Chef Archive
Thread: Do you experiment 1 point at a time?
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Usisco
Tue Jan 04, 2005 11:21 am
#1
Pretty simple question, up till now, I had been experimenting 1 point at a time in all my crafting professions. Never really thought about it though, whether it would mean better or worse results? Any comments on this?
Osrid
Tue Jan 04, 2005 11:25 am
#2
Well as I understand it you get the exp result for how many points you go on, so if you get an amazing on 1 point thats only the value of one amazing but if you get an amazing on 3 points thats like exping 3 amazings (thats the way I understand it anyways).
So I always us a bespin port and do about 3 points.
So I always us a bespin port and do about 3 points.
sciguyCO
Tue Jan 04, 2005 11:44 am
#3
Number of points used per experiment seems to be a personal choice, but here's the low-down on most of it:
1) The gain in the category is determined by the type of success (good, great, amazing) and the number of points spent. Great success adds 7% per point spent, an amazing success adds 8% per point spent. So a lot of crafters prefer to spend a lot of points at once to take advantage of an amazing success if they get lucky. If you spend 7 points and get an amazing success, that's the same as spending 8 points and getting a great success, so crafters without extra experimentation points can narrow the gap a little with the 12 point crafters by retrying until they get amazing successes.
2) The type of success you get when experimenting depends on your experimentation skill mod, tool/station quality, some misc bonus (FS skills, bespin port, research center), and the number of points spent on that experiment. Spending more points means that you're less likely to get a "great" or "amazing" success. At Master, I seem to get great success 95% of the time if I spend 5 points or less, 6 or 7 points at a time is a little riskier, but still getting greats a majority of the time, 8-10 seems to shift the majority to "good".
3) The complexity of the item goes up with each experiment run. After a patch a few months back, the increased complexity after experimentation is used to determine factory manufacturing time. Each +1 to complexity increases the per-item time 8 seconds. So if you make an item with 2 experiments, and make the same item with 10 experiments, the second one will take almost a minute more for each item to pop out of the factory.
Personally, I usually do only two or three experiments. Since food doesn't really use any really expensive or loot-only components, retrying a schematic if I have bad luck on experiments isn't too big a deal.
KappaStang
Tue Jan 04, 2005 12:26 pm
#4
My first run I got at it one point at a time and I look how much adding one point will give me. Once I know that 3 points (like bivoli) will give me an extra use, I know what I'm shooting for now. This all depends on resources of course. Once I know what stats on the food Im aiming for, I do as Osrid mentioned and use 3 points at a time, hoping for an amazing on that one.
So I do a bit of a mix between sci and osrid, doing multiple schematics with the first few being only prototypes with varying reuslts in the filling, duration, buff, and uses, and the final few arehoping for the amazing successes.
Just remember, its ok to lose a few resources experimenting. Further, I don't experiment if I cannot get the full potential of a point. If Im expeimenting buff and I can get +20 buff ona great success, but my next experiment point will only get me +10 or +15 do to reaaching the maximum potential of the item, then spend the point in duration or something else.
Also if you use a BE tissue that increasesbuff and you want to test out the effect of points on duration, filling or uses, then you can always make an item w/o using the BE component. Of course this sometimes does nothing as what will end up happening is I'm left with 5 or 6 extra BE components that really does not help me much since we can only use the same components.
Alot of these things are just the way I do things, but I have picked up tons of ways of doing things because of other chefs on these boards, even when I was making fishak 
CaraAnam
Tue Jan 04, 2005 2:38 pm
#5
For it depends on what stat needs the most work in my mind....
IE for brandy i want the time to be at least 45m for i will xp the points there first...now when i start using new resources i dont know how many points i need to spend in each area...but once i do...i use the max points i can in each area (meaning if i know it's only going to take 3 point to get my wanted results i will spend 3 at a time if its more i spend more, i at times spend 8 points at a time)......It's the only way to get the so sought after ALL AMAZING SCHEM!!! but yanno whatever works i suppose
Higginsis
Wed Jan 05, 2005 1:40 am
#6
This is one method of experimenting.
A few people use this technique and i can't comment on their success, but it works for me.
A few people use this technique and i can't comment on their success, but it works for me.
Message Edited by Higginsis on 01-04-2005 08:44 PM
JoeDShadow
Wed Jan 05, 2005 11:47 am
#7
I may be a little more insane about my crafting then some, but this is how I do it:
First, I make sure I'm at max bonuses for crafting. These include
1) Master Chef
2) +15.00 Food/Chem Crafting Tool
3) +45 Droid crafting station (I've never seen a +45 standard crafting station, and all droids are automatically +45 Some discussion below on this)
4) Research center bonus (I do all of my crafting in a player city with the Research Center specialiazation)
5) +15 Pyollian Cake (Amazing Assemblies seem to increase your chance of getting Amazing Experimentations IMO)
6) +11 Bespin Port (I use this for every experiment attempt. Full? I wait and craft later)
7) +25/+25 Food Experimentation/Food Assembly Suit (+25 is the max total you can get from modded clothing)
8) Force Crafting 4,4,0,0 (The experimentation and assembly lines)
Second, every schematic I make has to be a Complete Amazing before I put it in my factories. The easiest way to accomplish this is to put as many points into 1 row at a time and then experiment. Then either finish that rowif necessary or do the same thing with the next row. If you get a great success, throw it away and start over. For example, if I put 6 points into a row and get an Amazing Success, that's an increase of 6 x 8% = 48% increase. It is much easier IMO to get 1 Amazing success on 6 points at once then to get 6 Amazing successes 1 at a time. (3 Amazing successes in a row is tough enough, I can't imagine trying for 12 Amazings in a row!)
It's also kinda a given that you want to have the best resources possible, but the better the resource, the better of getting an Amazing Success too. So, if you're not getting that many Amazings, it may because the resources you are using are of lower quality.
Also, everytime you hit the experiment button it adds to the complexity of the schematic, therefore increasing factory time. If you experiment 1 point at a time 10-12 times then you will be waiting on the factory much longer then if you just experimented 3-4 times with multiple points at once.
Hopefully this is helpful and though it can be hard to get all of these things (especially the Force crafting and the +25/+25 suit) they do help get those very needed Amazings.
Amya
Message Edited by JoeDShadow on 01-05-2005 01:45 PM
sciguyCO
Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:12 pm
#8
Nice post, Joe, but one correction:
JoeDShadow wrote:
3) +45 Droid crafting station (I've never seen a +45 standard crafting station, and all droids are automatically +45)
Unless I missed a later clarification, droids count as a +0 station, the same as the public stations. IIRC (sorry, I can't find the actual dev post) the comment was that droid crafting modules give "no benefit or detriment to crafting success". Their real benefit is that they are portable private stations that don't require owning a house.
While it's not a huge difference, you may see better results using a +40ish station rather than your droid.
Ikooga
Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:14 pm
#9
I agree with Sciguy, there was a Dev post once, stating that droids are +/- 0 and not +45.
JoeDShadow
Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:44 pm
#10
sciguyCO wrote:
Nice post, Joe, but one correction:
JoeDShadow wrote:
3) +45 Droid crafting station (I've never seen a +45 standard crafting station, and all droids are automatically +45)
Unless I missed a later clarification, droids count as a +0 station, the same as the public stations. IIRC (sorry, I can't find the actual dev post) the comment was that droid crafting modules give "no benefit or detriment to crafting success". Their real benefit is that they are portable private stations that don't require owning a house.
While it's not a huge difference, you may see better results using a +40ish station rather than your droid.
I've heard that before too, but it's not what I've experienced in-game. Since the first month or so from launch I've been using an R3 with a food/chem crafting station and consistantly have gotten better successes with it versus every other crafting station I've tried (and I've tried a lot.) I started out as a doc fromthe first weekafter launch till last March and have been a chef ever since, so I've done a lot of food/chem crafting.
I suppose it's possible that there may be such a thing as Pre-(ninja)Nerf droids that had a +45 rating and ones created now are +0. Maybe I'll go out and buy a new one and see if there is a difference between the two. I'll also do some more testing with my +43.63 Private Crafting Station too and see if it is working better now.
Amya
Message Edited by JoeDShadow on 01-05-2005 02:15 PM
MadLeprechaun
Wed Jan 05, 2005 6:28 pm
#11
ok, im 3000 in chef and have been playing around with my 2 experimentation points lately, but i ALWAYS get big failures and i accomplish the exact opposite of what i was trying to do (havla filling down). w t f am i doing wrong?
Ikooga
Wed Jan 05, 2005 9:45 pm
#12
Well you have about +20 Food Experimentation.
Thats the reason, the ammount of that not only determins how many points you have, but also the chances for great/Amazing successes or critical failures.
You will notice that critical failures become less and less (but still happen) once you get the cooking line.
Thats the reason, the ammount of that not only determins how many points you have, but also the chances for great/Amazing successes or critical failures.
You will notice that critical failures become less and less (but still happen) once you get the cooking line.
Wengel
Thu Jan 06, 2005 8:34 am
#13
Higginsis wrote:
This is one method of experimenting.
A few people use this technique and i can't comment on their success, but it works for me.
Message Edited by Higginsis on 01-04-2005 08:44 PM
i use the same way.... exept i rarely use bespin port... as i can't see any real difference.
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