Combat Medic Archive
Thread: Instead of nerfing CMs...
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Sineya
Tue Sep 21, 2004 6:43 am
#1
Selous wrote:
4) combat medics. I know this has been beaten to death but just the same.... People should be able to get/ make/ buy a chem layer to wear under their armor, or a breathing mask or maybe incorperate a layer into armor or all three.
(taken from http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=GCW&message.id=261887
I loev the idea of a breathing masks. It's something already found in SW related stuff (such as KoTOR) so it wouldn't be "unroleplay" and it's the kind of fixes I love, in the same way as Fire Blankets : instead of directly nerfing the numbers, the devs have to use their brain and find something innotative that fixes a problem while at the same adding to the gameplay.
Instead of nerfing the CM range or applying a 75% pvp damage reduction as some people suggested without any imagination or forethought, this item could be equiped at the same time as a regular helm and be crafted by tailors who have long been wondering what "tailor experimentation" is for, it would follow the same rules as regular armors (better with better resources and skills).
A lot of peopel have been long asking CMs pvp power toned down, instead of getting everything done for them they'll have to use a bit more strategy. Instead of an equippable item, the mask could a"usable" item with charges and grantsa30 seconds protection.Tailors would benefit from it and gameplay in general would be enriched. To counterbalance this toning down, the marksman 0004 requirement could be removed ormake it so novice CM has Master Medic and any of the following requirements (left to the personal choice of each player) marksman 4000 or 0400 or 0040 or 0004.
What do you think of this idea ? And what do you think of the numbers should be ? I was thinking of a 75% chance to reduce the damage inflicted by poisons (PvP and PvE) by 1 to 50% depending on the quality of the mask.
NeoEcks
Tue Sep 21, 2004 7:03 am
#2
the idea for rebreathers or resparaters has been around the forums for quite some time.
i myself was a HUGE supporter of the idea and spent many of my first 600 posts promoting the idea, along with the idea that rather than nerfing ANY of the professions, all professions should be brought UP to a level that created balance. i never liked the idea of taking professions DOWN to a level that created balance. pretty soon a new player with a CDEF Pistol and bone armor will be just a powerfull as a TKM / Master Rifelman.
the result?
Combat Medic smacked quarely in the face with the dreaded Nurf bat.
there is a member of the community who has in his or her signature a line that is funny, yet not so funny because it is all too true. it reads something like this:
if an elite combat profession (or 133t dood) were defeated in combat by a chef, they would come to the forums and cry "NERF THE FISH!!"
it is the mentality that everything....EVERYTHING that does not work the way people think it should (ie they should be the most 133t) then the level of power should be reduced, and reduced and reduced...and as i said. soon enough everyone, every single profession becomes boring because no one has any power left at all.
Oops, as you can tell, you have hit one of my hot buttons. let me end by saying the idea of rebreathers and resistance layers to armor *IS* in fact an amazing idea. one that would work wonders and make many, many people happy. it has been beaten to death here in the forums and unfortunately will NEVER be implemented.
p.s. please forgive my spelling mistakes and poor grammar as i have just woken up
i myself was a HUGE supporter of the idea and spent many of my first 600 posts promoting the idea, along with the idea that rather than nerfing ANY of the professions, all professions should be brought UP to a level that created balance. i never liked the idea of taking professions DOWN to a level that created balance. pretty soon a new player with a CDEF Pistol and bone armor will be just a powerfull as a TKM / Master Rifelman.
the result?
Combat Medic smacked quarely in the face with the dreaded Nurf bat.
there is a member of the community who has in his or her signature a line that is funny, yet not so funny because it is all too true. it reads something like this:
if an elite combat profession (or 133t dood) were defeated in combat by a chef, they would come to the forums and cry "NERF THE FISH!!"
it is the mentality that everything....EVERYTHING that does not work the way people think it should (ie they should be the most 133t) then the level of power should be reduced, and reduced and reduced...and as i said. soon enough everyone, every single profession becomes boring because no one has any power left at all.
Oops, as you can tell, you have hit one of my hot buttons. let me end by saying the idea of rebreathers and resistance layers to armor *IS* in fact an amazing idea. one that would work wonders and make many, many people happy. it has been beaten to death here in the forums and unfortunately will NEVER be implemented.
p.s. please forgive my spelling mistakes and poor grammar as i have just woken up
Message Edited by NeoEcks on 09-21-2004 09:05 AM
Sineya
Tue Sep 21, 2004 8:12 am
#3
Maybe this is the mentality of the majority NeoEcks, I agree with you it's sad, but does it really matter? I mean our opinion is rather pointless, it's SoE that has the last call, in the end they're the only ones to decide what they're going to do (and who they want to listen to). Let's just hope they do more things in the line of Fire Blankets rathers than directly nerfing everytime something seems too good.
SolSpur
Tue Sep 21, 2004 8:48 am
#4
The mentality of the swg community has changed from group play to focusing on the individual. Players dont like relying on another. They've asked for everything from a complete removal of cm, to moving cures to medic, to adding rebreathers and poison resist armor layers. Why? So they dont have to rely on another class and be more self sufficient, which goes against everything swg is about.
The problem goes much deeper then cm issues, down to the very core of the game. This is a massive Multiplayer game where group play is incouraged. The fact that a single player can solo lvl 250 missions, elders, and kryates is just wrong. One of the fundamental rules of a mmorpg is class definition. You have the healer (low defence/low attack), the warrior (high attack/low defence), and the tank (high defence/low attack). The tank tanks the mobs, the warrior does the damage dealing, and the healer keeps the group healthy. Each has a set role focused towards group play, alone they are greatly lacking and should be. The problem in swg is you can be the tank, the warrior, and the healer all at once. This negates the need for group play. Being a core problem the heirarchy built upon this flaw has skewed and distorted the ideas of the community. Many are too young to see, others to arrogent to change.
The problem goes much deeper then cm issues, down to the very core of the game. This is a massive Multiplayer game where group play is incouraged. The fact that a single player can solo lvl 250 missions, elders, and kryates is just wrong. One of the fundamental rules of a mmorpg is class definition. You have the healer (low defence/low attack), the warrior (high attack/low defence), and the tank (high defence/low attack). The tank tanks the mobs, the warrior does the damage dealing, and the healer keeps the group healthy. Each has a set role focused towards group play, alone they are greatly lacking and should be. The problem in swg is you can be the tank, the warrior, and the healer all at once. This negates the need for group play. Being a core problem the heirarchy built upon this flaw has skewed and distorted the ideas of the community. Many are too young to see, others to arrogent to change.
somerandomuser
Tue Sep 21, 2004 9:08 am
#5
as one of my many ramblings.. i'd also tossed up this idea..
i still think it's a viable solution if implemented properly.. *shudders at the thought of improper implementations
i still think it's a viable solution if implemented properly.. *shudders at the thought of improper implementations
Furiouschicken
Tue Sep 21, 2004 9:12 am
#6
Is everyone living in a vault? Doctors have innoculationsfor poison and disease as well as area cures now.
Sineya
Tue Sep 21, 2004 3:01 pm
#7
Soulspur and Furiouschicken, I guess you're right, CMs are balanced the way it is right now, we just need to learn to play together and especially with a doc.
But my point is still the same, SoE, please try to be creative when "nerfing". Often adding something to the game(play) is way better than decreasing the numbers.
NeoEcks
Tue Sep 21, 2004 3:34 pm
#8
Furiouschicken wrote:Is everyone living in a vault? Doctors have innoculationsfor poison and disease as well as area cures now.
no one is living in a vault. as i said the CM profession was in fact hit squarely in the face with the nerf bat. check out the many posts about how powerful even *B* level resist buffs are.
it was costly to be a CM before, and now the cost has increased by 5 - 7 times, as it can take that many throws to get a single posion or disease to stick. not always, but it can.
please don't forget the fact that we toss CRAFTED items with RARE resources as components. every toss hurts the bank account.
rhaspede
Tue Sep 21, 2004 3:54 pm
#9
The mentality of the swg community has changed from group play to focusing on the individual. Players dont like relying on another. They've asked for everything from a complete removal of cm, to moving cures to medic, to adding rebreathers and poison resist armor layers. Why? So they dont have to rely on another class and be more self sufficient, which goes against everything swg is about.
The problem goes much deeper then cm issues, down to the very core of the game. This is a massive Multiplayer game where group play is incouraged. The fact that a single player can solo lvl 250 missions, elders, and kryates is just wrong. One of the fundamental rules of a mmorpg is class definition. You have the healer (low defence/low attack), the warrior (high attack/low defence), and the tank (high defence/low attack). The tank tanks the mobs, the warrior does the damage dealing, and the healer keeps the group healthy. Each has a set role focused towards group play, alone they are greatly lacking and should be. The problem in swg is you can be the tank, the warrior, and the healer all at once. This negates the need for group play. Being a core problem the heirarchy built upon this flaw has skewed and distorted the ideas of the community. Many are too young to see, others to arrogent to change.
The problem goes much deeper then cm issues, down to the very core of the game. This is a massive Multiplayer game where group play is incouraged. The fact that a single player can solo lvl 250 missions, elders, and kryates is just wrong. One of the fundamental rules of a mmorpg is class definition. You have the healer (low defence/low attack), the warrior (high attack/low defence), and the tank (high defence/low attack). The tank tanks the mobs, the warrior does the damage dealing, and the healer keeps the group healthy. Each has a set role focused towards group play, alone they are greatly lacking and should be. The problem in swg is you can be the tank, the warrior, and the healer all at once. This negates the need for group play. Being a core problem the heirarchy built upon this flaw has skewed and distorted the ideas of the community. Many are too young to see, others to arrogent to change.
Wow, what an amazingly adept post! You've hit the nail square on the head with that one.
Brainplay
Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:42 am
#10
The new resist buffs are the resists that everyone wanted and finally got. Unfortunately its limited duration and has to come from a doctor which make people grumble more when they have to continually shell out cash to a single profession. Too many people are lazy and wanted something they could wear 24/7 without any penalties. There were plenty that wanted to be able to make these into bio-engineer enhanced shirts and such.
Then again if they want another form of defense they should push that smuggler spice forward. It made more sense than these doctor buffs ever did.
I totally agree with the other poster on the mentality of SWG players. They are lazy and spoon-fed morons. This has got to be the first MMO where grouping is considered a show of weakness and where if something cant be soloed its considered"too tough and neededs to be remade". Nova Troopers are a perfect example.
Khragon
Wed Sep 22, 2004 4:46 am
#11
People need to wait for the CR to see how they plan to deal with the unhealable mind pool. Things will be signifigantly different if mind pool becomes healable through use of stims for example. Remember they do have some plans made for combat changes, only down side is we have to wait for it.
Furiouschicken
Thu Sep 23, 2004 1:40 pm
#12
Furiouschicken wrote:
Is everyone living in a vault? Doctors have innoculationsfor poison and disease as well as area cures now.
no one is living in a vault. as i said the CM profession was in fact hit squarely in the face with the nerf bat. check out the many posts about how powerful even *B* level resist buffs are.
it was costly to be a CM before, and now the cost has increased by 5 - 7 times, as it can take that many throws to get a single posion or disease to stick. not always, but it can.
please don't forget the fact that we toss CRAFTED items with RARE resources as components. every toss hurts the bank account.
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Point taken. My response was more toward the original post which I take as offering a solution the the "Combat Medic Problem". I don't particulary like the current resolution that was whipped out to appease the UBER players who have confused SWG with the first person shooter of their choice. However, theresult is out there and more suggestions on how to negate a class more seem uneeded at this point.
Sineya
Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:00 pm
#13
Hehe to be honest,I was indeedliving in a "vault", I've been away from the game for3 months and didn't notice docs have had new packs. I actually feel ashamed now
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