Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Experimentation Changes, Alternatives
Arcid wrote:
Two ideas. Firstly, I think that some of the Master level items (And all the higher level items) could take an increase in resources (On a profession by profession basis, things like DE and Architect Are closer to balance than Weaponsmith for example)
The other thing that I've always thought would be good to see would be "Generic Schematics" for the crafting professions. I've only thought this idea out for Weaponsmiths and armoursmiths, but I'm sure it could be applied to other crafting professions.
Essentally a generic schematic could be just like a normal schematic for an object, except with no material limitations beyond "Solid" and no quantity limitations. The thing then would be allowing masters to experiment with different material types/quantities to attempt to get the best possible build. It would require an extremely complex equation behind it to cover the possible material combinations and to ensure that it didn't become a matter of who has the highest quality resources (Imagine a schematic where having a material if too high a conductivity would be a disadvantage)
Whew, it took me several reads of that last paragraph before I understood it, but when I did I saw the endless possibilities in variation..which would truly bring diversity to crafting I think.
There is one problem that I see with it though. In RL business you would keep your 'secret mix' secret, but in this economy I could imagine the Uber Formula to be posted on websites everywhere..and by that I mean there will (I suppose) be an ideal set of stats for any particular item (weapon, armour at least) which is ideal because it fits best with other game mechanics.
I do like the idea though, there is already too much of the same items being produced because nobody wants to produce anything other than that 'Uber formula' that best fits the game.
.EnigmaBSc
If the DEV's truely want to fix the game's economies, then they'd have to install NPC vendors to sell all the goods at the price the DEV's think is fair. Would it be a straight CPU charge or a floating CPU charge to consider the items stats? Such a move like this would nerf the WS, AS, Tailor, and Chefs considerably. It could help the DE's though. I DON"T want to see NPC Vendors, but, if a NPC vendor had Items for sale using materials with 500 stats (using the mid-point stat of limited range stats too) it should change alot of ppl's pricings. Also, if the NPC vendors bought items at 1.0-1.5 CPU straight line buy price, it would help all those "poor" hologrinders (like I may become if DE dies from lame combat droids)
The devs still need to go through other professions like Weaponsmith, and make the other lines more appealing for diversity (paying EPs for HAM experimentation is a waste ATM etc.)
I'm not sure, in our case, if charges can ever really be made the more appealing choice in Doc crafting... or even a 50/50 spit between charges and power.
The economy question is key to us though.
Doc prices vs. material prices vs. mission payouts is important.
Long term doctor viability in game is pretty threatened by docs putting themselves out of groups by selling incredible stim b's to everyone with novice medic.
Docs are not seen as valuable group members, but as static buff and rez dispensers.
Healing generates little or no revenue, but eats (expensive) materials at a huge rate.
-T
The proposed crafting changes had a good motive, but the method was half baked, it does nothing to redress the balance between established crafters and new ones, quite the reverse in fact.
What we need is more choice from the crafters, as it is, for armour all there really is is 80% kinetic. 65% electricity with 60% on everything else but stun, why not change it so that if you use steel with a high heat resistance you get more heat resistant armour ? So you can tailor armour to the user or the use, want to go after Jedi ? No problem, get some high electrical resistant armour (by using metal with *low* conductivity), create more variety and you'll have more options and more crafters, there won't be a "best".
How this applies to our crafting I'm not entirely sure, we make very one dimensional products, the best buff is one with the most power, no-one cares about duration by and large, a 4k buff for half an hour is generally more useful than a 2k buff for 2 hours because we'll just end up buffing 4 times as often.
It would be good to be able to experiment duration separately from power, and if stims worked more as a regenerative heal than a straight one, you could design them for power and duration as well, but that opens a whole new can of worms.
- Make the bazaar terminal able to browse all player owned merchants. Would help to level the economy pretty fast and will prevent empty merchant issue.
- Create the uber week insurance system : you pay 50-100k a week to insure any item and prevent decay at all on it. Part of thoses funds should go to the crafteras "maintenance fees". Will reward the best crafters and let players keep their beloved items char life long...
- Improve Amazing Succes effect
- Remove lost of all subcomponents in a critical Failure, maybe onlydestroyone ortwo subcomponents
- Let major critical failure hurt / disease / poison the crafter and lower the Exp points and assembly %, could be funny tocraft
Resources Usage :
Storage / database issues :
- You can use as many extension as you have free slots.
Excellent initiative! But before we begin, we should explain/argue what the current situation is and what the problems are (if there are any). Specifically, I would like to know what it is that people find so troublesome about the current economy in the game. Personally I am not convinced that there is a big problem with the economy.
However, I do see that there is a big problem with the way most crafting classes are designed. For instance, there is too big a difference between Masters and non-Masters. (The proposed changes by the devs would actually have increased this gap.) I would like to see some changes that make it possible to craft useful weapons even as a novice weaponsmith. One way to do this is to make it so that masters and novices have the same amount of experimentation points available.
- Travel Costs
- Property Maintence (house, harvester, factory, vendors, etc...)
- City Maintence (City Hall, gardens, banks terminals)
- Vehicle Repairs
- Bazaar Fees (20cr or 100cr it adds up)
Traigus prety much summed it up. The way items are made now there is only 1 thing worth experimenting on per item for the most part. Take a gun for example. Experimenting on hams will lower the cost by 1 point per experimentation point spent. This is useless wen you can get 30+ damage per point. Duribility is alright but if rather buy 2 guns that hit hard than one that lasts a long time. Same for armor and harvisters and most other things. There is one good stat to experiment on and then there is a second stat that you put what ever is left in. That second stat is just fluff and dosent realy add to much value or use to the items.
If you could experiment a weapon down 50% in hams for example then maby people would start making them a bit diffrent. But untill the system gives us a reson to experiment in diffrent areas than nobody will and all the items will be the same give or take a couple numbers here and there. Medics and doc's dont have it so bad because for the most part uses and power are both good depending on what your going for...The crafting nerf they wanted to do wouldent change this at all. It would just remove the fluff points. What needs to be done is a compleat re-evaluation of all the experimentation areas and to make investing points in them usefull for what they are.