Bio Engineer Archive

I keep reading how the new cloning system is going to come into effect and there is still one thing that I can not shake as a major concern. Exactly how much power are we going to be given even if the new creature cloning system goes live. The creature revamp that is going to take place at the same time may alleviate some of these concerns, but I'm skeptical. I'm not sure how willing the devs are to throw a major nerf the direction of the CH class. Lets look at some things.

A real easy example is going to be HAM. Look at the HAM of some of the available creatures that are out there now...rancors, blurggs (maybe gurrecks, I always get them mixed up)...etc. I mean we are looking at an average of 10.5KHAM pets. Even if we take these pets up to about 12.5K HAM we are still only effecting the HAM by a small amount (15%ish). Look at the other extreme instead of high HAM, lets look at low HAM. On a 6500HAM pet, we are only going to be able to raise the HAM to 7500, and a 4500 HAM pet we can take it to about 5300.Even a 30% gain (and thats really not that large) on HAM on a rancor would give the rancor about 15k HAM and I'm pretty sure we arent going to be able to do this.

Lets take a look at resistances. There are already pets out there with massive resists. Lets go back to the rancor. Its got what 3 100% resists, 1 75% (which I believe is a 100% in practice), and the rest except for stun at 30 (sorry, at work atm and dont have the info)? I mean thats pretty impressive right there. How much higher could we reasonably expect to raise these? Say we can take all of those 30% resists and raise them all 20 points (I guessed 6 off the top of my head) for a total of 120 points (anyone think this is going to happen) of added resists. That is STILL less than a 20% increase in overall resists towards the pet.

Again, lets look at damage. An average rancor (are gnarled rancors better, sorry not a CH) usually hit in the range of about 550. An average BE rancor hits in the range of 650. Again, we are looking at less than a 20% upgrade than found in the wild. I'd try a dps comparison but I dont have the numbers handy, but I'd venture a guess we're still in the 15-20% range.

And it doesnt really stop there, they want to add level 60 babies into the game and reintroduce medium armor. These are the wild babies we are talking about. How much further do you think they are going to let us alter a creature of comparible value. I mean a 13K Ham pet out in the wild (I think a CL 60 could hit this) with a 15% gain would be an over 15k HAM pet. I mean does any of this seems a bit unbalancing to you guys.

Listen, I hate being the pessimist here, but I think this is a real problem. The last thing that the CH class needs right now is a power boost. I could see the entire community real in turmoil if this happened. Even so, I'm not sure where the cushion for us to improve upon what can be found in the wild is going to come from. Like I said, perhaps they are going to lower the CL of all the creatures in the game (yeah right, change the entire game to avoid a CH nerf), or somehow alter the maximum stats of creatures that are tamed (anyone see this happening?) and everything will work out fine. But the reality is that more than likely we are going to be regulated to pretty much an image designer for pets.

Tal, I hate to ask anything of you, but I beg you to bring this up in the correspondent forums now before it hits TC. Get an approximate idea (and I know its rough considering the mant variables involved) of how much better we are supposed to be able to make a pet. I mean everyone take a pause and really think about this for a few moments, how gamebreaking could our class be with what we create with the system that we think is going to go live soon?

Something (either CH or BE) is going to need to give on this issue, and I hope and prey that it gets ironed out before anything gets released.

Tilen
Scylla

I dont know for sure... But right now to use a Rancor you have to be close to master CH.... But I think for the level 60 creatures you will have to be a master to use them... Alot of people, myself included when I was a bounty hunter, wanted a creature to use a meat shield so that I didnt die all the time.... So I got something like 1,1,0,0 so I could use a decent creature... but when I got my holocron I decided to go Master Bio-engineer/Master Creature Handler so that I could train the creatures I was making and make a decent profit off of it.... But who knows... I am just excited that we should be able to color our creatures... lol...

Rancor got resists lowered, no idea on HAM atm but have no reason whatsoever to think it would have increased - most likely lowered as well.

As I posted to another thread, new maulers are CL36, ar0, 35% kinetic resist. While some people think this is a good thing for the only reason that they don't like seeing people with grauls, it is important to note that those stats are close to what we will be getting as BE as well - BE ones may be slightly better but they will use the same basic formula to calculate CL as wild creatures.

Hmm, so you've tested the new cloning system and have determined that we cannot add armor and whatnot? If you've not done so, then you ought to before attempting to compare what we can do now to the current creatures. If we can truly control what we can make, it's quite possible we could make an old mauler equivalent (except the CL would likely be higher). Either way, the stated goal of the CH nerf was to reduce the number of people who dabbled and got the most powerful tank in the game. It sounds to me like they've got a mission accomplished

very well spoken. i gave you 3 stars because you wrote that out very well and vouced your concerns very clearly, but i totally disagree with you.

Master CH do not need a nerf, they are greatly underpowered compared to any other master class (MCH vs MTKA - MTKA wins... even going through the pets first!). these CH nerfs are to reduce the power of dabblers who only get a few key boxes and i totally welcome it. i love the CH profession very much, almost as much as i love BE, and have since beta, but all the players it attracted really disgusted me. i chose to wait a few weeks after beta to let some of the major bugs be ironed out quickly (thinking that the devs would be quicker about it when people's money was at stake, DOH! i was wrong) and when i created my account and logged in, the first thing i saw was: rancor, rancor rancor, graul, rancor, graul, GSP, graul GSP, rancor....that just sucked and had to be fixed, but dont confuse the large problems that have been going on with the creature lvlcert systems confuse you, theMCH is not uber. the MCH is finally getting some power with this patch that he desperately needs. the cert system change that was much needed, and the ability to command special attacks and ranged attacks are great. i am excited from a CH standpoint because i get to use my creatures specials like i should, and i am excited from a BE standpoint because i get to make creatures to cater to peoples needs infinitely better than i ever could before. once the dabblers get used to the new system BE clones will be in great demand, and now that the creature lvls granted are much more appropriate for the skillpoint cost, making stronger pets at each CL is not imbalanced at all.

thats my opinion.

Creature Handlers have thier idea on this, Bioengineers have thier opinion on this, and it looks like (with reports from TC) that SOE has trumped everyone.

Best case, in my opinion, is wild creatures have gotten the kick in the dangly bits but BE's with thier new cloning system will be able to fill the gap and create some awsome fighting creatures across the level and ability range finally.

Worst case is that BEs finally get the fully functional and involved clone crafting system that they've always deserved, but the creatures themselves (as determined within the game system) have been so drastically lowered in power that the once legion of creature handlers are driven like chaff before the wind.

Creature handlers and bioengineers are supposed to be very closely and cooperatively linked in my opinion, and although it might finally happen - it might also mean that we're going to both get kicked hard at the same time.

Well, after a brief examination of the CH forum it appears that a lot of creatures got way nerfed... They could be over-hyping it (they are CHs ) but if their creatures got watered down significantly then you needn't worry about 15k rancors.