Bounty Hunter Archive

Message Edited by Glzmo on 06-09-2005 02:11 PM

All sounds great apart from 1) I think moving them to invest 4 wouldn't be a bad idea, but let people dabble if they want to.

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Auhal wrote:
All sounds great apart from 1) I think moving them to invest 4 wouldn't be a bad idea, but let people dabble if they want to.

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Interesting point. I thought it would be nice to have player bounties as high-end content for Master Bounty Hunters to make mastering the profession worth to achieve. I would like to hear a few more views of the community to see what everybody would prefer and why, so feel free to share what you think on this and the rest of the points in the main post.

Message Edited by Glzmo on 11-14-2004 03:45 AM

1. Devs have said they have no plans to institute this as they encourage the dabbling of BHs. Clearly shown to be the case by the reduction in skill points. Will the CB/CR/CU change this, who in the heck knows?


2. I may be missing something, but vis is now working as intended since they let the "cat out of the bag" in regards to what trips vis. I know that vis currently kills your vision of the FRS by stifling Master/Padawan bonding, but as of this moment, it appears to be working. As far as Smugglers are concerned, that sounds exactly like the system Green marine thought up, so I am not touching that one.


3. As Bounty Hunters go, they are all entirely freelance and all after the same thing, a lathe book you spoke of. You can have every BH in the galaxy going after the same mark. Still only one bounty, but many hunters.


4. Chaos, good for the mark, bad for the system. First come, first served I say. I am not going to shoot someone for getting there first. I still lose the bounty, what's the point? The TEF system is already screwy as it is, I say let's not clutter it up with more problems. I like the RP aspect of it as every BH in the galaxy was after Solo and tried to stop Fett from bringing his carbonite encased body back to Jabba. The only problem with this is that there are so many player bounties, this is more than likely an issue that will never raise it's head. Hell, I have only run into a BH once after a mark. He just loaded in after I finished the job.


5. I would gladly address this IF Bounty Hunters stood a chance against a Jedi solo. As it stands now, if you are Master Saber, the odds are severely against me killing you. Add some defender in there, I have no chance. Sure, you can use bomb droids and what have you, but I follow the Sun Tzu addage of fighting battles I know I can win. I usually go alone, but against higher priced FRS Jedi, alone=dead.


6. I can agree with point 6. Say a timer of 24 hours.


7. In the past, I have had a TEF for a half an hour after aborting a mission and seeing the Mark in question finally logon. Needsafixin'.


8. I counter with saying after a certain amount of Bounty Hunters killed, we either have the "Bounty Gods" at SOE up the ante to bring along more BHs or call out the Digiteers (read Fett or Vader) to deal with said mark. If you have visibility and are not hiding, you should be killed. It was careless of you, you should pay the price. Before the "Dark Siders" jump on the "Vader wouldn't hunt me, I am Imperial" I have this to say. Vader was responsible for wiping out all of the Jedi. ALL, not some. You are just as dead by his hands.


9. I believe this is working as intended. You may know better here.

As far as 10, 11, and 12 go, I like this idea, however, it may be beyond the system we have in place. Not sure how complex that would be to design and code and magically make hapen. (Or whatever it is game developers do).

All in all Giz, well thought out, but many areas favor more one side than the other, in my opinion. Good job with the FRS, so so here.

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Glzmo wrote:

The following is a vision of a new player bounty system that could make player bounties and being a bounty hunter and the hunted more enjoyable, competitive and true to the trade.

I recently re-read one of the Star Wars: Bounty Hunter Wars books andwas subsequently thinking about how to improve the Bounty Hunter experience by tweaking and changing the current player bounty system and what would have to change for me to want to enjoy playing a Bounty Hunter of the Star Wars Universe.

There doesn't seem to be much of true competition amongst Bounty Hunters really and many rather team up instead of being rivals for the reward.

Therefore I decided to post this thread, which I am planning to update as soon asIcomeup withnewideas. Feel free to discuss it, perhaps you can come up with good, constructiveideasthat I can add and expand upon in this post. You never know, perhaps the devs will even listen to it and implement it. I call this idea

The Bounty Hunter Wars

1. Only Master Bounty Hunters can pick up player bounty missions.

2. Change of the visibility system:

a.) Jedi visibility

- A Jedi gains visibility by using the force and/or his lightsaber in front of imperial NPCs and NPCs of the opposing faction

- Once a Jedi is seenusing the forceand/or his lightsaber byanother player, visibility doesn't rise automatically. Instead, the player will have the option to use a 'Report Jedi' function in the radial menu or be able to use a function like /crimereport.Each player can do this for the same Jedi once per day. Only if a player chooses to do this visibility of the Jedi rises. This prevents people who do not want to report Jedi from doing so and allows people who like to report them to do so in certainity and with some interactivity.

- A Jedi automatically doesn't gain visibility from group members, guild members, people that havethe Jedi ontheir friendlist,bounty hunters with a mission on them and other Jedi. They will not get the option in the radial menu.

- When a Jedi is reported by another player, he should get a quick system message 'You sense you have been betrayed...'

- When the Jedi's visibility level raises to a set level, a bounty is offered for his head.

- Jedi visibility should decay at aslow but steadyrate

b.) Smuggler visibility (will hopefully be implemented with the smuggler revamp)

- If a smuggler fails an NPC smuggling mission (by either being caught or even selling the cargo), he can choose to pay off his employer or persuade him to not take actions by using the fast talker skill (Jabba, for example). Ifthe smugglerdoesn't do this, his visibility rises. The lower the skill of the smuggler, the higher the chance that his persuasion fails and he gains visibility

- In case a smuggler fails a smuggling mission of contraband for another player (again by being caught by authorities or deliberately failing by keeping, droppingor selling the cargo), this player will have the option to report the smuggler, which will raise the smuggler's visibility. Again, the smuggler can then barter with the player not to report him, pay him off or whatever they agree upon.

- When aSmuggler is reported by another player, he should get a quick system message 'Your gut feeling tells you your employer might be angry at you...'

- When the Smuggler's visibility level raises to a set level, a bounty is offered for his head.

- Smuggler visibility should decay at a slow but steadyrate

3. Each player mark can have only onebounty on his or her head at a time. The number of Bounty Hunters that can pick up the same mission is limited. It as well as the (hopefully substantial)monetary reward for it are dependant on the skill of the mark (3-15 Bounty Hunters can pickup a mission on the same mark at a time, the higher the level of the mark, the more Bounty Hunters can pick up a mission onhim at the same time).

4. Bounty Hunters with a mission on the same player mark receive a TEF for each other as they are rivals for one and the same bounty.

5.Bounty Hunters with the same mission are prohibited from grouping with each other. If only one of them has the mission on the same mark, they can group, but when they both have the same mission, they get a message 'cannot group with a rival'. Once a bounty hunter is grouped with a bounty hunter that already has a mission, he cannot pick up the same mission as his groupmate or is automatically kicked out of the group when accepting this mission.

6. Once a bounty Hunter is killed by his mark or a Bounty Hunter rival with the same mission mark, the missionfails for this particular bounty hunter. He cannot pickup another mission for the same mark and is out of the race (until a new mission for the same mark is issued). Also all TEFs related to this mission are cleared upon death.

7. Once a Bounty Hunter aborts his mission, all his mission related TEFs are cleared and he fails the mission.

8.Whenall bounty hunters with the mission on a mark are killed, visibility is reset to 0 for the mark, all mission related TEFs are clearedand he is off the terminals until the visibility level rises back to the level that triggers another mission.

9. If the mark is killed, his visibility is also reset to 0, allhis mission relatedTEFs are cleared and he is off the bounty hunter mission terminal.

10. Once a Bounty Hunter kills his mark, hegets a 'proof of successful bounty mission' (containing data such as target name, value and such)in his inventory,with a DNA sample of the mark (perhaps even a finger, scalp or something else).

To finally collect the bounty, this certificate has to be brought to the NPC that issued the bounty, like Jabba for a smuggler who failed an assignment for him or Emperor Palpatine himself for a high level Jedi. For each mission, you can bring the certificate to several different locations, so your rivals will not know exactly where you are headed beforehand.

11.As soon asone Bounty Hunter killshis mark, all other Bounty Hunters that still had the same mission(they weren't killed by the mark or a rivaling bounty hunter and didn't drop the mission) do not fail it. Instead, the tracking droids now track the Bounty Hunter thathas the 'proof of successful bounty mission' for their deceased mark. Once another Bounty Hunter kills the one with this 'proof of successful bounty mission', the mission fails for the killed hunter and the 'successful bounty certificate' is transferred to the inventory of his assassin. The bounty hunter with the newly'aquired' 'proof of successful bounty mission' now has to reach the mission giver NPC to collect his bounty.

12. The'proof of successful bounty mission' can also be traded and sold to other characters, including non-bounty hunters.Once the proof has been traded, themission of the bounty hunter that gave away the proof fails, and he looses all TEFs to and from the other Bounty Hunters with the same mission.

Oncea characteraquiresthe 'proof of successful bounty mission' by trade, the mission to bring it to the mission giver NPC will also transfer to them as well as the TEF for all Bounty Hunters that are still in the race for this particular mark. Also, the tracking droids of the latter will now track the holder of this 'proof of successful bounty mission'.

Message Edited by Glzmo on 11-14-2004 04:00 AM

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I respectfully dissagree with many of these ideas.

1. I think its ok for Dabblers to be able to hunt PC's, Jedi's, or whatever. Maybe make it IV but surely not master.

2a. This is crazy who is going to report a Jedi? oh yeah I guess thats the point. Jedi NEVER want to become visible. Why don't you come up with a cloak of Jedi invisibility to fight visibility.

3. Depending on the numbers is very vunerable to explotation by Jedi and I am SURE you can figure out what I mean by that. Also if you are a Smuggler/Jedi you should be able to have 2 different Bounties at the same time. Also if you ARE Jedi/Smuggler and a BH kills you then you NEED to have Jedi Penalty dunno if that was stated for the completeion of the mark otherwise there is a VERY NICE exploit that is possible for Jedi.

4. Bounty Hunters don't fight Bounty Hunters it's a long standing rule honor amoung thieves kinda thing. Read bout Boba and Bossk(my mind just died and I think I spelled his name wrong grrr...)even though they were hated rivals and went after the same mark they didn't use that as an opportunity to dust the other off.

5. Then Jedi don't get to aid in defense of the Jedi being attacked, otherwise one group is as bad as another group.

6. I think perserverence should be rewarded.

8. Exactly the opposite... if the Jedi defeats all Bounty Hunters then the Bounty on the Jedi should INCREASE seeing as that is what would happen. Jabba didn't care if a BH died while on mission he just got another BH and offered him more money.

The biggest problem with moving the Jedi/player hunting to Master Bounty Hunter is that the Master Bounty Hunter has no chance if that's the must have template and that the lest over points are not enough to complete the current template to make it more competitive. Then I agree that Invest IV would be a better alternative, currently Invest III might be too easy.

I dislike the idea of Jedi visibility being interactive. The Jedi should simply be careful with visibility, it should not be a reason for extra protection from those that happen to side with Jedi. If you're seen, then that's that.

I like the smuggler ideas.

As for a TEF on fellow bounty hunters, I don't really like that idea. I think it should just be a matter of who's first and that's it. I personaly don't like the idea to hunt a fellow bounty hunter.

Not grouping due to same mark is a horrible idea. At some point it's in fact the only way to take on certain bounties. I really dislike this idea. Again, I became a bounty hunter to hunt bounties, not to start a clash with fellow bounty hunters.

Soon we get caught up on so much rivalry and hunting after proof that in the end all we hunt are fellow bounty hunters. No the rest of the ideas are not something that would improve the player bounty system for me.

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ExanRale wrote:

There are some original ideas here but I think it would protect the Jedi a bit too much, here are my thoughts on your thoughts :

1.You probably mean Jedi BH missions here, I think that could be fair but then they also have to make the LLC better cause you would lose to much skill points going Master BH and we all know a Master BH without extra Fighting Professions sucks at this time

The combat revamp/rebalance should accomodate this. But yes, perhaps a skill based system on how difficult amark you could take would be good...I will think about that.

2. a) I think this would protect the Jedi a bit too much, so there will probably only be one or two Jedi on the BH Terminals a day. If you are a Bounty Hunter then you know doing a Jedi mission is for a lot of Bounty Hunters THE reason to become a BH in the first place.

That is a problem. They should be doing it for the money and because it is their job, maybe for the thrill of the hunt even, not because they want to kill Jedi.

And who would want to become a BH if you have almost no chance of doing Jedi Missions. It would make it more realistic but it would completely ruin the Bounty Hunter profession

Not if smugglers will have bounties on their heads. Smuggler bounties should be the norm, Jedi bounties should be a special achievement to complete with a comparably huge reward.

b) Well I do agree here that Jedi shouldnt be the only player targets on a BH terminal, some smugglers who have failed or Overt Opposite faction players could be a possibility here.

Smugglers have wanted to be hunted for a long time, as this is how it is in the Star Wars Universe and should be in this game.

3. I think this sounds fair, however there should be the possibility that a couple of Bounty Hunters are chasing against the time just to be the first to kill his target.

Of course.

4. I dont think there should be too much rivalry between the Bounty Hunters,

Why not? In the Bounty Hunter Wars books it is that way, also if you have ever seen that bounty hunter series called renegade, there have always been competing bounty hunters in there.

and it wouldnt be fair cause the best Bounty Hunter of the server will just kill his rivals every single time which might cause groups of other Bounty Hunters working together just to kill this one strong rival Bounty Hunter (which could cause a hunt for Bounty Hunters instead of Jedis)

Well, you want all the rewards without risk, huh? But this would be the very essence of Star Wars Bounty hunting, kill your rival and collect the bounty all for yourself instead of having to deal with the actual mark, wouldn't it? Also, Bounty Hunters force others into PVP, soI guess they like PVP if they are doing player bounties, so there should be no harm in duking it out for the reward and getting ambushed, especially since they don't really loose much, but have much to gain.

5. I think there should be the possibility to work together with other Bounty Hunters to take a mark down, this could be limited though. But I think most of the true Bounty Hunters prefer to work alone these days, cause the money is still important.

And it should be.

6. It sounds fair that you cannot take the same mission for a while, maybe a timer of2 or3 hours could help this?

It's only fair if you cannot take the same mission that you failed on the same target over and over and over again.

7. Sounds normal

8. This would make it hard for the Bounty Hunters and even easier for the Jedis

It will give marks a chance to fight for their freedom and get a sense of victory. Do you prefer they stay on the terminals eternally and get hunted over and over and over again until they let themselves be killed? With the slow decay of visibility right now (3 weeks of inactivity, which is far too much) this is a very real problem. Besides, killing all the Bounty Hunters after the mark may very wellbe quite hard, unless you are tricky and let them be so dumb to kill each other before one of them gets you.

9. Sounds logical

10. This could make the Bounty Hunter missions very long and even harder, I think the reward could be a bit higher in this case.

Of course it would. It would make the missions a challenge. And since Bounty Hunter missions will be the best paid thing to do when the group mission reward fix hits, it should be long and hard. Also, with a lower level mark, you won't have so many rivals and a weaker mark to deal with, but be paid less as well (Still a very good payoff).
All in all, I believeplayer Bounties as well as player smuggling missions later on would be the best paid in the game, as they would involve much risk in form of PVP threats.

11. Like said before, this would start a war between Bounty Hunters instead of between Jedis and Bounty Hunters. I dont think Bounty Hunters should be killing each other all the time, this would be way to easy for a 'hard profession' like the Jedi

See, you have to consider that not all Bounty Hunters that have a mission on the Jedi will probably be online at the same time, which will make it easier than you think most of the time. And a little risk is nice and fun as well.

12. Very original but I think Bounty Hunters wouldnt use this option much cause who wants to kill a target and lose the price money (unless its of course sold by a high price like you suggested).

Well, if you know another Bounty Hunter that is very strong or has a strong group with him is after you and you just barely escaped, you could just sell it off for less money and live with it, while the buyer would then be subject to the attack by your pursuer! I think this sounds like much fun, and would be a nice challenge. Of course, who would be so dumb to paint a bullseye on his chest...for all the credits...perhaps.

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BarneyIX wrote:

11. Bounty Hunters DONT attack other Bounty Hunters this is a LAME idea I have NO IDEA why you thought that this would be good.

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DroidCapt wrote:

Few things. As part of being a Bounty Hunter you should have to memorize the Bounty Hunters Creed. Yes there is a Creed.

Part of it states that you can't kill another Bounty Hunter if 1) They aren't obstructing or trying to take your mark, or 2) If they have already taken the mark or killed it. Meaning they couldn't be assasinated for the proof.

Jedi shouldn't be left to just Master Bounty Hunters, but ony Master BH's should be able to tackle full Jedi. The smuggler thing is a GREAT idea though. I mean that's part of the movies, with Han being hunted and stuff.

Another thing about the Creed though says that a Bounty Hunter should never take sides. (Meaning Factions) Too many things defy part of what the SWU is about. Especially with Bounty Hunters. The creed should be a very real part of the game. You should be quized by the trainer after a certain point in you BH career, preventing people from dabbling in anything but the Investigation branch. We don't want people dabbling in the LLC branch because if they do, and they're not true Bounty Hunters, then they just do it for the weapons advantage, which only the Bounty Hunter should be able to use. Also the idea where only a certain amount of BH's can take a mark is slightly faulty. Yes only a certain amount should be able to take a mark, but it should be based on what kind of profession(s) they have how long they've avoided being caught and how much the base bounty was worth and it shouldn't have a limit. Limits just mean that you just take the Bounties you think will get huge and then hope noone else takes it. Another good idea is Bounty Hunters on the same mark can't group. One thing is that for non-Jedi, there should be a limit to who can take the Bounty. You shouldn't have a 1 day old Bounty Hunter taking a 1 million credit bounty and just getting in everyones way.

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Where can I find info on the complete creed for bounty hunters? This is the first time I read about it *blush*

Also, I have no problem with dabblers whatsoever. It just makes clear how much the MBH as a class on its own is lacking, much work needs to be done so that it wouldn't be necessary to pick what's best to actually survive.

Then again, it's the player's responsibility alone on how he devides the skillpoints. A novice bounty hunter is still a bounty hunter. *shrug*

Message Edited by BarneyIX on 11-14-2004 06:50 AM