Cities And Housing Archive
Thread: NPC City Player Housing
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Skauna
Sun Apr 03, 2005 3:21 am
#1
Ok many people in Expansion forum have though of ways to implement NPC City Player Housing.
Then I thought wait lol maybe i should post this in the Housing forums. So hres the idea, though most of it evolves around other planets that ppl want to be added.
In an NPC City there would be apartments. Depending on the city size, there would be a limit to number of people living in city. For example. Coronet could allow maybe 200 or250people but moenia only 100 because of its small size and Coronet is a very large city (swg). Ok back to the idea. A player would be allowed to go inside an apartment and walk to whatever floor they want, elevator usualy. They can find a room they want that is not occupied and buy it. They will pay a tax each week of a certain amount of credits, this would depend on the city, location of apartment, and the location of the room or rooms. So a small room in the back of Moenia would be maybe 500 credits a week, but a large apartment at the top of a sky rise in Coronet would be 5 to 10k a week. A player would treat it like a house. They can even setup vendors, also you would enter the apartment same way u enter a house. Unless the person has the privacy. Also in cities, if a rebel has a large apartment ina high rise then of course he will be more noticable to the Empire.
DigitalOne
Sun Apr 03, 2005 4:16 am
#2
I'm a strong advocate of NPC city housing and appartments, and have been proposing different variants of these features since beta.
I think limits would be a very bad idea, all apparemtents would be filled up within moments of being implemented (unless the limits are in the thousands) then you run the risk of having many if not all of the appartment slots being grandfathered and completely unavailable to new players.
Rendering the interior of the buldings would be cool, but isnt entirely needed. Perhaps an terminal on the outside of a building could grant the player access to an instanced dwelling containing their possessions.
The problem with appartments is that they are understandably more favorable than player cities (which i hate btw), so certain incentives must be implemented that favor PC cities. Appartments should be expensive, even a small appartment should cost more than a large house per week. Renting an appartment should automaticaly become your residance making you unable to vote or take place in PC city politics without moving out.
It would be cool, but possibly hard to implement, is to have police searches from time to time. If you have contraband lieing around in your house, you might log in one day to find that you have been fined a hefty sum (or having been burgled of cash on more anarchic worlds).
I'm not sure if there need to be multiple sizes for appartments, maybe Loft, double, suite. But it would also be acceptable to have only one floorplan per planet. Another cool thing would be windows, but that would most likely be to hard to put in.
The two rules of thumb for this issue are #1 Appartments must be available to everyone, provided they have income. #2 Appartments have well known advantages (being central, close to starports/economic activity), but they must also possess clear disadvantages to not jeapordize PC city activity on each server.
bluejanus
Sun Apr 03, 2005 6:20 am
#3
There's enough lag in cities without loading in player apartments. Assuming this could be remedied, people having apartments would use up lots. The cost of renting (since there's no way the Devs would give control to a PC to be mayor) has to be unusually high. The storage space should also be much less. You shouldn't be able to heal and entertain in an apartment. There shouldn't be any merchant customizable signs to change and no titles to apartments other than Apt 5A.
Dazzydoodle
Sun Apr 03, 2005 5:31 pm
#5
Lag wouldn't be any worse, simply because no information regarding apartments need be loaded until you enter a building. It's the same as in player cities.Driving by amall with hundreds of items has no effect on your system until you enter the mall.
bluejanus
Sun Apr 03, 2005 8:58 pm
#6
Dazzydoodle wrote:
Lag wouldn't be any worse, simply because no information regarding apartments need be loaded until you enter a building. It's the same as in player cities.Driving by amall with hundreds of items has no effect on your system until you enter the mall.
Yes there would. Apartments wouldn't be instanced by when YOU entered them. They would be loaded when SOMEONE entered them. If we're talking about a significant number of people's apartments in one area, you're talking about an unusual number of loading attempts per space.
MolCaldon
Mon Apr 04, 2005 11:17 am
#7
just not let people not in your group enter your apartment. or people which you have granted access. then you just have to render the terminal area in which you load into your apartment. not the apartments themselves. oops. there was the lag issue gone...
and what about all this oh no, lets keep apartments sooo expensive that everyone will want to live in a player city...? why? to make more ghost towns?? what for? come one, give me a good reason that there should be as many player cities as there are?
there are too many, thats why they're ghost towns...! so get rid of some of them, whats the problem?
yes, i know, the architects.... but they seriously need to get something else to do... maybe they should get something to do in NPC cities as well... something that needs to be done again and again, like all the other professions.
because there will not be a demand for player houses forever... that is, i hope not, as i hope this game will survive forever...
or at least a while longer.
give us appartments, and not expensive ones. at least not all of them. suites and such should be expensive. but a small apartment in mos eisley...? no way that those are expensive...
but reduced space sounds good. that makes sense.
oh well, my 2 cents.
and what about all this oh no, lets keep apartments sooo expensive that everyone will want to live in a player city...? why? to make more ghost towns?? what for? come one, give me a good reason that there should be as many player cities as there are?
there are too many, thats why they're ghost towns...! so get rid of some of them, whats the problem?
yes, i know, the architects.... but they seriously need to get something else to do... maybe they should get something to do in NPC cities as well... something that needs to be done again and again, like all the other professions.
because there will not be a demand for player houses forever... that is, i hope not, as i hope this game will survive forever...
or at least a while longer.give us appartments, and not expensive ones. at least not all of them. suites and such should be expensive. but a small apartment in mos eisley...? no way that those are expensive...
but reduced space sounds good. that makes sense.
oh well, my 2 cents.
bluejanus
Mon Apr 04, 2005 8:13 pm
#8
MolCaldon wrote:
just not let people not in your group enter your apartment. or people which you have granted access. then you just have to render the terminal area in which you load into your apartment. not the apartments themselves. oops. there was the lag issue gone...
and what about all this oh no, lets keep apartments sooo expensive that everyone will want to live in a player city...? why? to make more ghost towns?? what for? come one, give me a good reason that there should be as many player cities as there are?
there are too many, thats why they're ghost towns...! so get rid of some of them, whats the problem?
yes, i know, the architects.... but they seriously need to get something else to do... maybe they should get something to do in NPC cities as well... something that needs to be done again and again, like all the other professions.
because there will not be a demand for player houses forever... that is, i hope not, as i hope this game will survive forever...
give us appartments, and not expensive ones. at least not all of them. suites and such should be expensive. but a small apartment in mos eisley...? no way that those are expensive...
but reduced space sounds good. that makes sense.
oh well, my 2 cents.
I wasn't talking about one apartment, I was talking about all the apartments in a building. You're loading all the apartments in a building once you step inside the building (it's the same as if you stacked a bunch of houses on top of each other). Ideal conditions are that only one person loads the whole building that day. But realistically more than one person will keep the structure loaded and reloaded regularly. The lag issue isn't gone unless they allocate that much more memory to NPC cities. I don't see the benefit, since they still need memory to load the areas that a player city might be at.
If you don't like the ghost player cities, don't go to them. The devs decided the maximum number of player cities. If you have a beef with the number, take it up with them.
I stipulated a bunch of penalties to these apartments, so that they don't become free/cheap storage for players. As for the expense, my understanding that it costs more to live in urban areas than it is to live in the boonies or the lower levels (if you're on Coruscant).
Kalinrey
Mon Apr 04, 2005 9:09 pm
#9
If I might put an Idea in.
Think of each location such as Coro or Tyrena as a module. Now you can transport to those modules via shuttleports.
What if as someone suggested we have a main entry, or a main door, with an access terminal. You enter in the suite number, and if you are on the admin/entry list you are transported to that module, or you can click on "home" and be transported to your apartment.
In this way every Suite is a self contained module that would take you OUT of Coro and alone.
So in fact reducing lag.
the tileset generationcould be handled simplyby having an instance generate a floorplan upon ask to enter. and as player housing is done now, load up any items inside upon entry.
Poldano
Fri Apr 08, 2005 6:52 pm
#10
Kalinrey, you da man (I hope I got the gender right!).
Apartment buildings are tall, and have elevators. The elevators could work like guild-hall elevators, but dump players directly into apartments. The apartments would exist in some graphical never-never land, where the outside world would be invisible, and nothing could see into them. This would way reduce lag, eliminate radar painting, etc. I guess this could be considered a kind of instancing, perhaps like in EQ (I'm not familiar with the details there).
Supply and demand would need to be worked out. I'm thinking of something that would bleed credits for convenience. I.e., if you want the convenience of Coronet or Naboo, it's going to cost you, just like Manhattandoes in real life, for example. I think some kind of auction-lease arrangement could work in this regard. Apartment lease cost could be dependent on the number of vacant apartments in the city (or building) available and the duration of the lease. I'm sure this will be unpopular with some, but I'm very much a fan of economic aspects.
Saego
GanymedePharuu
Fri Apr 08, 2005 7:20 pm
#11
instanced apartments for the win! 
once we start moving players into the big cities (NPC cities, but we can't call them NPC anymore) a Player Politician elected city council would be a great idea.
see this post for my idea regarding a Player Politician city council:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=citieshousing&message.id=5267
Message Edited by GanymedePharuu on 04-08-2005 07:22 PM
bluejanus
Fri Apr 08, 2005 9:54 pm
#12
GanymedePharuu wrote:
instanced apartments for the win!
once we start moving players into the big cities (NPC cities, but we can't call them NPC anymore) a Player Politician elected city council would be a great idea.
see this post for my idea regarding a Player Politician city council:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=citieshousing&message.id=5267
Message Edited by GanymedePharuu on 04-08-2005 07:22 PM
So how is this that much different from a player city? And I don't think the devs would like a player mayor of a NPC city. That would mean you could ban other players from a NPC city.
GanymedePharuu
Sat Apr 09, 2005 8:27 am
#13
this system would be different. i'm thinking outside the box of the current Player city system.but its implimentation isNOT much different from a player city, which is the point. the Players are the population. we should control things.
bluejanus wrote:
GanymedePharuu wrote:
instanced apartments for the win!
once we start moving players into the big cities (NPC cities, but we can't call them NPC anymore) a Player Politician elected city council would be a great idea.
see this post for my idea regarding a Player Politician city council:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=citieshousing&message.id=5267
Message Edited by GanymedePharuu on 04-08-2005 07:22 PM
So how is this that much different from a player city? And I don't think the devs would like a player mayor of a NPC city. That would mean you could ban other players from a NPC city.
there is one difference though. starports.given the chancepeople wouldwant to live as close to them as possible. the same occurs in real life. that's why the worlds metropolitan areas are so... metropolitan! hehe.
and i don't really think there should be one mayor. but there should be a city council of like 9 or 13 (would have to be odd so there's no vote ties).
city ban is a rediculous idea in the first place. if there's a particular person the council didn't want coming into their city then they could put them on a "wanted" list which would aggro the city'sNPC law enforcement to that person or even opening the person up to PvP when they enter the city.
griefing the person by putting them on a "wanted" list wouldn't be so easy because you'd need a unanimous vote from the city council.
Message Edited by GanymedePharuu on 04-09-2005 08:29 AM
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