Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Discussion: Sampling while the creature is in battle
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Zadokk
Wed Mar 09, 2005 5:54 pm
#1
I'm curious to the BE communities stand point on not being able to sample a creature while it is in battle mode. I'm not necessary talking about when it is attacking us, I personally feel that if WE are in battle then we shouldn't be able to sample. However, I was thinking about whether or not it would be possible to sample a creature while it was in battle.
I think it would be beneficial, not only to the BE profession but also to the CH profession if we were able to sample animals while they were in battle. However, to keep balance and to prevent abuse I think that we should suffer a reduced chance of a successful sample rate if the creature is agroed.
My thinking is this: The BE masks scent and whips out his favourite tank pet. He sets his pet to guard duty and the Bio-Engineer slowly approaches the animal and begins sampling. The sampling fails and the mob agroes. However, the pet intervenes and takes the agro. The BE peaces and is left to watch his pet wreck/be wrecked by this mob. Seems like a bit of a waste to me. The mob isn't moving anywhere fast and is pretty much locked in battle with the pet. So I feel that the BE should be able to attempt to sample the mob without either the pet or the mob having to die. The realism is, since the mob is actively jumping about and attacking the pet, there is obviously a low chance of being able to get a sample - but I feel that the chance should be there. I mean if we can sample and even MILK an animal that is walking away from us, why can't we do sample an animal that is standing still - only it is moving on the spot? It would seem conceivable to us that we (in real life) could insert a needle into an animal that was flinching or not standing completely still - only we would risk breaking the needle or pissing it off even more.
To prevent abuse from this, there should be:
a) reduced sample success (this would prevent people from getting high level mob samples easily, such as Mutant Rancors who are ridiculously difficult to approach);
b) a chance that the mob stops attacking the pet and turns to the BE;
c) perhaps grant it as an ability in the Master Bio-Engineer box.
What do people think?
I think it would be beneficial, not only to the BE profession but also to the CH profession if we were able to sample animals while they were in battle. However, to keep balance and to prevent abuse I think that we should suffer a reduced chance of a successful sample rate if the creature is agroed.
My thinking is this: The BE masks scent and whips out his favourite tank pet. He sets his pet to guard duty and the Bio-Engineer slowly approaches the animal and begins sampling. The sampling fails and the mob agroes. However, the pet intervenes and takes the agro. The BE peaces and is left to watch his pet wreck/be wrecked by this mob. Seems like a bit of a waste to me. The mob isn't moving anywhere fast and is pretty much locked in battle with the pet. So I feel that the BE should be able to attempt to sample the mob without either the pet or the mob having to die. The realism is, since the mob is actively jumping about and attacking the pet, there is obviously a low chance of being able to get a sample - but I feel that the chance should be there. I mean if we can sample and even MILK an animal that is walking away from us, why can't we do sample an animal that is standing still - only it is moving on the spot? It would seem conceivable to us that we (in real life) could insert a needle into an animal that was flinching or not standing completely still - only we would risk breaking the needle or pissing it off even more.
To prevent abuse from this, there should be:
a) reduced sample success (this would prevent people from getting high level mob samples easily, such as Mutant Rancors who are ridiculously difficult to approach);
b) a chance that the mob stops attacking the pet and turns to the BE;
c) perhaps grant it as an ability in the Master Bio-Engineer box.
What do people think?
lammergeier
Wed Mar 09, 2005 11:25 pm
#2
do I WANT it? yeah.
do I think there's a fair way to implement it? no.
I'm a little concerned about success/failure on sampling anyway, since a novice to DNA 2 BioE can 'stealth kill' their way across most planets, while a master can 'stealth aggro' their way back to the cloner.
also of note in the sampling code: creatures killed by sampling do NOT respawn... they are removed from the game until a reset. while this is seldom an issue of contention, the spiderclan cave is currently pitting BioE against jedi... never a good thing.
sorry to have spread the original topic thin, but any discussion of DNA sampling seems somewhat incomplete without the ancillary concerns (like harvest/loot from sample kills).
dang, I spread it a little thinner. apologies.
do I think there's a fair way to implement it? no.
I'm a little concerned about success/failure on sampling anyway, since a novice to DNA 2 BioE can 'stealth kill' their way across most planets, while a master can 'stealth aggro' their way back to the cloner.
also of note in the sampling code: creatures killed by sampling do NOT respawn... they are removed from the game until a reset. while this is seldom an issue of contention, the spiderclan cave is currently pitting BioE against jedi... never a good thing.
sorry to have spread the original topic thin, but any discussion of DNA sampling seems somewhat incomplete without the ancillary concerns (like harvest/loot from sample kills).
dang, I spread it a little thinner. apologies.
Zadokk
Thu Mar 10, 2005 3:00 am
#3
lammergeier wrote:
do I WANT it? yeah.
do I think there's a fair way to implement it? no.
I'm a little concerned about success/failure on sampling anyway, since a novice to DNA 2 BioE can 'stealth kill' their way across most planets, while a master can 'stealth aggro' their way back to the cloner.
also of note in the sampling code: creatures killed by sampling do NOT respawn... they are removed from the game until a reset. while this is seldom an issue of contention, the spiderclan cave is currently pitting BioE against jedi... never a good thing.
sorry to have spread the original topic thin, but any discussion of DNA sampling seems somewhat incomplete without the ancillary concerns (like harvest/loot from sample kills).
dang, I spread it a little thinner. apologies.
Well it's only a discussion - it was kinda based on the premise that if things were perfect would we.... blah blah. I personally think it would increase the desirability of the Creature Handler profession, which is pretty crappy atm.
Inkanissen
Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:13 am
#4
No, I don't want it. Can you imagine trying to hold that needle still for 10 seconds while this big Rancor is jumping around shredding something it is fighting?
I like it as it is, it makes you think when you want to sample something.
I like it as it is, it makes you think when you want to sample something.
LloydPickering
Thu Mar 10, 2005 6:31 am
#5
When I first thought about it, I was thinking that it was a great idea, and one I had thought about myself previously...but looking at it in a more serious way, I think it could be used for griefing...Just look at the BE vs JKs...I know there would be a decreased success rate, but tbh our success rate is rather crap atm. I would say increase the success rate in general, and only allow us to sample creatures that aggro us. This would stop griefing and could help out some BEs trying to sample what they can't kill...after all the standing joke is that we have AirMiles cards for the Cloner.
Zadokk
Thu Mar 10, 2005 9:16 am
#6
LloydPickering wrote:
When I first thought about it, I was thinking that it was a great idea, and one I had thought about myself previously...but looking at it in a more serious way, I think it could be used for griefing...Just look at the BE vs JKs...I know there would be a decreased success rate, but tbh our success rate is rather crap atm. I would say increase the success rate in general, and only allow us to sample creatures that aggro us. This would stop griefing and could help out some BEs trying to sample what they can't kill...after all the standing joke is that we have AirMiles cards for the Cloner.
You raise an interesting point of it being used as a griefing tool and I hadn't thought about that. I suppose one of the key ideas of disallowing our use to sample an agroed creature is that. But lets say, for the sake of argument, that there was a way around of this being used as a griefing tool - would you think that it would be a worthwhile idea?
lammergeier
Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:05 am
#7
Zadokk wrote:
LloydPickering wrote:
When I first thought about it, I was thinking that it was a great idea, and one I had thought about myself previously...but looking at it in a more serious way, I think it could be used for griefing...Just look at the BE vs JKs...I know there would be a decreased success rate, but tbh our success rate is rather crap atm. I would say increase the success rate in general, and only allow us to sample creatures that aggro us. This would stop griefing and could help out some BEs trying to sample what they can't kill...after all the standing joke is that we have AirMiles cards for the Cloner.
You raise an interesting point of it being used as a griefing tool and I hadn't thought about that. I suppose one of the key ideas of disallowing our use to sample an agroed creature is that. But lets say, for the sake of argument, that there was a way around of this being used as a griefing tool - would you think that it would be a worthwhile idea?
part of the existing code with sampling makes creatures 'non-attackable' while we've got a needle in 'em. that would have to be changed to allow sampling during combat... and I think that might be a can of worms we don't want opened.
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