Cities And Housing Archive
Thread: City Maint fees bankrupting mayors?
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kandee
Thu Jan 20, 2005 10:20 am
#1
I am just wondering how many mayors out there are now footing the entire responsibility for the cities maint fees? On our server there is such a struggle to maintain citizens because of the number of players that have left the game that unless you are the city of a large guild it is almost impossible to implement taxes as people wont, cant afford them anymore. Therefore mayors are left to be soley responsible to pay maint fees which can be very expensive. Even with only a couple of gardens in my level 4 town it cost me 541k per week maint. My citizens do try to help but many have said with the solo group nerf and the high cost of items in game now they dont have the cash to make large donations.
Are other mayors having the same problem or is it just me?
Sidious_Inoxi
Thu Jan 20, 2005 10:49 am
#2
You are not alone...i spent about 100 million credits for my both cities, including maintenance, structures, gardens and so on. But still, people in my city seem to be very much able to donate appropriate sums to keep it running when I remind them about the costs.
Have a large city, face the costs, but fact is, i dont really get a payment so the politician has to find his way to make cash. Because of the skill point costs for Master Politicians, its always a drawback to have profitable templates with abilities to defend yourself. So either crafter/politician or fighter/politician, but not a mix...at least not yet. Lets wait for the Combat Update.
tikimatsuma
Thu Jan 20, 2005 10:59 am
#3
you are not alone there are many cities with this problem, especially now that the group nerf happened my city is at 514k per week and some weeks it is hard to keep up on it without private donations
ElessarRocks
Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:03 am
#4
i foot the bill too, but im the guild leader not the mayor
Khristen
Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:11 am
#5
Mayor's are not solely responsible for the city's maintenance fees, only for informing their citizens. Every single citizen needs to take responsibility for the well-being of the city.
Player's can easily afford 2k a week in income tax--even for a noob that's only about 2-3 missions off of the mission terminal. Blaming the solo group "nerf" for failing cities is more laziness than truth, in my opinion at least. There are so many ways to make money in this game, for combat and non-combat types alike. Taxes alone won't always do it (although a fix on the sales tax so it actually worked would make this possible..... /hint /hint). Generally when people know the city's in trouble, they'll donate. They have to know it first, though.
Take a good look at your city maintenance. What's costing you the most? Maybe you need to pull some gardens or decorations or extra trainers. A mayor should let their citizens know what's going on, not just quietly foot the bill. Anyone can view the maintenance report on the city terminal.
A mayor is supposed to be a caretaker and a leader for a Player City. That definition doesn't include sole financial backer, though.
Veustuh
Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:17 am
#6
This is why I've suggested in the past along with others that cities be setup like faction bases. Players who run missions from the cities help generate revenue back to the city in order to help pay for maintenance. The only downfall of this idea is that players could run missions to rack up over a year's worth of maintenance but the city be devote of active players (i.e. the ghost towns we'll see in months after building and structure condemning). This would rob new cities from obtaining a level 4 title if the planet the city is located on is deadlocked on the number of level 4 and 5 cities allowed on that planet. In this case it could be near impossible to let an upcoming city obtain a shuttle port and city level if the planet is filled with dead cities. Not really sure what a good compromise would be but in any case there needs to be money going back into player cities that aren't coming from a mayor's pocket.
Rogue1970
Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:44 am
#7
Actually the issue is the fact that SALES TAX is broken. It does not get collected 90% of the time - it goes to the merchant instead.
I run a city with a active Mall - we can do 10-50mil in sales a day - and NEVER have I seen more than 100k in city revenue in a day.
I monitor it frequeently and keep tabs on the sale os our larger merchants to compare - it never makes sense or goes to the treasury as intended.
I have tested it with a single 17million credit transaction on a vendor and saw ZERO credits end up in the treasury.
I finally gave up /bugging it and abolished sales tax in favor of a monthly plea for donations instead.
IolasMacLeod
Thu Jan 20, 2005 11:56 am
#8
The main problem is a city that sees little traffic coming through does not do to well. A city is very expensive and you need taxes to make the city self sufficient. Property tax probablly works best as long as it does not drive your citizens away.
kandee
Thu Jan 20, 2005 12:05 pm
#9
IolasMacLeod wrote:
The main problem is a city that sees little traffic coming through does not do to well. A city is very expensive and you need taxes to make the city self sufficient. Property tax probablly works best as long as it does not drive your citizens away.
But that is my point, players are leaving, that isa fact, so many if not all cities are struggling to keep their player levels and if not sponsored by a large guild they are making offers to players of no taxes, free housing ect. Therefore if you try to implement or raise taxes, there ant many other cities that plaers will move too.
I do keep my citizens informed and the long term players will donate to help. But it would be nice since it takes skill points to have politician that we got some type of salary to help with income.
Nokor
Thu Jan 20, 2005 12:06 pm
#10
Your worries should soon go with the new publish... They're making politician a non-skill point profession like the pilot classes are so you can finally have some proper combat/crafting skills. Here
Message Edited by Nokor on 01-20-2005 07:06 PM
Kinshi
Thu Jan 20, 2005 3:36 pm
#11
You realize that the solo group nerf in NO WAY relates to not being able to afford taxes?
the city does not get a cut of the rewards from the mission terminal
You get the cash from sales tax from vendors, property taxes from houses and other structures, shuttleport fees, and direct donations, thats it.
It boils down to the simple fact that if there is a shortfall, your city is living beyond its means and needs to downsize. (just like in R/L) It means you need to create reasons to get more people to come live in your town.
While yea some have left for other games, the town I call home on Tat is growing not shrinking. We have 2 med centers, 2 sets of mission terminals, 2 bank terminals,and all the other things inc a city hall, a dedicated militia hall, and a very busy shopping district and a heavily populated industrial district. (we have over 80 citizens, 75% active players, and almost 190 structures in our city). Also have a shuttleport, garage, 2 guild halls, multiple parks, street lamps, signs, etc.
We also have NO sales tax. The town is funded by property taxes and donations alone. And NO ONE whines about being too broke to make donations because we all realize there is no such thing as a free ride.
the city does not get a cut of the rewards from the mission terminal
You get the cash from sales tax from vendors, property taxes from houses and other structures, shuttleport fees, and direct donations, thats it.
It boils down to the simple fact that if there is a shortfall, your city is living beyond its means and needs to downsize. (just like in R/L) It means you need to create reasons to get more people to come live in your town.
While yea some have left for other games, the town I call home on Tat is growing not shrinking. We have 2 med centers, 2 sets of mission terminals, 2 bank terminals,and all the other things inc a city hall, a dedicated militia hall, and a very busy shopping district and a heavily populated industrial district. (we have over 80 citizens, 75% active players, and almost 190 structures in our city). Also have a shuttleport, garage, 2 guild halls, multiple parks, street lamps, signs, etc.
We also have NO sales tax. The town is funded by property taxes and donations alone. And NO ONE whines about being too broke to make donations because we all realize there is no such thing as a free ride.
Smart_Darwin
Fri Jan 21, 2005 11:02 am
#12
I don't know if people are really leaving in droves (unfortunate if true), but if it is the case, then this would suggest we need fewer player cities. With a reduced supply of citicens, comes a reduced demand for living spots. It is a rough thing to comes to grips with if you have worked hard to maintain your city, but sometimes cities fail for reasons beyond the control of its leaders. While perhaps you could offer better reasons to pick your city, I suspect most options available do not offer any unique advantages (everyone has access to the same shuttle-ports, etc.). Think about this as a resident: Why should I choose your city as opposed to any other city?
Perhaps politicians could compete for limited leadership spots. Every few units of time city residents get to choose among a number of mayor candidates. This means that SWG could hace more politicians than cities (not unreasonable) and they ALL have potential for employments and advancement. If you link special bonuses for cities linked to the level of politician they elect, then you could have a real dogfight on your hands (like PvP for politicians... one would hope without guns).
I can see it now... barker droids at every shuttleport spouting negative ads. Yipee!
ana-mo-cara
Fri Jan 21, 2005 3:08 pm
#13
For one thing people giveing you this line are just abuseing you for free stuff.
Though cities in general have alot of problems. Number one among them there are too many cities on each planet, and when I go to these places I generally find none and no real services.
What is needed is the following.
First I know I will get hell for this, but remove the damned mayor point system. This is why you get all these little nitwitted cities. The mayor can totally screw around and not run a good city. There are multimillionaires in the game, and they can just afford to blow money. If a player wants to be a mayor all that player should be required to do is maybe spend five hundred apprentiship points and a large novice training fee. One this will get rid of these inept mayors who are not imposeing any order. This is why some players think they can get away with non taxes. They know they can go to another town and get another shuttleport and not have to pay.
Make city services pay for themselves. If a player wants to use the job market terminals he should be in that player city. He wants the research bonus he should be in that city.
Bring back citywarn. To chase out rifraf players, and allow player votes for evicting players from the city. If a player gets evicted they would get a week to remove their structure from the city. Then a militia member named treasurer can seize the property and all items in said property for dispersal to the community.
Cap city citizenship. 80 players for the highest city rank. I wonder whats going on in some of these cities. Check out the citizenships on some of them and they have like 100 people liveing in the city. A hard cap of 80 for the max is the real way to go.
Give the cities better structures. Plus more ways to design.
Cities should get walls with arched entrances when cities look nice people take more pride in liveing in them. City structures could also use not looking rediculous a bank should look like a bank a garage like a garage.
Allow mayors to set up no build zones. So that a mayor could determine how a structures get layed out. Allow mayors to zone the communities in advance. Allow mayors to apply standards. Example tattooin large and mediums but no generics.
I hate to see cities bribeing players to join cities. I think the biggest issue is that there is like no difference between a well run town and pitch where every you like.
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