Carbineer Archive
Thread: Clarification on Posture Change
The ability to bleed your targets action using Action Shot (1/2) is not effected by the 30 second immunity. The immunity or "timer" is based on your ability to change their posture. The only posure change skill that is worthless to Carbineers now, is Suppression Fire 2. It doesn't even belong in our profession, considering that Suppression Fire 1 is part of the Marksman 'Ranged Weapon Abilities' tree. Supression Fire 2 just plain needs to be removed, since Action Shot not only changes posture BUT bleeds a target's action pool as well.
I'm sure some of you are having problems with the profession, but instead of getting upset because of a nerf (note that it effects all professions with a posture change skill, not just Carbineer) - try to develope a better tactic than spamming PC shots. And in the cone of fire, if you miss one target with a posture change, but hit two others.. you can still use the move to pin that one you missed. There really isn't any 'dramatic' nerf here.
It is a Horribly "Dramatic" Nerf, one I have not yet managed to find a work - around for.
As to ActionShot 2, it is a Cone Effect Posture Change but Not a Cone Effect Bleed. If you take the time to tab through the MoBs within the cone you will notice that the Bleed is not applied to any other than the one, or ones, on the leading edge. Any targets that are in any way shielded by their companions (including lairs) do not recieve the Bleed. At this point it is no longer a Cone Effect posture Change either. My findings were 100% consistant --though at great odds with what you say here, In all cases where I used a KD the 30 second timer was on ME, not the MoB. I could only use a Knockdown shot ONCE during a 30 second period, not once per critter, just Once, period.
That held true with Posture Changes as well, that effectively eliminated the Cone Effect of Action Shot 2 for me. It gave neither an AoE Posture Change nor an AoE Bleed, but then again, it Never has given an AoE bleed...
As for what makes this a "Dramatic" Nerf... You said it yourself, this is something which affects virtually ALL Combat professions -- Not Commando since they have no KD or Posture Changes to begin with. Read the TKA forum and the Pikeman forums to see how they are dealing with this.
It is not something that can stand.
Personally I have not found a work - around because after devastating results yesterday; being killed by silly blues and whites, things which should pose no problem but because of the 1 - 2 -3 punch were devastating;
- MaskScent falls to creatures as low as gnorts -- at Master Scout level no less! Causing one to be attacked from out of the blue
- KD operates on a 30 second timer across the board. Able to only KD the First of the Spineflap Guards, Actionshot 2 does nothing at all to the others, Nothing
- Burst running away -- from a Horde of little creatures, is worthless as the MoBs continually Warp on top of the one fleeing, always in range they attack relentlessly, incapacitation follows.
After many hours of that yesterday, I just decided to go for Mixology II: Fruity Drinks today,on my Chef , and was lovin' life away from the fray.
This has to change. It is Devastating when you can no longer even hold your own against what were once not worth your time or trouble to take on. For those who have never used KDs or Posture Changes... well, it is not a big deal, but, those people are generally all Younglings moving their way up the Tree one Womp Rat at a time, odd how a Master Pistoleero is pretty much back in that same Boat now...
and you say, not so "Dramatic"
Ssonashe Tearer
Moving to Master Chef one loaf of Bread at a time
Every since I droped CH a month ago I haven't used a pet, ecept for Faction pets in PvP on the occation.
Been slaying Bocatts 2k xp each (white) with: /crippleshot, /actionshot2, /actionshot2, then use /warningshot, /legshot, /burstshot2, and /cripplshot as needed.
Sure I cant do 2 Mutant Biz Natches anymore spaming /actionshot2 and getting 6.5k for both of them... but oh well.
Please enlighten us to your tactics that do not require posture changes and do not include a pet to tank for you.
Oh and BTW...for those cone effects you describe...what happens when that group stands up 1 second after you posture down them?
why should i have to rely on a pet to not die? that's the main thing thats bull with this patch, imo. if they would have tied the timer to teh player only...that'd be a different story, but one that makes a lot more sense than a magical force-field immunity to kd/pc. if i can only do it every 30 seconds, i'll learn to live with it. if i can't kd/pc a mob because fred did 5 seconds ago...tha'ts straight up bull **edit**.
if you're going to nerf us to high-hell and back, PLEASE use some form of logical reasoning in it. i think the illogic is the most upsetting thing of all. course, i haven't played in over 24 hours..and i'm happier now than when i last logged off. and that saddens me, because i used to have tons of fun.
but i will not sit idle while they attempt to turn star wars into pet wars. if i fail, i'll leave...but while i'm paying, PLEASE stop making pets the ONLY viable way to kill anything db-con or harder. oh, or getting your stats buffed 2k+. i guess that works too.
Where do you see this nerf?
In the Populations. Sure, some people say, "Oh, Well" and go on. Haven't we all done that up to this point? We've found ways to get around the various nerfs and get back to our game. 2 Biz Natches? Personally I was taking on all the Ravenous Tortons that popped out of a stirred up Lair. And that was after the HAM increases and such.
Was it to much?
That's a philisophical question.
It was difficult, challenging, exciting, and it took awareness and Lots and Lots of Very, Very good Stimpacks (Stim pack Cs, 558 Power). I would used maybe 6-10 charges for a Medium length Battle. Spamming?
There is strategy. Nothing is Simply ALL /Actionshot 2. And that is what this latest Nerf is about, Strategy. At this point it looks like there is absolutely no way to get back to where I was before. If you read my previous posts you see that I defined myself by my Carbineeer abilities -- the Ability to handle Multiple Aggro. That Ability is beyond my grasp now.
And Carbineer cannot help me take on powerful Critters anymore either. For the first time in a long while, The BH Line is my greatest asset -- For Pure Damage. Prior to this my Being a Bounty Hunter meant that I had some very nice Skill Mods (I wear the Investigator Title, BH Carbine Spec IV), now LLC is the way to go for pure 1 on 1 damage. But 1 on 1 just isn't what I have come to love. I miss my Carbine.
Wood, first of all this topic was about Posture Changing skills and how the timer doesn't greatly hinder ones ability (IF they know what they're doing) to continue playing a soloist. Now I stated that some people may find this a difficult change, but I do not. While both sides are warranted to express their opinions, your general tone feels as if it were a personal attack. Whatever personal beef you have with me is beside the point I'm making here. If someone has a problem with Posture Changing skills giving a 30 second immunity to their target, once they have effectively changed the target's posture; it's entirely their fault.
Why is it their fault? Because they grew too used to having the game doing the work for them. That's the number one problem with games like these, the system does the work for you. It does the aiming for you, executes the skill mods for you, it even fires for you. People have become too relaxed with using Posture Changing skills to prevent an enemy from attacking (effects melee classes only) and then of course, spamming Knockdown to prevent their enemy from even moving or firing a ranged weapon. It sounds to me like the only people having a problem with this nerf are the people who spammed these shots.
Right now your post sounds like one big over exaggeration. Instead of complaining about it, everyone needs to find a way to get by without having to spam debilitating moves. And to 'enlighten' everyone here, this is what I typically do, and what I have been doing even before this nerf.
My tactics consist of using area shots, power shots and some pinning shots. I have three weapons with different ranges, but typically use my Elite Carbine which has an ideal range of 44m, and my DXR6 that has a range of 22m. It's highly important to stay within your ideal range if you want to receive a nice bonus to your accuracy. Here's a scenario..
I take a mission to destroy a Valarian Assassin encampment. I arrive and there are four Valarians there, the Assassin has well over 1k HAM, but thats not a problem for me since I can fire over 1100 with my Elite Carbine (101-174). I open up with Action Shot 2, hitting within the cone. My target is the Valarian with the higher HAM, and I keep this one targeted as best as possible. I'm at my ideal range (44m) and use Action Shot 2 until I pin them all, then I use Full Auto Area which can also blind or stun targets within the cone. Blinding decreases their accuracy and stun decreases their damage (or is that intimidate).
Now typically, I only have enough time to get one Full Auto Area out before they start moving, though I use a second one before they reach mid-range. Two targets are usually down by then, while my main target is still standing, bleeding. Now is when I focus on the closer targets, typically I'll switch to my DXR6 because of its better range. I'll usually use the aim skill, and Burst Shot 2 or sometimes Full Auto Single 2. Another tactic I use is Scatter Shot, which damages multiple pools at once, but normally I use this when the target has level HAM. Otherwise I'll stick with using Leg Shot 2 since their action is bleeding.
The overall strategy to this is to keep your ideal range ideal.. make use of the aim skill for an added bonus, and make area shots (Full Auto Area) your friend. Always pin and bleed the AI with the higher HAM, since they'll require more work. And never let something get mid-range to your position. That means switching targets before they reach 20m or so, if they're at that range they can hit you with melee attacks.
The difficulty rating of my missions are 14-16 and they usually pay around 2.4k - and never base your decision off of what color a con is, simply because the color of the con doesn't matter. It's based on what weapon you're wielding, and what skills you have.
**edit** all this does is that I shoot the mob, fail to change its posture EVER.... and then get incapped/killed and watch the mob walk around and eventually it bleeds to death. Great.
I don't know about you but i don't enjoy being agroed by six mobs. I don't like having to get a group to hunt anything worthwhile, and although i do do this, I dont' like relying on my pets to tank for me.
But honestly there is no sneaking, hiding, or manuvering in pve. You can attack from long range buy yourself three un-oposed hits, but on a 10k mob thats not good enough.
Any cl 15 or biger mob will down a pc in 15-20 sec, ten attacks on average, fewer if i use specials, even fewer with carbine specials (even with my dh17 snub 66 is the lowest ham hit i take, legshot2 and scattershot1).
The point is this, there needs to be crowd control and it should be for carbineers, i think suppresion fire should have been moved up to the carbineer tree, but oh well instead it now buys me three more unoposed hits, i'm up to 6, to thats 2k dmg hmmm, or 6k if i spam burstshot or fullauto, but i kill myself in the prosess.
heheh, yeah i'd call it a carbine nerf. like if they nerfed mind damage because people have low mind pools and don't wear helmets - sure, eyeshot would be affected and scatter shot would be affected, but it would be a rifle nerf. not as concerned with the loss of kd-spam, but the action shot...that was what made it possible to solo some red-conning guys.
posture change is like the meat in the whole carbine game. that's why got on board (well, stayed on board. i got on because when i first got into beta, i was running around with the pistol and some guy gave me a cdef carb and said those suck, try this)
nerf chef, they're too powerful and they're scaring me.