Carbineer Archive
Thread: BH Carbineer question (sprayshot vs crippleshot + confusion)
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FaceGarikLoran
Sat Sep 04, 2004 10:39 am
#1
Hey guys, once again with the bh boards being unhelpful again, i am pondering doing MBH / M Carbs, however i am mainly doing BH for carbines, and wondering if Sprayshot is really worth the extra skill points (investigation tree, pistols tree and LLC tree) as I will only be doing MBH for this 1 attack!
I know Master Brawler is worth its weight in gold for swordsmen with intimidate2 /warcry2 and lunge2, as ive been 1 myself, however I aint too sure if MBH is worth the extra 3 trees for this 1 attack! How good is it compared to cripple /confuse? Thx!
KaratonCha
Sat Sep 04, 2004 1:08 pm
#2
spray shot applies a number of states including dizzy blind and stun i think not sure but its a good shot because it does just under the damage of cripple shot but applies states a combo of spray shot suppersion fire fire KD and intimadate can be very helpful against jedi or NPC's
Lobel
Sat Sep 04, 2004 2:06 pm
#3
IMO, it isn't worth it. Full auto can also apply all those states, and although the damage isn't as high, you can use a combination of full auto and cripple or scatter. Perhaps spray has a higher chance to apply the states, I don't know, as I've never been MBH. My two cents.
Warmaker01
Sat Sep 04, 2004 2:58 pm
#4
I've got a MBH/M.Carbineer character, and Sprayshot lands states much more frequently and does good damage. It's a good leadoff attack that reliably sticks multiple states in one attack. With one or two of these attacks, I can follow up with a posture down/KD attack, or whatever fits the situation. So, with sticking states reliably and doing good damage, all in a single attack, I personally love this special 
But Sprayshot is a very, very expensive special to get... all the way at Master Bounty Hunter. It's really up to you if you want to do that grind up to it. The Investigation line is nothing to sneeze at (much props to the Invest.4/MBH's out there). Keep in mind though that Sprayshot isn't the only bonus to being a MBH. You get the most of what you can for the LLC, and good single target proficiency with Pistols. You get no defenses, but as a Carbineer/Commando player, I'm used to that.
"If they can be fooled, they can be killed."
Cauil
Sat Sep 04, 2004 5:42 pm
#5
Question for you, specifically anyone who is actually a MBH/Master Carbineer. What are your PvP tactics?
In just looking at the template and the stats you have it would seem to me that you are the absolute best at kiting any melee profession due to your dizzy state attacks (which prevents someone from burstrunning to catch up to you), high accuracy both by itself and while moving and the scout requirements for BH. Have you found this to be true?
In PvP do you use the DXR6 the most? Given the vulnerability to acid from PSGs this would seem to me to be a "second best" PvP damage type (after stun). You have such variety of specials, what shots do you use?
Finally, has anyone had luck with the tactic of getting and staying very close to a Rifleman? Just as you can kite well, if you wanted you should be able to stay right next to someone. Specifically a Rifleman who is not in his ideal state with an enemy right beside him or while he is moving. Yet you would seem to do just fine there, is this a valid tactic?
Thanks.
Warmaker01
Sat Sep 04, 2004 6:19 pm
#6
A Carbineer in close quarters with a Rifleman... you would think that it would benefit the Carbineer but it doesn't. Not in my experience (d'oh!). A plain vanilla Rifleman has an Accuracy+160 (+170 w/ Master Marksman)... they have more than enough accuracy to make up for the close/pt.blank range penalties.
As for preferred weapons, I start off with the Elite Carbine since I like the tighter damage spread. Some here prefer the Laser with the AP2 and higher possible max damage. If I'm not doing anything, then they've got a PSG so I switch to the trusty old DXR6.
Kiting effectiveness? Depends on my opponent's template. If I pick the battleground against a pure melee stacker, preferrably hilly terrain, then I hold the advantage as well as the initiative. In my experience, a bunch of pure melee stackers totally ignore Terrain Negotiation to gain great defenses. Against them, and keeping the battlefield in mind, I have the easiest time with, even if I miss frequently. Still, if that guy knows enough of the game, he will not fall for the chase into my terrain, on my terms. Against other ranged professions, it gets hard with Riflemen unless I land the first shots to dizzy/KD them. Pistoleers? Keep out of close range. Yes, they may still hit, but they don't have the Ranged KDs/Posture changes that we have. What I have the most problem with is against balanced Ranged/Melee templates... and God help me if their ranged prof. is Carbineer/BHxXxx. Since my defenses are so low as a MBH/M.Carbineer, I am very susceptible to state/posture/KD attacks. I can take foods to help out but it doesn't hide the total lack of defenses.
As for specials/attacks, check the FAQ... there's a section covering specials and it's very, very useful. I don't mean to be a lazzy a**, but check it out since it is quite comprehensive. In short, there is no one move or macro that you will spam all day to win the fight. You will find yourself using many of our shots to achieve your ends.
Some things to add to Carbineer's arsenal are the BH specials if you go that route. Fireknockdown is a good move and it lands a short-lived dizzy. Underhand Shot is a just a plain old KD move. These 2 shots, including Carbineer's 2 Charge Shots seem quite redundant but there are several important factors. Firstly, both Charge Shots will move you towards the target a couple steps... very bad if you're trying to kite a pissed off Melee'er. Underhand Shot and Fireknockdown don't. However, Charge Shot 2 is an area effect KD move! Quite useful in PvE and group PvP!
Bennyboy4308
Sat Sep 04, 2004 8:32 pm
#7
Sprayshot is nice if you dizzy/KD a doctor and they try to heal it. You can just spam sprayshot and keep the dizzy on while doing near-crippleshot damage. You could do the same with confusionshot but it doesn't do as much damage. Other than that MBH isn't more useful than 0400 BH to a carbineer as a pure carbines standpoint. However you do get eyeshot (for people with like 3k health, but 800 mind), torsoshot, LLC (very very nice in PvE), and the ablility to hunt jedi which is a form of content. What I like about being a BH/Carbineer/Pistoleer hybrid is the very wide variety of options. I have a high damage, triple state attack, area knockdowns, stun damage, mind damage, fire dots, electric damage with heavy weapon. But if you only use carbines and have no interest in jedi hunting than BH 0400 is better than MBH.
Warmaker01
Sun Sep 05, 2004 12:26 pm
#8
Good point I didn't mention, thanks... Yes, the pistol skills round your arsenal out and Eyeshot to focus entirely on Mind.
weaponmaster88
Sun Sep 05, 2004 6:23 pm
#9
i tried master BH/carbineer on TS2 when they had those nice frogs. i was quite dissapointed with sprayshot. i found it to stick states just as much as confusion shot and the dmg was crap compared to cripple. i then decided on my main to go BH 0 4 4 0 master carb pistoleer 0 0 4 0 novice medic. better defences, just as much carb skills nice healing powers and you can use geo pistol with eyeshot for some situations... i posted my stratagy on another post, but it involves using mind dot carbines then using cripple for a but until they heal and have low mind then whip out geo pistol and use eyeshot to finish their very low mind.
Agricola1
Sun Sep 05, 2004 7:43 pm
#10
I'm MBH/MC, anyone can beat anyone all you need is a couple of elite profs and some grey matter between your ears. I find spray shot to be an excellent shot as it usually lands at least one state when it hit's.
For weapons I have a krayt laser carbine, max damage 568 (with pup), I also have a krayt elite carbine for the tighter damage spread but it's only ap1 
. I do very well in pvp as most players aren't that profficient in pvp (despite the bragging).
. I do very well in pvp as most players aren't that profficient in pvp (despite the bragging).Study the specials mbh/mc has 2 ranged kds, 2 close range kds, 2 posture changes and all the state effects. Also crippling shot is great for finishing of an opponent that has been kd/dizzied.
Brainplay
Mon Sep 06, 2004 4:20 am
#11
The big difference between a BH 4/0/0/0 and a MBH is in your droid and tracking abilities. You will defintely see more improvement there. Instead of spending millions on droid speed tapes to equal the update time of an MBH you would instead have updates every 5 seconds. Run jedi run.... Surprised at one of the other posters lack of damage with sprayshot. I does some pretty decent damage and lays the states at the same time. I can't say which is better at laying the states though between FA2 and sprayshot.
If there is anything on that template you might want to give up it would probably be LLC. It does great damage....at 18m, is slow, and inaccurate. Great for taking out lairs but not much else.
And of course there's the small chance you might get some Mandolorian armor which needs MBH to wear 
c00kie
Mon Sep 06, 2004 8:45 am
#12
Well, I am BH/Carbineer... I don't think that spray shot is worth it if you don't want to use the rest of BH.
I was in a PvP tournie yesterday, fairly small guild one... but still, I got to test out my cabrine skills, and I am not master yet...
But what I found was a couple fullautosingle 2, followed by a posture down or kd attack then cripple worked wonders. I ripped through everyone I fought and went indefeated.
Weapon wise I used my nice kryat elite that was a gift froma guildmate that used to be carbineer/bh carbine specialist...
Its 179 min dmg base... and it rips people apart, even in full comp...
I
Talset11
Mon Sep 06, 2004 5:52 pm
#13
Ok i was a master carb bh 3/4/0/0 for quite awhile basicaly started out BH first but droped most of it in favor of master carbs. When BH had its reqs reduced i went ahead and mastered BH. For those saying full autos land stats the same as spray shot all i can say is your on something. One or two sprayshots and i have all 3 states on a target Not a chance with any of the full auto shots. Sprayshot has a higher damage multiplier then any of the full autos as well. Follow it up with a knockdown against anyone who can heal states keep pounding with sprayshot if they cant heal them then scatter 2 or cripple. One on one spray shot is bar none the best state shot out there.
Now if your going after a group of enemies then absoulutly fire off full auto area 2 followed up by a charge 2 or action 2. If most go down i usually switch to burst 2 if half or fewer go down keep pounding with full auto area 2 then fire off another knockdown or posture whichever i didnt use the first time. Reason i switch to burst is it has a higher damage multiplier ill kill off any of them that are dizzy and can clean up the one or two left using non area attacks.
Is it worth mastering BH for Spray shot? For me it was i get a huge range of damage types and im devestating with carbs pretty damn good with a pistol and the LLC is a great damage dealer in PVE.
Tal'set
Master carb/Master bh/pistol 0/03/0
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