Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: DNA Confusion
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Rhysen
Mon Nov 01, 2004 5:00 pm
#1
I'm soooooo confused 
On Sat, I finally met the prereqs for BE. I'd read the FAQ and found it informative, yet hard to grasp when it came down to creature stats. So I figured I'd sample as much DNA as I could and make creatures to help shed some light before I waste good DNA on a bad clone. The results have been...inexplicable. Somehow using Greater Desert Womp Rat DNA, I ended up with a CL12 Kaadu with 3k-4kish HAM and Heat/Blast resists. Plus 2 special attacks. Turning around and using some Rogue Fambaasa (sic?) DNA I got lucky on and some Maverick Kaadu DNA, I ended up with a CL 6 Kaadu with half the stats and no specials.
I'm trying to understand what DNA characteristics affect what final stats before experimentation (cause hey, I only get 1 experimentation point atm). That way I can learn what characteristics to look out for in DNA samples and place them in the correct component slots to get the base type creature I want. But I seem to be missing something. Can anyone help clear things up?
Zadokk
Mon Nov 01, 2004 5:13 pm
#2
I've been out of the game for a while so this information will probably be corrected either by SHAFT!, Evil Arthur or GMANSUHFKSHJFKEFSDFESFE:
Stats / resists : 40%/25%/5%/5%/25% respectively
Specials x/x/special 1/x/special 2
Specials x/x/special 1/x/special 2
Specials are dependant on the quality of the DNA when compared to the others AFAIK. so if you use low quality dna in the mental and aggression slots then you will have a hard time getting them to stick.
Rhysen
Mon Nov 01, 2004 5:32 pm
#3
Zadokk wrote:
I've been out of the game for a while so this information will probably be corrected either by SHAFT!, Evil Arthur or GMANSUHFKSHJFKEFSDFESFE:
Stats / resists : 40%/25%/5%/5%/25% respectively
Specials x/x/special 1/x/special 2
Specials are dependant on the quality of the DNA when compared to the others AFAIK. so if you use low quality dna in the mental and aggression slots then you will have a hard time getting them to stick.
I meant along the lines of how the different characteristics of the DNA affect the final stats. Like the Fambaasa DNA had a 400+ Hardiness characteristic and the rest of the contributing DNA I though was near 200 in the same stats. Yet the resulting creature turned out weaker than one I made using Greater/Varieated Desert Womp Rat DNA. Maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention. Same way some results have yeilded pets with extremely low Mind and others turn out more balanced. Yet I'm not experimenting on the DNA and generally using DNA from similiar creatures (DNA collected doing missions/exploring to clear inventory space).
furrycat
Mon Nov 01, 2004 8:49 pm
#4
Formulae for predicting the initial values for each attribute are in the FAQ. Each pair of stats (hardiness/fortitude etc) has a separate formula. Upon combining your samples you will end up with values for each stat that are quite a bit lower than any of the corresponding sample values. You then experiment to boost the stats. Again the formula to predict the maximum experimented can be found in the FAQ.
Thing is you need to juggle all five formulae, while remembering that the same physique formula determines resists. Then there's the whole effective/special resists thing....
Read and re-read. You'll get the hang of it and you will have many delighted customers when you use your hard-earned knowledge to fulfil their requirements.
Thing is you need to juggle all five formulae, while remembering that the same physique formula determines resists. Then there's the whole effective/special resists thing....
Read and re-read. You'll get the hang of it and you will have many delighted customers when you use your hard-earned knowledge to fulfil their requirements.
PlainWhiteSocks
Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:58 am
#5
/* From our beloved FAQ */
HAM
Each of the HAM attributes (Health/Action/Mind) is affected by the inputted DNA samples. However the only way to affect Health positively in experimentation is to experiment on physique. The only way to effect Action positively is to experiment on prowess. The only way to affect Mind positively is to experiment on mental.
The same correlation applies to non-experimented templates.
HAM
Each of the HAM attributes (Health/Action/Mind) is affected by the inputted DNA samples. However the only way to affect Health positively in experimentation is to experiment on physique. The only way to effect Action positively is to experiment on prowess. The only way to affect Mind positively is to experiment on mental.
The same correlation applies to non-experimented templates.
Rhysen
Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:25 am
#6
I don't think I'm explaining myself clearly.Experimentation is meaningless to me at the moment. I have 0010 in Bio-Engineer and 1 whole experimentaion point to fail with (45% chance of failure with my skills). So experimenting at this point just skews the results unnecessarily and isn't worth the results.
Right now I have a Generic DNA Template with the following stats:
Quality: Low
Hardiness: 240
Fortitude: 54
Dexterity: 222
Endurance: 317
Intellect: 153
Cleverness: 66
Dependability: 900
Courage: 315
Fierceness: 129
Power: 89
Armor Rating: none
Kinetic Resistance: 22
Energy Resistance: 17
Blast Resistance: 5
Heat Resistance: Vulnerable
Cold Resistance: 38
Electricity Resistance: Vulnerable
Acid Resistance: 3
Stun Resistance: Vulnerable
Special Attack 1: Knockdown
Special Attack 2: Stunning Strike
Ranged Attack: No
I can semi-figure out how the characteristics ended up on the template from the information in the FAQ (the resists and specials are still murky). ButI'm past combining the DNA and moving towards making a creature from it. What I'm trying to figure out is how will these characteristicsdetermine thecreature's stats.
GMANHNC
Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:06 am
#7
Rhysen wrote:
Right now I have a Generic DNA Template with the following stats:
Quality: Low - Makes specials sticking Hard
Hardiness: 240 } H
Fortitude: 54 } H
Dexterity: 222 } A
Endurance: 317 } A
Intellect: 153} M
Cleverness: 66 } M
Dependability: 900 } I believe helps with pet likely hood of running but is un proven
Courage: 315 } Same
Fierceness: 129} Agressiveness
Power: 89 } Damadge Don't bother with this for awhile
Armor Rating: none } Fortitude must break 500 to do
Kinetic Resistance: 22 } based primaliy on slot 1,2 &5 (this is the biggy resist)
Energy Resistance: 17 } Same
Blast Resistance: 5 } Same
Heat Resistance: Vulnerable } Same
Cold Resistance: 38 } Who cares usless stat (same)
Electricity Resistance: Vulnerable } BH's Beware (same)
Acid Resistance: 3 } Same
Stun Resistance: Vulnerable }Same
Special Attack 1: Knockdown } slot 5 is big but can be overcome
Special Attack 2: Stunning Strike } same
Ranged Attack: No } try to avoid.
Ham is bassed on those figures, the averages were mentioned earlier by Dr. Haddock, but an easy way is just to use your higher Ham's in slot 1,2, & 5. Your HAM unless doing something special for some crazy guy who thinks you can make a "PVP" pet... should look like this:
HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
MMMMMM
This will give you more bang for your buck.
Also keep in mind uses for pets.
ones like you are making now can only be used as newbie tanks or non-ch mounts so keep in mind your likely market.
Why should ham look like above.... When a pet is fighting other PVE type creatures mind damadge is fairly rare, most damadge is take to the "H" then "A" then a distand Mind... i would venture a guess at like 50%-H, 30% - A, and then 20% mind for the most part some NCP's may very, but I HAVE NEVER lost a pet in PVE for mind damadge. Even if it is really off and you make a:
HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
MMMMM
CH's can do mind heals by speach so it will never go down by mind from a decent CH. Plus Pet stims heal mind too.
Zadokk
Tue Nov 02, 2004 11:43 am
#8
I think I realise what you mean. Are you worrying because the combined stats are lower than the donors? That is because only when it is fully experimented will the stats reflect the donors. For instance, if you were to put 5 x Greater Desert Womp Rat into a template and then make it without experimentation, it will be significantly lower than the wild copy because the stats need experimentation. This is essential for generational sampling. If pets constantly got stronger with every generation then a lot of low CL pets would be impossible to make and after 2 or 3 generations we would end up with CL 80 pets.
Rhysen
Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:49 pm
#9
Zadokk wrote:
I think I realise what you mean. Are you worrying because the combined stats are lower than the donors? That is because only when it is fully experimented will the stats reflect the donors. For instance, if you were to put 5 x Greater Desert Womp Rat into a template and then make it without experimentation, it will be significantly lower than the wild copy because the stats need experimentation. This is essential for generational sampling. If pets constantly got stronger with every generation then a lot of low CL pets would be impossible to make and after 2 or 3 generations we would end up with CL 80 pets.
Nah, I'm not really worried about the combined stats. I'm worried about being able to control the final outcome of the pet. Using the template given on a pet gave me these results:
Bearded Jax
Difficulty Level: 15
Health: 4304
Action: 3819
Mind: 3047
...
Attack Speed: 2.18
To Hit: .24
Damage: 80 - 90
Special Attack 1: Knockdown
Special Attack 2: Stunning Strike.
Okay, the CL is too high for a non-CH. And actually, too high for a low level Novice CH. I'm also Novice CH (0000) but have a CL 12 Kaadu I made myself that would be a good starter pet for a newbie in the profession (and marketable on the Bazaar for advertising). This particular pet is going to be a statue for a while.
I'm tryingtofullly understandhow the characteristicsaffect thefinal outcome, especially before experimentation and DNA samples withlargerstats really confuse things. Which is why I'm not grinding out the crafting XP and am making pets from the material I get. Slower, but more informative (plus I get 300 CH XP per pet made through training the basic 3 commands :smileytongue
GMANHNC
Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:22 am
#10
Well in that case good luck... Pet crafting is non-liniar and dna quality plays a role in the final outcome. you have to just paly mix and match make spread sheets and see what you really like.
In other words... "No one can be told what the Matrix is... you have to see it for yourself."
Message Edited by GMANHNC on 11-02-2004 03:24 PM
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