Bio Engineer Archive

First of all lets take the math in here, we know that if you take 5 samples from the same animal and combine them in a template then you end up with a perfect copy. That means that one way or another all 5 slots will inevitably total 100% of the final stat. Looking at Talth's example it clear that each slot is weighted so we're not looking at a straight forwards 20% split per slot. Without more details it's impossible at this point to figure out exactly what kind of percentages we're looking at for the slots. It almost looks like a 25%, 25%, 12.5%, 12.5%, 25% arrangement except for a number of inconsistancies. On the whole though its bound to total as 100% in the end.

Since the stats are somewhat averaged in some means (there's clearly more than just an average happening there if you look though in some cases) it must mean the resistances are tallied into a point form and then added together.That is why when you take 5 samples with kinetic of 40% resistance then the final combine is also 40%, although you do gain what looks like a +10% bonus to certain resistances on the final clone assembly as we saw resistances of 7% occouring from what was originally 0%/. So for the sake of math we'll say a bio-engineer can add +10% to the stats through experimentation. This key to my theord of breeding in and out certain traits.

Lets simply things first and say that all DNA has only two resistances TypeA and TypeB. We'll take a load of samples from the same wild species to end up with loads of dna that says 30% to both types. We'll stick these into several clones which are identical and after the final assembly they'll be 40%resistance to TypeA and TypeB damage. We'll call these clones Prototype1.

Now you get tricky, lets say that TypeAdamage is something you want to enhance but to keep the CL rating low you need to make TypeB weaker in the process. Via normal cloning methods this is of courseimpossible to raise one while the other is lowered in the process. So what you do is take 4 samples from Prototype1 but have a 5th sample from a wild animal that is 40% forTypeA damage and 30% for TypeB.You'd then stick the 5th sample into one of the slots which borrows 25% from the dna resistances.Refer to the notes of how the slots are weighted if I lose you here. Also remember that I'm conversting the resistances into points.TypeA resistance will be on the left, TypeB will be on the right of the slash. Seperate dna samples will be seperated by a hyphen, the 5th sample will be in red.

40/30 - 40/40 - 40/40 - 40/40 - 40/40 (before being weighed)

10/7.5 - 10/10 - 5/5 - 5/5 - 10/10 (after being weighted)

Then you tally the resistances up. The TypeA resistance is obviously uneffected since you had 40% resistance to that damage type in all of the samples. The TypeB however is now dropped to 37.5% after simply merging some Prototype1 samples with a 5th wild sample. Now you simply repeat this a few more times to end up with what you could call Prototype2 clones. (please note that I didn't take the +10% bonus from cloninginto consideration here so that it's easier foryou to follow. Inrealise the real stats would be 50%/47.5%)You then repeat this process again, taking 4 samples from the prototype of the last generation with a single wild sample that has a lower resistance for the stat you want to breed out but a higher or equal resistance for a type you want to keep.

This method of 'selective breeding' mean that you can keep the stats you do like while dropping the ones you don't leading to lower CL ratings because as one stat is rising another is being lowered. Now obviously this does get more and more costly as you get through more generations. Assuming that each clone gives you3 dna samples then you'll needthree clones at the first generation to make two for the second generation of clones, then you'd end up only having enough dna from the second generation to make a third generation clone. Thus the further you want to take the generations the more clones you need initially to ensure the dna supply for each generation is enough for the next one to be made. Ideally though since you gain around +10% for each generation of clones you need a significant difference between the resistances to ensure you overpower that +10 bonus.

Lets put this into a real situation with kinetic and energy resistances. For the first generation.

• Arachne Queen - Kinetic 50%, Energy 35%


• Bloodseeker Mite Guardian - Kinetic 60%, Energy 40%

60/40 - 50/35 - 50/35 - 50/35 - 50/35 (before being weighted)

15/10 - 12.5/8.75 - 6.25/4.375 - 6.25/4.375 - 12.5/8.75 (after being weighted)

52.5% kinetic, 36% energy (before clone bonus)

62.5% kinetic, 46% energy (after bonus)

And now for the second generation...

• Frenzied Graul - Kinetic 75%, Energy 35%


• Prototype 1 - Kinetic62.5%, Energy46%

75/35 - 62.5/46 - 62.5/46 - 62.5/46 - 62.5/46 (before being weighted)

18.75/8.75 - 15.625/11.5 - 7.8125/5.75 - 7.8125/5.75 - 15.625/11.5 (after being weighted)

65.624% kinetic, 43.25% energy (before clone bonus)

75.624% kinetic, 53.25% energy (after bonus)

Now thats just examples from the highest end, you'd see much faster results from merging high end and low end dna. Once you have the resistances ideal what you'd do then is sample from animals which have no resistances in order to boost the HAM up to something you want. Technically you can make a clone for just that purposes by blending a load of Yavin4 species together since there's a fair few which dont have any resistances.

That stalkers still going, 1 starred again within 20 seconds.

Thank whoever that was, whoever that stalker is needs to learn that there's alot of mature people in the community who appreciate a decent post and will make your efforts worthless.

Yeah, I just finished reading this post and wondered to myself, why in the world would someone 1-star it? I think it's a great post and you got a 5-star from me Tal!

Yeah it's just some loser who has a fetish with me who does this every time they see me make a post. Been going on for around 2 weeks now

Don't worry, I'm sure they'll finish up the last box of DNA any day now, so they should be dropping the profession and moving on soon.

I'm fairly sure it's a CH really, i seem to remember it starting when I gave a fair few of them a kicking about how a large amount of the CH population are kiddies who joined the profession cause it was overpowered in places. Rather than dispute that a few resorted to proving my point perfectly.

Tal,

Ithought someone said that "breeeding in/out" wasn't an option because the DNA we're getting from the newly made clones is cruddy. Is the system you're talking about do-able with the current system or something you WANT us to be able to do.

If you're looking for support for the Breeding in/out system you have my very enthusiatic support!

Tobywan

Master BE, Bloodfin

What this leads me to think about is selling packs of critters to Master CH's. One is vulnerable to everything but kinetic. One has high resistance to most commando weapons, but vulnerable to kinetic. One has high dmg and low resists.

When a critter is "vulnerable" to an attack, I don't remember seeing a %. Is there a specific numeric value to "vulnerable"?

There is actually 1 more step to this...

The experimentation on the generic DNA template.

I only have 1 EXP point on TC, so I couldn't swing anything a lot.

it is possible that experimenting on a slot could raise the resist values there (I cannot confirm it)... It odes indeed raise HAM some (even w/ my 1 pt).

There is also some invisible factor that lowers the effective CL of the mob (without lowering abilities)... can't tell if it is Sample Quality based, Skills based (+ creature crafting), experimental based.. or all 3 combined.

Both of these can throw off your math (after the fact).

There is some impact above the base formula... but you seem to be right on the money for how it works before then.

-T
(sheesh 1 star bandits need more work to do at work)

I've also yet to get more resist on a clone than was on the donors. In a few cases I got a little less resist. FG was a good example, 75% kinetic on the FG, 60% on the clone. There may be some capping in abilities going on there, the highest kinetic I can recall seeing on any tamable creature under the new systemis 60%.

I think you are overly optimistic. I suspect that, to get a 10% bonus, you're going to need veryhigh quality DNA. If you start with two creatures and get six samples, I doubt that five of those samples will be high quality. Each generation of clones is going to be worse than the previous, I suspect, unless you start with dozens of high quality wild DNA samples, and, for each generation, only use those samples from clones that are high quality. Of course, I could be wrong. We will see soon, hopefully.

Ideally They should have made it so that the cloneing system would take the following:

A) The DNA That is sampled from a creature should be a Vaild DNA Template to insert into a Clone in addition to a Generic DNA template.

B) Generic DNA templates should accept other Generic DNA Templates as a vaild ingredient into other DNA Generic DNA templates.

C) if (B) is not a option then We should have 6 DNA templates that should be placed from novice to master through the Experimentation line. Of which all 6 should be valid for insertion into a Clones dna slot and should only accept the prior level as a ingredient.

Although im sure something like this has already been suggested, im still posting it even though this will never happen. Maybe some one was planning to allow generic dna data to be nested since it comes out with a Quality rateing.