorrect. Against all of my test subjects, the -40 speed debuff took 25% from my targets' attack speed.Second. I think the Jedi's Armor Break is MUCH, MUCH, MUCH more effective and powerful than our attack speed debuff.
Nerf Jedi Armor Break!!!!!
Stop saying that 25% crap its totaly wrong. It might slow YOU down that much. it slows your cooldown times. If YOU have no speed or skills it will hurt you a lot.... if you cooldown timer is only equal to 60 (we cant see those numbers) then loosing 40 is a big deal. But if you have 130 loosing 40 dont mean that much at all, expectialy when your alternating shots anyway.
I'm going to conduct a test against a Master Lightsaber Jedi guildmate who has force speed tonight.
I will post my results in this forum so that this non-Jedi skill can remain a useful special. I also very highly look after game balance, too.
Believe me. You will see my numbers soon, and they won't lie.
Quandry wrote:
Stop saying that 25% crap its totaly wrong. It might slow YOU down that much. it slows your cooldown times. If YOU have no speed or skills it will hurt you a lot.... if you cooldown timer is only equal to 60 (we cant see those numbers) then loosing 40 is a big deal. But if you have 130 loosing 40 dont mean that much at all, expectialy when your alternating shots anyway.
tbh you are speaking out your backside if i do not have the 40 point defbuff speed i can attack evey 2 seconds no issues with it applied i attack every 5 seconds sometimes 6 depending on my move that is more that a 25% reduction. it is more than doubling the time between moves and the last time i checked 25% of2 sec was 0.50 so by your maths instead of attacked every 2 seconds i should attack every 2.5 seonds instead of the 5-6 seconds i am doing with the debuff.
I.E it is overpowered it lasts 2 mins and can more than double my time inbetween attacks Either SOE rebalances the Debuff or they rebalance my attack speed your choice.
1. I do not think you are in a position to give SOE an ultimatum that affects every other SWG customer
2. what is your base speed? a MLS will see a smaller difference than a 0/4/0/4 dabbler (or a combinaton thereoff) becuase a MLS has surpassed the capp of 1 attack every 2 secs.... so they have speed modds to spare once that 40% is factored in, esp if they have tapes.
For example, lets say +100 speed with weapon x caps them at 2 attacks per sec.
a MLS has +132 speed with a LS (including genmelee speed) after thyroid rupture they have an effective speed of 79.2
a 0/4/0/4 LS user has 87 2 handed ls speed including gen melee speed after thyroid rupture there effective speed is 52.2
that's a huge difference....
the math is correct, but I pulled the numbers ou of my rear end.
Die26 wrote:
tbh you are speaking out your backside if i do not have the 40 point defbuff speed i can attack evey 2 seconds no issues with it applied i attack every 5 seconds sometimes 6 depending on my move that is more that a 25% reduction. it is more than doubling the time between moves and the last time i checked 25% of2 sec was 0.50 so by your maths instead of attacked every 2 seconds i should attack every 2.5 seonds instead of the 5-6 seconds i am doing with the debuff.
I.E it is overpowered it lasts 2 mins and can more than double my time inbetween attacks Either SOE rebalances the Debuff or they rebalance my attack speed your choice.
I don't buy this. You claim that it makes you two to three times as slower, which is about a 50-66% debuff. Like I said, as soon as my Jedi friend logs in, I'll submit the timestamps to the community.
Until then, keep your comments to yourself, okay?
Ternque01 wrote:
Here are the hard numbers I promised. Read up.
INTRODUCTION
The purpose of this test was to determine the effects of the -40 combat speed debuff possessed by Combat Medics, Pikemen, and Smugglers. Additionally, the test was run to determine, if indeed, that the amount of the debuff can be seen as unbalancing to the game.
PROCEDURE
The test was run on a Jedi player who was capable of Force Speed 1. This buff grants a +10 combat speed bonus. Tests were run with both Force Speed 1 on and off. The duration of the tests was 1 minute each.
RESULTS
Test 1.a) Test subject has Force Speed 1 off, and no debuff is applied to the subject. Saber hit is set to auto attack. Recorded below are the timestamps from the hits, which also include the misses.
23:22:17
23:22:20
23:22:24
23:22:28
23:22:33
23:22:37
23:22:39
23:22:43
23:22:48
23:22:51
23:22:55
23:22:58
23:23:02
23:23:06
23:23:10
23:23:15
Total: 16 attacks
Test 1.b) Test subject has Force Speed off, and a -40 attack speeddebuff is applied to the subject. Saber hit is set to auto attack. Recorded below are the timestamps from the hits, which also include the misses.
23:23:44
23:23:50
23:23:55
23:24:01
23:24:05
23:24:09
23:24:14
23:24:20
23:24:25
23:24:30
23:24:35
23:24:41
Total: 12 attacks
Test 2.a) Test subject has Force Speed 1 on, and no debuff is applied to the subject. Saber hit is set to auto attack. Recorded below are the timestamps from the hits, which also include the misses.
23:16:54
23:16:57
23:17:01
23:17:04
23:17:08
23:17:11
23:17:15
23:17:18
23:17:22
23:17:25
23:17:28
23:17:32
23:17:36
23:17:39
23:17:43
23:17:45
23:17:49
23:17:53
Total: 18 attacks
Test 2.b) Test subject has Force Speed 1 on, anda -40 combat speeddebuff is applied to the subject. Saber hit is set to auto attack. Recorded below are the timestamps from the hits, which also include the misses.
23:19:15
23:19:19
23:19:24
23:19:29
23:19:34
23:19:39
23:19:44
23:19:49
23:19:54
23:19:59
23:20:04
23:20:09
23:20:14
Total: 13 attacks
ANALYSIS
For Test 1, the percentage difference in the hits was 100% - 12/16 = 100% - 75% = 25%.
For Test 2, the percentage difference in the hits was 100% - 13/18 = 100% - 72.2% = 27.8%
Average of the two percentages: (25% + 27.8%)/2 = 26.4%
DISCUSSION
The final result of 26.4% decrease in aplayer's attack speed matches earlier data taken using piket and huurton test subjects, which indicated a little over 25% difference as well. The matchup between NPC and PC numbers is encouraging.
The discrepancy between the 25% and 27.8% debuff could easily be attributed to the restricted length of the testing period, i.e. if the testing were to be conducted over 4 mins a test, one would expect the results to match better. Of course, since this was only a one-minute test, it isn't easily determined by the timestamps.
Overall, a general feel for the actual effects of a -40 combat speed debuff on a player target, especially one capable of buffing their own attack speed, is allowed by using only a one minute testing period.
CONCLUSION
A 26.4% decrease in a target's attack speed in well within balanced parameters for a debuff attack.It is in no danger of disrupting game balance.
your test seems to show how useless a speed buff is.maybe those should have stayed untouched.
anyway one thing you should know about sabers since we are on the subject, the modified speed of the saber isnt the speed you attack at, your base is used when dealing with sabers. so everyone who uses a saber is running around with a natural speed debuff because the system is still buggy. i bet some of those ppl really mess that +5 speed they lostfrom their force speed.
hamhamthe3rd wrote:
your test seems to show how useless a speed buff is.maybe those should have stayed untouched.
anyway one thing you should know about sabers since we are on the subject, the modified speed of the saber isnt the speed you attack at, your base is used when dealing with sabers. so everyone who uses a saber is running around with a natural speed debuff because the system is still buggy. i bet some of those ppl really mess that +5 speed they lostfrom their force speed.