Combat Medic Archive
Thread: Need a way to get resources without Survey!
Hi guys,
This is a post I made on the "Official problems" list that filthy_mcnasty started. I just wanted more people to read it because a lot of people have been saying that it's not a big deal that Combat Medics have to get survey in order to survive. So I started this post with the attached message. Give feedback.
Leha
filthy_mcnasty wrote:
GENERAL ISSUES THAT ARE NOT SPECIFICALL COMBAT MEDIC RELATED:
VERY specific resources require for medicines and components. This affects ALL crafting classes. You have 81 skill pts available after Mastering Combat Medic (and getting the required skills for Novice Combat Medic). It might be wise to spend some getting Surveying 4, or buying a few harvesters to supply yourself with resources and a source of income.
Though you have 81 points left after reaching Master Combat Medic, it does not make sense to put 29 points into getting survey 4. Though it makes sense to have the skill as you're moving up the ranks, and it even makes sense to have it as you are a master, it does nto make sense to hold on to it when you are deciding the overall fate of your character. When you get novice Combat Medic, assuming you used one gun type for your combat exp, you will have novice second tier gunman, rifleman for me, and halfway through the first skill of the profession. So in my mind, it follows logically that you would want to master that weapon class in the long run. This is indeed the most popular plan for combat medic I have seen, 2nd lvl gunman/combat medic. There is alsothe doctor/combatmed/novicemarksman combo, but this message applies less to them. So it is impossible to master the rifleman skill and combat medic while haveing 29 points in artisan skills. This seems absolutely absurd to me.
If you think about it, you are wasting 29 points in a profession that has nothing to do with combat medic. I have no intention of crafting anything Artisan oriented in the long run, yet I'm forced to waste points in a profession just to be able to play my chosen class. Let's just take a look at some of the other non-artisan crafting classes to compare. First, we have the scout. The scout needs to craft traps and camps, but their crafts are almost completely self dependent on their own profession, needing skins/bones/etc that they get from scouting, not from artisan. The little bit of surveyable materials they need can be bought at barely any cost to them. Then we look at the major example, the bioengineer, the only actual crafting class apart from artisan tree. Of course they survey to rise in Organic Chem, but when they become a bio eng, they have their own skill tree to gather resources necessary for them: DNA Harvest. I do not know any bio engs, so I don't know how much surveyed resources they requrie. However, they still have their own internal way of gathering resources apart from getting skills in another non related profession. Medic, you can hardly argue against it, are very very crafting dependent. It's not like smugglers who can craft spices if they would like. Our whole livelihood depends on crafting: we can not get any real medical xp without it. So logic follows that: Shouldn't medics have an internal way of gaining resources apart from having a whole different profession under their belt that they have no intention of actually using? Medical forage would be the attempt at providing medics with this, but as we all know, it is completely worthless (even though a whole tree of medic gives points to improve it). No other class is restricted in this way of being forced to get another profession like medics are. Other classes might get survey to speed things up a little, but survey would be the first to go if they had to decide. Now why should I have to surrender Rifleman skills instead just to continue my career as a combat medic.
For all of you who would say that I should suck it up, sacrifice survey and get rifleman, and pay for all my resources: does it really make sense that I shoudl be forced to make such a decision? It's just bad game design. It's not possible to survey for harvesters without at least 15 points wasted. And why should medics be forced to giving up such an absurd amount of money just so that they can continue to exist. Other professions may need to spend a little to craft some of their goods (Scouts), or would spend it to speed things up while being able to get it themselves anyway (advanced artisan classes). But we would have to buy everything just to continue to play a medic. If this doesn't sound outrageous, then I don't know what to say. Being a combat medic doesn't leave you with 81 points, it essentially leaves you with 52. Survey+Artisan is just another branch of medics, making the requirements so much more.
Now I will look into why I should have a skill like rifleman at all. First of all, being restricted from being able to have it mastered because I am a combat medic is another game design issue. Combat Medics are not a self sufficient profession in itslef. This means that it is really not possible to be a CM and just that, without having to team up with people every minute. When a CM poisons another enemy is s/he supposed to sit still and let it bash on him until the medicine wears out? The nature of our profession requries us to go out into the field, but how can we do that without a strong weaponing skill. Bounty Hunters and Commandos would be self-sufficient hyrbid professions. CM would be more like the Creature Handler or Ranger, helpful skills to have in combat, but clearly not meant to stand alone like the Bounty Hunter or Commando. Surely if ranged 4 is a requirement, SOE must have intended that the CM pursue the higher level weapon skills. Yet, this is not fully possible with the survey 4 requirement.
Another thing to think about: Smugglers (a hybrid support class like CMs) too were once in the situation I feel CMs are in right now. They are also a non self-sufficient class. They are a mostly support class, but they require fighting exp. Their skills as a smuggler do not allow them to do this very well, so they undeniably need pistoleer. However they used to have an additional requriement in beta to what they have now: Business 4. this is obviously very limiting for the smuggler to get the skills he needs. Businessman doesn't logically help the smuggler class anyway, except for being able to sell his spices, and it would require at least 29 points. They would probably need engineering or domestic for a few lvls too, because i can't see people grinding novice artisan crafts for 4 levles of crafting. They would probably get survey for a few levels as well to supplementtheir resouce needs. Granted they could surrender these, it is more time down the drain. Seeing as business is a real burden to smugglers and not a benefit at all, SOE eliminated the requierment. AndI think Commandos once required Engineering 4 as well. Obviously this is a baseless requiremnt. Even though commandos are more or less self-sufficient in being able to fight without a support profession, SOE was wise in getting rid of this requirement. So that leaves us, Combat Medics, as the only ones left to have Artisan requirements (even though survey is not a written requirement, it is stilla necessary one) that are a hinderance: restricting our skill choices while not really supplementing our ability as a medic.
The Bottom Line: Medics need an adequate way of obtaining their own resoruces from within their profession. Maybe surveyshould be a helpful skill to have, but not necessary as it is now. It just doesn't make sense that the medic class is so intricately linked and dependant on the artisan class, which they don't really intend to pursue. Why is combat medic a medic/gunman/artisan hyrbid. It's too much to do in one character.
Thanks for reading my rant.
Leha Longshot - Flurry - Novice Rifleman, Novice Combat Medic (Novice Artisan with survey 4 AAAARGH!!)
yup Leha, I said it in the original thread and i'll keep saying it until its changed, you're 100% right. forcing us to rely on the artisan tree nerfs our top end characters immeaseurably.
Another issue with having to pay for the resources that you would need if you didn't have survey:
Every other class that does spend money on resources often or occasionally have a good way of making the money to pay. Marksmen and brawlers can easily rake in a ton of cash with missioning, while also getting the combat exp they need to advance their professions. Scouts often sell their hides and bones, since they are in high demand from artisans and some medics as well. Also, the amount scouts need to buy to craft is not much, since they don't need to grindoutthe camps to get some sort of crafting exp. Smugglers sell their services for slicing, allowing them to makea good deal of money for spices. And of course, artisans, who use harvesters, can sell their crafts at a big cashbenefit to themselves. Now that leaves medics: how do we get our money? Through one100 credit tip every 30 minutes? Of course we can do destroy missions, but doesn't that defeat the point all together? All the other classes can make money doing things specific to their own class, but medics cannot. Of course combat medics are meant to fight at times, and since they wouldn't have survey, allowing them to further pursue their marksman skills, missioning is not a problem for them. However, it still doesn't make up for the fact that a medic has to stray away from his/her tasks to get money so that he or she can continue to craft their medicine. Doctors are essentially screwed because they might not necessarily have the combat skills, and would be restricted to doing delivery missions forhours (A huge waste of time!!)
You could argue that combat medics can heal in the field with a missioning team to make money. This make sense except it's kind of a burden to find a group to do missions all the time, and often these groups are unorganized and inexperienced. I've been runnign around doing missions for so long now to pay for my maintenance that I barely do any healing anymore. Mymedicalexperience is limited to people I run into having trouble in the field. All these annoyances with making money is not a huge deal, but the fact that there is no alternative to it is a big deal. I would be glad to choose to make money if I wanted to speed things up withharvesters and factories, but the fact that I am restricted to doing so is very aggravating. All the more reason to give us some sort of way to get our own resources without having to rely on artisans.
Leha
you are indeed not wrong, but you still cannot master rifleman with that 15 points taken up, add it up urself.
Leha
yeah, but guess what? thats 15 skills wasted down the drain that prevent me from mastering a combat profession (pistoleer, rifleman, carbineer).
leha's right, I spend all my time harvesting nowadays rather than fighting and am still broke. I harvest, do some destroy missions, and harvest some more and I'm the poorest girl this side of the galaxy (I never have more than 10k creds). If I wasnt part of a guild who keeps up a chem factory for which I now have admin to I have no idea what in the name of all that is holy I'd do to get my factory components. I sure as hell dont have the money to pay for the upkeep on one, let alone the initial cost....
/cry
in order to get novice artisan, you have to spend 15 skill pts which equals a whole skill tree line. best if it could be used somewhere else than on novice artisan.
My math really could be wrong though, tell me if I am.
Leha
If you feel that you must specialize this far, then you end up relying on other players for your resources. This is how the game was developed. An inter-dependance on other player characters for resources/items/etc. Giving Combat Medics their own way go to gather resources would be nice. But I dont think its a viable option for SOE. Especially now, when they could be fixing the class, instead of changing the game mechanicsto make it easier. (might bemore enjoyable, since not many people like being dependant on others for their fun)
Two ways to get around this... buy your resources from the bazaar or join a PA and get something organized to where you can get resources not only for yourself, but other medics/combat medics/crafters for your guild. It works well like this and you can share the cost. Just my .002 cents.
SchuckBOT - Defiance - DownFin server