Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: DNA Storage
lestat1
Sat Aug 14, 2004 4:46 am
#92
I like the Stacking idea!!! I realy DO!! We only have these small amounts of space to work with, and i REFUSE to get a large house just so i have the little bit more room. I, myself have two accounts on the Chili server, one a Master Marks, Rifle, CH, the other my master BE...with a masters in TKA (for sample protection you know LOL) I already pay for a medium house, which I log in, and a small house that i have set up as my Laboratory. Come on DEV's let us stack or what ever you see fit from your DEV wisdom.
We're just trying to make a Living here.
Respectfully,
K'p - BE, TKA
Lestat'de'kp - Marks, Rifles, CH
Kilarny
Wed Aug 18, 2004 9:15 am
#93
Ok, the best thing I can come up with that does not involve a major rewrite:
(P.S. I'm not a BE but I've felt the pain radiating from them as storage gets thin)
DNA should be able to be stored inside a Data Storage Module in a droid. These can have 150 slots per (* 5 droids = 750 DNA storage) and currently only hold Manufacturing Schematics.
SOE just needs to hang a software flag on the DNA item type, and add a little code to the Data Storage that looks for the flag - if the flag isn't there, item can't be placed into the module. If the flag is present OR the item is a Manufacturing Schematic it can go into the Data Module. (Don't break the current function SOE).
This has the advantage of being expandable later - Data Storage Modules can be made bigger, and the same flag could be applied to other data / items making them storable in the droids. Makes the droids 'live' a little more...right now the 'Death Star Data in R2D2 (Ep4)' would have to be an item, not a piece of data.
(Picturing Ben Kenobi, who has been playing since launch, trying to explain to the n00b Luke how to call his droid and access the storage compartment)
Luke: "Wait....R2 was right here...where'd he go? R2!!!"
Kenobi:"Just open your datapad, Store him, then Call him again."
Kenobi:"Just open your datapad, Store him, then Call him again."
Luke: "R2 Store! R2 Store!"
Kenobi: "No, no, in your DATAPAD..."
RancorPoker
Wed Aug 18, 2004 3:29 pm
#94
Two accounts:
10 lots: medium house (home/dna), medium house (lab/dna), medium house (dna), medium house (dna), chemfactory (make stuff/store dna), equipfactory (make stuff/store dna)
10 lots: medium house (dna), medium house (dna/meat/bone/hide/chem/water), harvester x 6 (damn, no storage)
Bank (100 quest related items, crystals, loot,and older prenerf'd weapons among other things):
Bank (spill over from other account items, dna)
Three friends:
6 lots: Soon to be used by me
8 lots: Soon to be used by me since my jillion house deeds can't store all my dna.
I've been thinking about it. perhaps I could remove a few houses and place factories instead. medium house = 150 storage.4 * 150 = 600 storage. 8 * 100 = 800 storage. Hmm, perhaps i'll do that. Or maybe I'll keep my Bio Campus the way it is and place 6 factories on one friend's lots and 8 factories on the other's **salivating**. 14 * 100 = 1400 storage. That's much better.
Kevm
Wed Aug 18, 2004 3:45 pm
#95
RancorPoker wrote:
Two accounts:
10 lots: medium house (home/dna), medium house (lab/dna), medium house (dna), medium house (dna), chemfactory (make stuff/store dna), equipfactory (make stuff/store dna)
10 lots: medium house (dna), medium house (dna/meat/bone/hide/chem/water), harvester x 6 (damn, no storage)
Bank (100 quest related items, crystals, loot,and older prenerf'd weapons among other things):
Bank (spill over from other account items, dna)
Three friends:
6 lots: Soon to be used by me
8 lots: Soon to be used by me since my jillion house deeds can't store all my dna.
I've been thinking about it. perhaps I could remove a few houses and place factories instead. medium house = 150 storage.4 * 150 = 600 storage. 8 * 100 = 800 storage. Hmm, perhaps i'll do that. Or maybe I'll keep my Bio Campus the way it is and place 6 factories on one friend's lots and 8 factories on the other's **salivating**. 14 * 100 = 1400 storage. That's much better.
Similar to what I've got:
2 Accounts
My MBE/Merchant:7 lots for harvesters, 1 medium house (decked out Lab that a couple of ppl on these forums have seen), 1 food/chem factory
My Master rifleman/CH/Ranger: small house (DNA), small house (nothing but meat), small house (flora, eggs, milk, fish), 3 food and chem factories, 1 equipment factory (for traps and storage)
Wife's account: 1 small house (misc storage), 6 available lots for harvesters.
Spazzers
Thu Aug 19, 2004 12:18 am
#96
A food and chem factory takes one lot and holds 100 items in the input hopper. Yes, DNA can be placed in a factory as can animals. I have three factories. If I get too many samples I put it in my factories leaving enough space to put resources needed to run tissues.
If the factory is running I can just shut if off, remove the DNA I need, and turn the factory back on.
I have two houses, three factories, my bank, my inventory, a pack, and two storage droids. DNA storage is very low on my list of concerns. Making the creature handler profession a viable class again effects me infinitely more than DNA storage does.
Seiryuu
Thu Aug 19, 2004 12:40 am
#97
DNA should be able to be stored inside a Data Storage Module in a droid. These can have 150 slots per (* 5 droids = 750 DNA storage) and currently only hold Manufacturing Schematics.
This will never happen. DNA is one of, if not the, most data intensive items in this game. The devs have stated they will not give us more ways to store DNA as it exists now. Just increasing the storage slots for it is counter to what they have stated.
That is why the blood proposals have been made. They reduce the data size of the object. Our goal is to make it so that not only does it do that, but we get more proto-samples represented by that smaller object. Yes getting more samples in a smaller space seems contrary to the goal, but there are tricks to getting around it.
This will never happen. DNA is one of, if not the, most data intensive items in this game. The devs have stated they will not give us more ways to store DNA as it exists now. Just increasing the storage slots for it is counter to what they have stated.
That is why the blood proposals have been made. They reduce the data size of the object. Our goal is to make it so that not only does it do that, but we get more proto-samples represented by that smaller object. Yes getting more samples in a smaller space seems contrary to the goal, but there are tricks to getting around it.
furrycat
Thu Aug 19, 2004 4:38 am
#98
I have to say that in an abstract sense I don't like the blood sample idea for reasons which other posts have already mentioned. It does however seem more likely to actually happen than the other ideas and I therefore give it my support. Sometimes a kludge is better than nothing.
Seiryuu
Thu Aug 19, 2004 10:35 am
#99
When I say that, I mean in inventory items. You are correct that any player is more data intensive, but a player is also a container in a sense...
DNA has as many stats as any creature, within a few variables more or less. That right there makes it the second most data-intensive item behind characters.
We're limited to 22 pets if a master Creature Handler or 2 pets if a non-handler. Anyone can hold 1150 samples of DNA using factories, a pack and personal inventory. With cross-server lot trades or friends, this increases without end.
The amount of data for DNA storage swamps that of pets in the end.
DNA has as many stats as any creature, within a few variables more or less. That right there makes it the second most data-intensive item behind characters.
We're limited to 22 pets if a master Creature Handler or 2 pets if a non-handler. Anyone can hold 1150 samples of DNA using factories, a pack and personal inventory. With cross-server lot trades or friends, this increases without end.
The amount of data for DNA storage swamps that of pets in the end.
BountyHuntetSerb
Fri Aug 20, 2004 5:00 am
#101
Zadokk wrote:
I think samples should stack from the same creature. I.e. All creatures are assigned a type, like a durni would be in a group called 'Durni' and all rancor youths would be in a group called 'Rancor Youth'. You get samples from them in a similar way that you would say gather milk from a creature. So for instance, samples from low level creatures (durnis) produce a high yield of DNA (because they are so much easier to sample etc) - so from one durni you might get 125 or 150 units before it dies. However, high level creatures, like Mutant Rancors produce a very low yield of DNA - say maybe 25 or 50 units before it perishes. Obviously the numbers dont have to be round - so you may get less than 1 sample from any one creature before it dies - however it would stack. So you could go to your BE buddy "hey can you lend me 7 units of Mutant Rancor DNA so Icanuse it in a template?" -and he could split it like a resource.
Lower level BEs would produce a lower yield of milk per sample (like milking is dependant on the person's Hunting abilities) but there would still be a level restriction on sampling - much like the Creature Handler's error message: "You cannot tame that" except it would say "You cannot sample that". This would also prevent novice BEs from wasting time sampling creautres that are just to high level for them.
The only downfall from this would be that there would be a removal of the quality system which could effect how specials stick etcand it would standardise all samples. But I think this definately solve the stacking problem, as well as clear up all those teary eyes of novice BEs wondering why they cant sample a dewback or something.
I like this idea and i think to get around the quality issue is simply you sample a low lvl creature for example a Durni which will give u say 25average quality DNA samples all stack together and all the same quality then you sample again for the same Durni and you get say 15 Low quality DNA with different stats to the first one. The quanity of DNA you get will be based on Cearture Lvl and your sampling skills.
Or the only other thing that many decrase the storage problem is to lower the DNA number required to make a creautre from 5 to 3, one for HAM,one for armour and one for damage special attacks etc. However I really dont like this idea as you wont be able to do much for with yor creatures and will make it very dull to be a BE.
Another idea I have and I havent seen this metioned anywhere (ok i havent looked really hard) is how about giving a option to cross clone DNA you get to DNA samples and combined them together. This can if succsefully increase ceratin skills however it will also decrease some for example you can incrase HAM and you will lose armour and/or resistance. If your master BE and you do this u will have a great chance of it succeding on lower creature with lower side effects however it will be near impossible to do for very high ones like Rancors and the side effects can be great then the risks to use them.
What does everyone think?
Kilarny
Fri Aug 20, 2004 9:10 am
#102
Seiryuu wrote:
When I say that, I mean in inventory items. You are correct that any player is more data intensive, but a player is also a container in a sense...
DNA has as many stats as any creature, within a few variables more or less. That right there makes it the second most data-intensive item behind characters.
We're limited to 22 pets if a master Creature Handler or 2 pets if a non-handler. Anyone can hold 1150 samples of DNA using factories, a pack and personal inventory. With cross-server lot trades or friends, this increases without end.
The amount of data for DNA storage swamps that of pets in the end.
1. Oy. What a mess.
2. Developer: rewrite the code to compress the DNA info.
3. You guys need a miracle.
GMANHNC
Fri Aug 20, 2004 4:43 pm
#104
DIV>
I think you don't make pets, or at least are not a MBE and don't fully understand the importance of the "Quality" of DNA.
I am starting to think instead of blood samples, why not just make it so DNA is a loot drop, if it doesn't really matter what quality or what animal, why waste are time with BE, they should just disband the profession and make LOOT KITS! Yeah, so instead of burning all these skill points I could just pick up DNA off Jawas while looking for parts to my rug! I can make a rug, I can make a Razor Cat, I can make a CL11 Naboo Statue it would be sweet.
*****
Blood SAMPLES must have identical Stats to the DNA sample we would pull, they should be sampled as pet deeds are sampled. We would have a shot at getting multiple DNA tid bits from each sample or uno, stackable would be nice but unnecessary, but it has to be down to penny as far as info or it will be point free to make pets. I understand there are concerns about identical DNA and some would be concerned about pet-o-matic factories. I personally think that would be great, but if we don't like it "on the whole", then we as a community could ask that they not be able to be used in factories.
In closing I would like to say that if preperations A-G fail we should press on, you never know, the next one could be the one. But agian, we as community would have to agree together as one voice whether or not it feels good "on the Whole."
I like this idea and i think to get around the quality issue is simply you sample a low lvl creature for example a Durni which will give u say 25average quality DNA samples all stack together and all the same quality then you sample again for the same Durni and you get say 15 Low quality DNA with different stats to the first one. The quanity of DNA you get will be based on Cearture Lvl and your sampling skills.What does everyone think?
I think you don't make pets, or at least are not a MBE and don't fully understand the importance of the "Quality" of DNA.
I am starting to think instead of blood samples, why not just make it so DNA is a loot drop, if it doesn't really matter what quality or what animal, why waste are time with BE, they should just disband the profession and make LOOT KITS! Yeah, so instead of burning all these skill points I could just pick up DNA off Jawas while looking for parts to my rug! I can make a rug, I can make a Razor Cat, I can make a CL11 Naboo Statue it would be sweet.
*****
Blood SAMPLES must have identical Stats to the DNA sample we would pull, they should be sampled as pet deeds are sampled. We would have a shot at getting multiple DNA tid bits from each sample or uno, stackable would be nice but unnecessary, but it has to be down to penny as far as info or it will be point free to make pets. I understand there are concerns about identical DNA and some would be concerned about pet-o-matic factories. I personally think that would be great, but if we don't like it "on the whole", then we as a community could ask that they not be able to be used in factories.
In closing I would like to say that if preperations A-G fail we should press on, you never know, the next one could be the one. But agian, we as community would have to agree together as one voice whether or not it feels good "on the Whole."