Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: BE pet level and size is not associated with wild pet level and size.
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AlthorianMatriarch
Wed Aug 31, 2005 4:41 am
#1
I must say I have to agree with you. My favorite example is the bearded jax, at one time more of a bearded rat, ( though still cute ) now at CL 70, to the tops of their ears they're as tall asme. Which I have to admit is pretty funny.But it's notthe massive creatures thatbother me (and everyone else for that matter) , its the minimumsize, thatsfar too small. Even if we did pin-point the level at which animals reach their wild size, and figure up the scalethat they grow, it wouldn't help the biggest problem, pet sizing and mounts. Not to mention many non-CH critters areso small you can barely see them.I think the low endjust needs to be kicked up anoch, or something lol theres only been a menagerie of solutions, none of which have been put into place. So i don't think the sizing is quite engraved in stone just yet, anyway.
Dorelli
Wed Aug 31, 2005 5:12 am
#2
No ... it's weird. I thought there were just a few that didn't adhear to the general rule of thumb but apparently not. My level 69 choku was supposed to be small when a baby and he wasn't 
Lammie says that the wasteland cu pa is the highest level cu pa and it's true - it's someting like level 30? But still ...
I also saw another post early on that said that SOE forgot to take volume into account when they scaled ... said they scaled based on the linear factor multiplied by the level which caused the volume to be WAYYYY offf. At least that's what I remember reading ...
/sigh
So...the question is ... why did the level 10 brackaset suddenly become unmountable when they rebalanced Dath? Could it be they ARE sized against wild and then the scaling factor went wrong? Combine that with 'look-alike' skins with different names giving the top level and ... it is a possible answer?? Maybe?? I do think someone did make a mistake tho...
Dor
Seiryuu
Wed Aug 31, 2005 11:54 am
#3
Well, it is speculation and always will be until a dev posts one way or the other.
This part I can say for sure: All models have some sort of base whose scale is a factor of 1.
The speculation: This base is associated with some creature, and maybe not the most common type in all cases. Maybe not even one in game. Other creatures will use the same model, but have a different scale. It may be 0.5 or it may be 2.3, or whatever size they need it to be. In most cases the base creature is going to be 1.0 scale but with so many in the game, they may have tweaked it somewhat over time so it may be more or less.
BE creatures then use these base creatures, compare the CL, and adjust the size accordingly. Because of tweaks along the way there are a few that don't seem reasonably sized, but still follow the system because their base model is not the one with the 1.0 scale.
This part I can say for sure: All models have some sort of base whose scale is a factor of 1.
The speculation: This base is associated with some creature, and maybe not the most common type in all cases. Maybe not even one in game. Other creatures will use the same model, but have a different scale. It may be 0.5 or it may be 2.3, or whatever size they need it to be. In most cases the base creature is going to be 1.0 scale but with so many in the game, they may have tweaked it somewhat over time so it may be more or less.
BE creatures then use these base creatures, compare the CL, and adjust the size accordingly. Because of tweaks along the way there are a few that don't seem reasonably sized, but still follow the system because their base model is not the one with the 1.0 scale.
Gimpynoob
Wed Aug 31, 2005 12:53 pm
#4
I've seen a few comments over the last few weeks speculating that BE pet size may be 'scaled' from the size and CL of the same wild pet.
For example:
A wild bageraset is CL8. If I undersand correctly, those making these specualtions would say that if you made a BE bageraset that was CL8, it should be the same size as a wild bageraset. And of course a level 3 bageraset would be smaller like a cl70 bageraset would be much larger.
In my observations this is not the case. If this was how BE pets are scaled, then a BE Cupa or Carrion Spat, both of which are CL10 in the wild, would be mountable at CL10 when made by a BE. But they are much smaller.
A wild Brackaset is CL65. And yet a BE brackaset the same level will tower over its wild counterpart. It may even be too larget to mount.
Have you seen a CL70 BE klicknick? They are double the size of their CL72 wild counterpart.
A CL50 BE Gurreck is much larger than the wild CL50 Gurreck.
I could list dozens of examples but I think this is more than enough.
For example:
A wild bageraset is CL8. If I undersand correctly, those making these specualtions would say that if you made a BE bageraset that was CL8, it should be the same size as a wild bageraset. And of course a level 3 bageraset would be smaller like a cl70 bageraset would be much larger.
In my observations this is not the case. If this was how BE pets are scaled, then a BE Cupa or Carrion Spat, both of which are CL10 in the wild, would be mountable at CL10 when made by a BE. But they are much smaller.
A wild Brackaset is CL65. And yet a BE brackaset the same level will tower over its wild counterpart. It may even be too larget to mount.
Have you seen a CL70 BE klicknick? They are double the size of their CL72 wild counterpart.
A CL50 BE Gurreck is much larger than the wild CL50 Gurreck.
I could list dozens of examples but I think this is more than enough.
lammergeier
Wed Aug 31, 2005 9:21 pm
#5
it's inconsistent to be sure.
BioE'd kimogilas are small. wild kimos are pretty big (even 'juveniles').
BioE'd cu pas are TINY. many folks forget about 'wasteland cu pas' (which are around CL20).
additionally, many wild mobs now have a 'boss type' which will occasionally spawn when the wild lair is destroyed. I have no proof here, but I'd wager that this throws a wrench in the system.
the question seems to be: for any given skin, what is the WILD counterpart that is used as the base size? since there seems to be no consistent answer to THIS question, we'll all be speculating for a while to come.
BioE'd kimogilas are small. wild kimos are pretty big (even 'juveniles').
BioE'd cu pas are TINY. many folks forget about 'wasteland cu pas' (which are around CL20).
additionally, many wild mobs now have a 'boss type' which will occasionally spawn when the wild lair is destroyed. I have no proof here, but I'd wager that this throws a wrench in the system.
the question seems to be: for any given skin, what is the WILD counterpart that is used as the base size? since there seems to be no consistent answer to THIS question, we'll all be speculating for a while to come.
Dorelli
Thu Sep 01, 2005 2:58 am
#6
LuCha wrote:
lammergeier wrote:
it's inconsistent to be sure.
BioE'd kimogilas are small. wild kimos are pretty big (even 'juveniles').
BioE'd cu pas are TINY. many folks forget about 'wasteland cu pas' (which are around CL20).
additionally, many wild mobs now have a 'boss type' which will occasionally spawn when the wild lair is destroyed. I have no proof here, but I'd wager that this throws a wrench in the system.
the question seems to be: for any given skin, what is the WILD counterpart that is used as the base size? since there seems to be no consistent answer to THIS question, we'll all be speculating for a while to come.
Careful Lam... Dor is going to jump all over you for admitting to having no proof
hehehe...no no ... Lammie is god. /worship Lammie.
Dor (do i get a cookie for that?)
Dorelli
Thu Sep 01, 2005 3:03 am
#7
Right then...so all we need to do is name it, and make up a few rules. Succintly:
BE animals grow differently to wild animals. They adhere to 'Gimpy's wilddeveloperbottom theory (GWDB)' an idea proposed by one of our more respected BE's and which is too complicated to describe herein. As a general rule, BE pets will grow to the size that they grow to but sometimes they will not.
That should just about do it. Sticky this and refer people to it for a week and it will become 'common knowledge' 
Dor
Message Edited by Dorelli on 09-01-2005 03:21 AM
LuCha
Thu Sep 01, 2005 12:30 pm
#8
lammergeier wrote:
it's inconsistent to be sure.
BioE'd kimogilas are small. wild kimos are pretty big (even 'juveniles').
BioE'd cu pas are TINY. many folks forget about 'wasteland cu pas' (which are around CL20).
additionally, many wild mobs now have a 'boss type' which will occasionally spawn when the wild lair is destroyed. I have no proof here, but I'd wager that this throws a wrench in the system.
the question seems to be: for any given skin, what is the WILD counterpart that is used as the base size? since there seems to be no consistent answer to THIS question, we'll all be speculating for a while to come.
Careful Lam... Dor is going to jump all over you for admitting to having no proof
Gimpynoob
Thu Sep 01, 2005 12:36 pm
#9
lammergeier wrote:
it's inconsistent to be sure.
BioE'd kimogilas are small. wild kimos are pretty big (even 'juveniles').
BioE'd cu pas are TINY. many folks forget about 'wasteland cu pas' (which are around CL20).
additionally, many wild mobs now have a 'boss type' which will occasionally spawn when the wild lair is destroyed. I have no proof here, but I'd wager that this throws a wrench in the system.
the question seems to be: for any given skin, what is the WILD counterpart that is used as the base size? since there seems to be no consistent answer to THIS question, we'll all be speculating for a while to come.
I think you're giving the developers WAY too much credit.
We can not make wasteland cu pas, lowland brakasets, cowardly gurrecks, giant carrion spats, etc...
We make the plane cu pa, brackaset, gurreck, carrion spat, etc..
I'll tell you how BE pets are scaled.
One of the developers pulled a number out of his butt and decided to scale them accordingly to that percantage.
If anyone has any information that disputes my butt theory, I'd be anxious to see it!
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