Business And Economy Archive
Thread: Have prices really increased?
Imperial-Oli wrote:
You have all forgotten the whole idea of the economy being a player created and managed economy. The Devs have everything right at this exact moment in time. The in-game economy mirrors that of RL economy and therefore inflation is a must for the economy to work. And Loot mirrors that of RL innovations - if we look at games consoles such as Playstation 2 and x-box when they come outthey cost £300 but after what a year they sell for £100. Its the whole point that swg revolves around a player economy. It will always be the same when the devs bringout something new.
Bravo, you have it just right.
Inflation isn't rampant, it's that established players haven't responded fast enough to the Solo nerf. They are doing so now with the demand for their goods still high, yet players having less money -They are finding that more players are actually SHOPPING around for better prices for the same goods. As more of this occurs, prices will drop to a lower standard level.
Take Radiant for example - Armor that used to go for 500-700k is now 250-300k. Rare perfectly crafted or looted Weapons that would be sold for millions are down below the million mark. Ships that started at 7-10 cpu cost are hovering around the 3-5 cpu mark. Across the board, prices are going DOWN, not rising. About the ONLY exception would be for buff packs - And the fault for THAT isn't inflation - It's in the competitiveness of the Buff Crafters themselves - They want good Avian meat, and will pay big. Once they band together to stop the insanity of constantly out bidding each other and develop a market price, the prices will fall in line, Buff pack prices will decrease, and in turn Buff prices will come back down.
Most of the issues in pricing have come from the Buyers, not the Sellers. Many Docs and Chefs set the prices they will buy for, and Refusing to pay 100s of cpu for Avain meat or a resource will automatically drop their price in return.
Well put, couldnt have said it better myself 5 stars for you
Phaelyn wrote:
Imperial-Oli wrote:
You have all forgotten the whole idea of the economy being a player created and managed economy. The Devs have everything right at this exact moment in time. The in-game economy mirrors that of RL economy and therefore inflation is a must for the economy to work. And Loot mirrors that of RL innovations - if we look at games consoles such as Playstation 2 and x-box when they come outthey cost £300 but after what a year they sell for £100. Its the whole point that swg revolves around a player economy. It will always be the same when the devs bringout something new.
Bravo, you have it just right.
Inflation isn't rampant, it's that established players haven't responded fast enough to the Solo nerf. They are doing so now with the demand for their goods still high, yet players having less money -They are finding that more players are actually SHOPPING around for better prices for the same goods. As more of this occurs, prices will drop to a lower standard level.
Take Radiant for example - Armor that used to go for 500-700k is now 250-300k. Rare perfectly crafted or looted Weapons that would be sold for millions are down below the million mark. Ships that started at 7-10 cpu cost are hovering around the 3-5 cpu mark. Across the board, prices are going DOWN, not rising. About the ONLY exception would be for buff packs - And the fault for THAT isn't inflation - It's in the competitiveness of the Buff Crafters themselves - They want good Avian meat, and will pay big. Once they band together to stop the insanity of constantly out bidding each other and develop a market price, the prices will fall in line, Buff pack prices will decrease, and in turn Buff prices will come back down.
Most of the issues in pricing have come from the Buyers, not the Sellers. Many Docs and Chefs set the prices they will buy for, and Refusing to pay 100s of cpu for Avain meat or a resource will automatically drop their price in return.
HardwiredXMan wrote:
it's not that prices have or are going up on items....they basically fluctuate around the same range for the most part....the problem is that people's bank acounts are slowly but surely going down while prices continue to stay the same. This gives the impression that prices are high. Since we can't go out and make 100k credits in 2 missions anymore and it's now more like 20k credits in 2 missions....players bank account are starting to approach the zero mark.
So, although I agree with the math - I highly disagree with the sentiment. You base the premise that "We can''t make 100k in 2 missions". Why is this a detriment to bank books at all? Instead of running only a few missions, use an entire buff session.. I think you'll find that with diligent work, and actually selecting good missions (Speed vs payoff), you'll still be able to make 300 to 400k easily on the right planet with the right missions. I contend that the drop in money is NOT due to solo groups being nerfed, it's due to power grinders having it easy for too long. In fact, the Devs say that we were never meant to get the payoffs the way we did - We should have been receiving these smaller payoffs the entire time. Yes, I for instance can only make 300k in a buff when I used to make close to 1 million - But ALL my expenses are covered quite handily by that 300k, with a hefty profit on top. Base statement - People aren't getting poor because they can't make money - they are getting poor because they refuse to work harder than they used to.
Bottom line is that prices remain the same, cash intake is going down, the cost of grinding professions, FS or jedi is going up. it all gives the illusion of prices being high. It's gonna basically take a drop in prices at some point....but that won't even happen until at least 4 - 6 months after the CU because players who have 100 million credits will take a very very long time to get to such a low bank account number before they get concerned about approaching the poor status and when that happens, they will stop buying stuff for 5 million credits. I know one thing, I miss the days when I could go buy a suit of composite for less than 100k and when weapons didn't go from 20k to 500k just because they had krayt tissues in them that didn't make the weapon too much better than a normal one, but are priced that way because the crafter was stupid and payed way too much for the tissues.....AHH yeah, those were the days.....guess I'll never see them days again, like my childhood......Hmm, wouldn't it be nice to be able to go back to 18, 19, 20 years old again.....Oh err ahh...I got a little carried away......*****sigh*****And for ME, playing only @ 1 year, THESE are the good old days. Prices have come down drastically for needed items such as Armor and Weapons since I began playing. The "toys" or high end loots are just that - toys. They bear no real relation to the play of the game or the economy. But, as I have expounded on for quite a while - If the price is too high, don't nuy. Sellers will drop the prices until it meets the tolerable level. It's not the Sellers who dictate in our economy - it's the buyers. 1 Million for a NS lance? Ignore it until it comes down to 750k -do this a few times, and suddenly EVERYONE sells that item at 750k, rinse and repeat. That way, only people with heavy bank accounts will squander their money, and overpay just to get the item.
Phaelyn wrote:
HardwiredXMan wrote:
it's not that prices have or are going up on items....they basically fluctuate around the same range for the most part....the problem is that people's bank acounts are slowly but surely going down while prices continue to stay the same. This gives the impression that prices are high. Since we can't go out and make 100k credits in 2 missions anymore and it's now more like 20k credits in 2 missions....players bank account are starting to approach the zero mark.
So, although I agree with the math - I highly disagree with the sentiment. You base the premise that "We can''t make 100k in 2 missions". Why is this a detriment to bank books at all? Instead of running only a few missions, use an entire buff session.. I think you'll find that with diligent work, and actually selecting good missions (Speed vs payoff), you'll still be able to make 300 to 400k easily on the right planet with the right missions. I contend that the drop in money is NOT due to solo groups being nerfed, it's due to power grinders having it easy for too long. In fact, the Devs say that we were never meant to get the payoffs the way we did - We should have been receiving these smaller payoffs the entire time. Yes, I for instance can only make 300k in a buff when I used to make close to 1 million - But ALL my expenses are covered quite handily by that 300k, with a hefty profit on top. Base statement - People aren't getting poor because they can't make money - they are getting poor because they refuse to work harder than they used to.
Bottom line is that prices remain the same, cash intake is going down, the cost of grinding professions, FS or jedi is going up. it all gives the illusion of prices being high. It's gonna basically take a drop in prices at some point....but that won't even happen until at least 4 - 6 months after the CU because players who have 100 million credits will take a very very long time to get to such a low bank account number before they get concerned about approaching the poor status and when that happens, they will stop buying stuff for 5 million credits. I know one thing, I miss the days when I could go buy a suit of composite for less than 100k and when weapons didn't go from 20k to 500k just because they had krayt tissues in them that didn't make the weapon too much better than a normal one, but are priced that way because the crafter was stupid and payed way too much for the tissues.....AHH yeah, those were the days.....guess I'll never see them days again, like my childhood......Hmm, wouldn't it be nice to be able to go back to 18, 19, 20 years old again.....Oh err ahh...I got a little carried away......*****sigh*****And for ME, playing only @ 1 year, THESE are the good old days. Prices have come down drastically for needed items such as Armor and Weapons since I began playing. The "toys" or high end loots are just that - toys. They bear no real relation to the play of the game or the economy. But, as I have expounded on for quite a while - If the price is too high, don't nuy. Sellers will drop the prices until it meets the tolerable level. It's not the Sellers who dictate in our economy - it's the buyers. 1 Million for a NS lance? Ignore it until it comes down to 750k -do this a few times, and suddenly EVERYONE sells that item at 750k, rinse and repeat. That way, only people with heavy bank accounts will squander their money, and overpay just to get the item.
Man, you think THESE are the good ole days......inaugust and september of 2003, prices were a mere fraction of what they are now....I remember my first set of full composite cost less than 100k....If I remember correctly it was more like less than 70k....I do remember paying 5k each for the bracers and biceps....I got a chest plate for 20k and can't remember the rest.....the resist on it were around 69% or something and I still have the chest plate to this day....it has zero condition....It's a collectors item to remind me of the real GOOD OLE DAYS...hehe. I actually kept most of my first time stuff.....back from the days when it took 30 minutes to walk from one city to another, when you had to /burstrun from thugs or creatures that we now think of as pest and don't even get off our swoop to waste time killing when they arggo us.....the days when it took a group of 15 or more before people would want to hunt voritors on dant because "nooooo, they poison" hahaha. The days that if you had 800k, you were rich. The days when you were too broke to travel round trip to endor. THe days when noone used doc buffs or even knew what they were.....these are the days I speak of.......yes yes, those were the days where people paid their dues....now days, everyting is handed to them.....ships, swoops, cheap harvesters, houses, cities, godly armor and buffs, legendary weapons, jedi, millions of credits...everything...noone works for anything anymore.
HardwiredXMan wrote:
Although, I see your point and I agree becuase I see that you can still make millions if you put your mind to it....but the fact of the matter is the majority of the players just are lazy and want something for nothing......its like a child who was spoiled by their parents or raised on breast milk, when they become an adult more often than not they expect mom or dad to be there when things get rough.....they call it "momma's boy" or "daddy'd girl". this is the effect that easy janta missions had on many players.....janta missions were the breast milk of SWG combat characters.....now the devs took away the feeding and the babies want to cry prices are too high.....and they will continue to cry until they either figure out they have to work to make things better for "themselves" or starve to death.
It's actually funny to me in away the difference in views of characters whose careers started a few months apart. My goold ole days are here, yours were in the past (a mere few months before I started). yet the thing is, it seem that the both of us understand teh fundamental truth - Yes, to make money, you have to put effort into it. Whether it's as a fighter or crafter, to be teh best and/or make a ton f creds from fighting, you must be good at what you do.
But you hit on teh Key in your post - Players, many of them want something for nothing. Thing is, even though this is a game, amny real world fundamentals are built in - Interdependance on items, economy, etc. I hear stories ALL the time about players who got the game, and 3 weeks later had all they needed - And I find that outright sad. Why? because they didn't play the game - they were handed a silver spoon called Solo groups. (In point of fact, through Ebay, I've seen DAY ONE players have "legendary" items) - They didn't even know HOW some of the game mechanics worked, yet they were going after high level game MOBs or jumping right into high end PvP - getting OWNED mind you, but doing it anyway. And lo and behold, what does one of the day one millionaires say after he was DBed and came running back? Let me quote, as I saved a screen shot "Not fair! You cheated! I have the BEST Armor, the BEST weapon, and SYNTHSTEAK!" Meanwhile, what was he using as an attack? Answer NOTHING! he was using a T-21 as a novice marksman, and couldn't use it, obviously. But he THOUGHT he could.. because he didn't know the game. Someone told him these were the best things for him, and he'd be Uber. Even funnier - He was wasted by a TK novice with no armor, buffs or weapon, because he told the kid he'd beat him with none of it.
This illustrates to me that we shouldn't hand things to players. Let them learn the game, earning as they go. So they get the feel of combat, understand the limitations of "uber" weapons, get the feel of what their stat modifiers really mean. And in turn, this means that high priced items out of his range aren't BAD because they are highly priced - It makes the person do what was intended in the game.. learn.
But that has nothing to do with the total discussion, does it? For ME prices are lower than when I began, for you they have Spiked and are slowly dwindling - Which means no matter how much we discuss, our opinions can never meld -Because we've played 2 very different games.