Bio Engineer Archive

only 3 things you can count on in life: death, taxes and nerfs...buy one and enjoy it while you can!

I'll buy one, but not a premium price reserved for something more permanent.

Regarding pricing:

I priced them from 35K - 100K (6K H 3KA, 2KM 10+% Kinetic, Dizzy).

I included the level 11s as well in the mix figured novice CHs might be tempted.

Also made some 5K Health Cu Pas.

I ran a spam macro with the location of my vendor at Coronet starport during dinner at home.

When I had come back, I had sold over a million credits worth of pets. All the 100K ones were gone too.

So, the demand is out there.

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Fredcat wrote:

You can be certain that BE pets will be nerfed. Remember this is SOE here. They have a long history of nerfing pets that are overpowered in EQ. SOE does not like overpowered pets.

And these pets are outragously overpowered, no question. Consider this. My CH has a max pet level of 29. Best 29 pet I have found is a Crimson Razor Cat with 8.5k HAM, 35% kinetic and blast resist, damage 305-320 I think. And this pet is nasty. I kill yellows and reds with ease while my other characters need to stick to white cons.

Now does anyone really think a non CH should have aCL 10 petthat tanks as well or betterthen a strong mob 3x its level? Stronger then what someone who is more then halfway to MCH can tame? A dancer can have a pet stronger then what I can tame? I dont think so.

It's absurd that a CH currently has to either master BE or buy his pets. The alternative is to be grossly underpowered compared to people using BE pets. It's no problem for me PVE now, but im sure at the high end and PVP I will need a BE pet with the current system.

IMO BE pets should be no more powerful then what a CH can tame. They should just be different and possibly have different uses. For example, a BE might be able to make a pet that produces better milk, meat, hide or bonesfor trade, or make faster running, more unique mounts.

Sorry to rain on your recipe parade, but no one could possibley defend these pets as balanced when they have the same HAM as a mob 3x their level and 10x more HAM then a PC has.

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I agree with most of your post except the part about BE pets shouldn't be more powerful then what a CH can tame...A CH shouldn't be able to use a higher creature that he him self couldn't tame...but BE should be able to make stronger creatures thenhe couldtame....I mean if a BE can get a DNA sample off of it then they can use the best outta that paticular creature...they are basically putting the best of everything into one creature..why wouldn't it be better? I mean you mix a Gnort and a Rancor together? the newly made pet shouldn't be any stronger then a Gnort in the wild? Of course it should be stronger...You find the creature with the best attacks, the best resists and such and mix it all together its going to be better...BE's make monsters....its either that or they just make additives for Tailors and Chefs...CH's tame creatures from the wild and control them...BE's build them...

Message Edited by Slestak on 03-11-2004 06:24 AM

Hrmmm....This is a great recipe but i cant seem to get ti exactly right,I'm a Master BE and when i combine i get usually only 3.9k health 2.8k action and 1.8k mind, plus damage is only 55-65, does anyone know what i might be doing wrong? I know its not the DNA quality as i am using the exact recipe. I do the exact experiments too. Also on the 2nd and 3rd GEN pets, How much do i experiment to get it right? I apreciate all your help, thanks.

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Smonkey wrote:

Has anyone tweaking this recipe found anything that works well in the Dasher slots but doesn't live on Dant? Dant is a lag-infested no spawn zone during prime time on Chilastra. I can try scraping them up if I log in right after the server reset, but last night I walked the entire planet north to south then east to west, and never saw a single non-mission lair or herd of anything spawned. I tried taking a few voritor missions myself and learned that they must not spit out many dashers and I've got no business trying to fight the things outright Since it's not often I can play in the mornings, any suggestions for Dant-free DNA would be appreciated.

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You can get Dasher missions from the terminals. They pay around 8 - 9k I think. If you're solo, expect to see 2 Dashers per tap.

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Fugee000 wrote:

As the combo VD/VD/HP/HP/HP was giving me many CL11 results i experimented on another one: VD/HP/HP/VD/HP, fully experiment physique and experiment Prowess 1 point.

I'm only getting CL10 with

4-5k Health

3ish k Action

2-3k Mind

10% Kinetic/Blast

Vulnerable rest

and if you're lucky Dizzy/Ranged attack

These are not the best but it's afast and sure way of getting the right level creatures and i manage to sell them out pretty fast

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Message Edited by SomeUser on 03-13-2004 06:53 AM

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Fredcat wrote:

You can be certain that BE pets will be nerfed. Remember this is SOE here. They have a long history of nerfing pets that are overpowered in EQ. SOE does not like overpowered pets.

And these pets are outragously overpowered, no question. Consider this. My CH has a max pet level of 29. Best 29 pet I have found is a Crimson Razor Cat with 8.5k HAM, 35% kinetic and blast resist, damage 305-320 I think. And this pet is nasty. I kill yellows and reds with ease while my other characters need to stick to white cons.

Now does anyone really think a non CH should have aCL 10 petthat tanks as well or betterthen a strong mob 3x its level? Stronger then what someone who is more then halfway to MCH can tame? A dancer can have a pet stronger then what I can tame? I dont think so.

It's absurd that a CH currently has to either master BE or buy his pets. The alternative is to be grossly underpowered compared to people using BE pets. It's no problem for me PVE now, but im sure at the high end and PVP I will need a BE pet with the current system.

IMO BE pets should be no more powerful then what a CH can tame. They should just be different and possibly have different uses. For example, a BE might be able to make a pet that produces better milk, meat, hide or bonesfor trade, or make faster running, more unique mounts.

Sorry to rain on your recipe parade, but no one could possibley defend these pets as balanced when they have the same HAM as a mob 3x their level and 10x more HAM then a PC has.

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i think maybe the point you're missing with the whole Bio Engineer concept is that yes they should be able to make pets far superior to wildly tamed pets for the following reasons:

a) we have to assume the risk of sampling DNA for these pets (a non BE just doesnt grasp the concept of how different it is to actually nurture an animals DNA away from it as opposed to just going on an all out slugfest and killing them)

b) the Ideal behind Genetic manipulation is to *GASP* create a new better breed than what natural selection has made

c) no one said a CH can't own one of these illustrious beauties for themselves (and the above mentioned dancer still cant train the pet *this is where you should make a little extra cash* or for that matter use any of the higher level BE pets

If you're feeling insecure in the idea that wild pets are your chosen profession then you should. To me it's the same ideal as one weaponsmith complaing that he can only make sub standard weapons at a slow rate because he doesnt want to use a crafting station or factory. Get with the times and the times say BE pets is the way to go.

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Fredcat wrote:

You can be certain that BE pets will be nerfed. Remember this is SOE here. They have a long history of nerfing pets that are overpowered in EQ. SOE does not like overpowered pets.

And these pets are outragously overpowered, no question. Consider this. My CH has a max pet level of 29. Best 29 pet I have found is a Crimson Razor Cat with 8.5k HAM, 35% kinetic and blast resist, damage 305-320 I think. And this pet is nasty. I kill yellows and reds with ease while my other characters need to stick to white cons.

Now does anyone really think a non CH should have a CL 10 pet that tanks as well or better then a strong mob 3x its level? Stronger then what someone who is more then halfway to MCH can tame? A dancer can have a pet stronger then what I can tame? I dont think so.

It's absurd that a CH currently has to either master BE or buy his pets. The alternative is to be grossly underpowered compared to people using BE pets. It's no problem for me PVE now, but im sure at the high end and PVP I will need a BE pet with the current system.

IMO BE pets should be no more powerful then what a CH can tame. They should just be different and possibly have different uses. For example, a BE might be able to make a pet that produces better milk, meat, hide or bones for trade, or make faster running, more unique mounts.

Sorry to rain on your recipe parade, but no one could possibley defend these pets as balanced when they have the same HAM as a mob 3x their level and 10x more HAM then a PC has.

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As said by others, the entire point of BE is to have creatures 'better than the wild'. THIS much better than the wild? Maybe not. Maybe. Devs think not, on the non-CH versions, but since the validity checks went in, I haven't heard them say 'that's out of bounds' for CH pets.
Of course, they don't say much of anything to us.

On your other points? Your 35% kinetic resist, 8.5k ham cat with the 300 damage is 3x the pet. You realize it's doing about 250 more damage than one of these non-CH, has AT LEAST 2k more ham, and another 15% kinetic resist to give it effectively 2352 more ham (actually, most folk get around 10% kinetic/blast, and around 3-4k ham, so 4k extra ham, and 25% extra kinetic resist, for an effective ham bonus of 5333 vs. most PvE stuff). I'd say more than doubling the 'tankworthyness' of a critter, AND x5 damage is worth the extra 19 CL.
There's no effing way that one of these CL10 pets is 'stronger' than your cat, btw.

And just as a side note: I've been tanking, myself, with no pet, yellows and reds since day one. Including, as a current TKM (or for that matter, any of several ranged professions), things that my scouting tells me are over CL35. Saying your cat let you fight yellows and reds as a middling CH is not really telling us much. A MCH with any of the many damage output profession to go along with it can kill things, by themselves, that very few other professions can even touch by themselves. The only profession I'm absolutely sure can kill more (in less time) by themselves right now are rifleman, as far as target selection goes.
Now, if ALL you have is MCH, killing things becomes slow, drawn out, and you're likely to lose the pet before the target dies, simply because pet output damage is miniscule compared to their tanking ability (and generally always has been).

Your post, to me, reeks of someone who sees the game through very narrow filters, and likes his CH with no taint of outside assistance.

YMMV, mine is based on having been non-ch combat, ch combatant, and BE making pets for my own and others' use.

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Talthazar wrote:

I'm curious, what are your skills? I tried this combo and when I experimented in both physique and mental I came out with a CL 11 every time. If I skipped mental, I ended up with with more health and action, but about half the mental.

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Just for ref, as a MBE and doing similar combines (2x dasher, 3xpup DNA) without paying huge lots of attention to the quality or numbers, at least one experiment in physique and mental and psychology, (but none in prowess that I remember), I could consistantly get above 3k health, above 2k mental, above 1500ish action (I think, might have action and mental reversed, but I don't think so). Dasher in the physique and psych slots. As i recall, I had to do this a few times to get the ranged attack to stick (since I was looking for an xp pet, not a tank), but all of them kept the dizzy (and none got the poison).

I know I got it to stick at CL10 in gurrcat skins, but was phenominally irritated when cu pa skins gave me CL11 and nothing lower (even when I switched to pure yard trash templates). Yet-another-CH-only-mount strikes me as stupid.