Bio Engineer Archive
Thread: Critter Resource Availability
ArthurDentOnBria wrote:
Calc here's the thing:
1) the tailoring community, I believe, sees no such resource shortages. For the most part we use leathery (rancor) hide for 90% of our items, and thank god for that because we are able to buy it cheaply (3cr/u - 6cr/u) from scouts. If we had to deal with rangers for hide we'd be paying 50cr/u like everybody else and tailor margins don't permit that, but rangers are natoriously insensitive to such issues.
2) Tailors have probably gotten no more attention than rangers since launch. I have one character who is each so I'm sensitive to these issues.
I hope rangers do get some help, for their sake and for my ranger character's sake, but I have no illusions whatsoever that the crafting community would see any benefit from such a change. Rangers are a small group of specialized hunters who demand premium (read outrageous) prices forwhat they harvest, andare going to set their prices on "what doctors will pay for avian"no matter what, which hoses all other crafters. Tailors will be buying hide from scouts, not rangers, as always.
Message Edited by ArthurDentOnBria on 04-07-2004 10:43 AM
Not all Rangers are like that. But there is something else involved here. Many Rangers hunt as a business. For them, it is impossible to lower the price and really make a profit. Many of those Scouts you buy from cheaply sell at that price because they get it anyway while trying for xp. It is just as easy for us to supply the crafter paying 10cpu as it is to supply the crafter paying 50cpu. In all honesty, who do you think the Ranger should work for? If we could harvest more then the general supply of resources would go up. If there are more resources, you will have fewer bounties for 50cpu for resources. Meaning you might actually be able to afford to pay the normal Ranger to hunt for you. As it is, I usually hunt for free. I'm hunting most of the time anyway so why should I bother charging others for it? But I can't even keep one person happy with all the resources they need.
Lythender Nirou
Master Ranger/Master Rifleman
Eclipse Server
Nemo0 wrote:
josfe wrote:
For example:
Lets say that a master TKA/Ranger requires aproximately 20 seconds to kill a rancor. For which he recieves an 1000 hide reward. While he's fighting the rancor a master artisan plops down 8 BER 13 harvesters on a 90% vein of steel. In the 20 seconds it takes the TKA/Ranger to kill the rancor the master artisan has 1872 steel in his harvesters. not only that but the master artisan won't need to return to the harvesters for a few days because he's paid maintenance and power and while he's off doing something else the extractors are still going. Mean while the ranger's throwing traps, healing himself and destroying a single rancor for an 1000 hide reward. This just doesn't equil out.
One small point--a rancor gives a lot less than 1000 hide. I wouldn't expect 1000 hides on anything much lower than mid 100's CL.
Lythender Nirou
Master Ranger/Master Rifleman
Eclipse Server
josfe wrote:
One small point--a rancor gives a lot less than 1000 hide. I wouldn't expect 1000 hides on anything much lower than mid 100's CL.
heh sorry I was guesstimating on that number. However I was definately sure that the number never exceeded 1000 so I figured it would be a safe bet to use this in my example.
Don't worry--I was just pointing out that your argument was actually a lot weaker than the real situation. Your point was a very good one. I just wanted to make sure people didn't get the wrong idea. 1000 hides off a rancor would actually not be that bad. I could probably live with 1000 resources from a CL 50 mob. And, even with that, it is much less than a harvester can get.
Lythender Nirou
Master Ranger/Master Rifleman
Eclipse Server
It's not who I think you should work for, it's who you guysare willing towork for, and it aint tailors I can tell you that. If a ranger must choose between harvesting 500 avian meat vs harvesting 500 leathery hide, he's going to harvest the avian every single time because he'll be able to sell the avian for 100cr/u and no tailor would even pay 10cr/u for leathery hide. And it makes no difference whether you are harvesting 500 or 5000, the economics are still the same. So I'm afraid you are barking up the wrong tree with the tailoring community.
As far as the "can't lower prices without making a profit" hmm. Consider the economics. You run a 5k mission, you come back with 500u of some high quality resource. You sell the resource for 40cpu, you've just made 25k for one mission. Any clue how much clothing you could buy with 25k?
Like I said, I think the rangers should get bigger harvests, but that helps you, not us.
Nemo0 wrote:
In all honesty, who do you think the Ranger should work for?
Message Edited by ArthurDentOnBria on 04-07-2004 02:42 PM
). My wife is a Master BE/CH. The two of us combined(me master ranger, her with hunting IV in scout) can't even supply enough meat on our *own* to keep her business running. She has frequently had to make purchases at insanely high prices for resources, or we have had to rely on hunts with our good friends with everyone having at least novice scout and harvesting to collect enough to make ends meet.Message Edited by SolrFlare on 04-07-2004 05:43 PM
That's the whole point. The whole ranger economy is based on that and high end hide for armorsmiths, tailors are interested in neither. You can be a "good guy" and charge one tenth of the price ofyour competition (20cpu for avian), make a fortune, and succeed in bringing avian meat prices down on your server,but there still is no tailor on your server who would pay 20cpu for leathery hide, and no ranger who would hunt for leathery hide to sell to a tailor at 3cr/u. Face it, the only way a harvesting increase would help tailors would be if it were the scouts that got the increase since those are who we buy from. I'm sure that makes you cringe, and I don't blame you, but it is the truth.
Fred_Skinner wrote:
As one of these dedicated harvestors I keep my prices far below market. I make plenty of money, even then. However, neither my band of merry men or I can produce enough to get these lower prices to become the norm. Therefore, Eclipse typically have Avian Meat sales for 200cpu. That is not a typo.
If I had multiple resource harvesting and/or VASTLY increased harvest (we figured x10 would have to be a MINIMUM increase here) we can undercut those price hikers and they will not be selling at that price. I have about 10 steady customers and I'm lucky if I can give even one what they need. So they buy some at my price, and some at the "increda-price".
hmm i donno, maybe i just don't sell enough to see it or know the glories of killinganimals in 2 seconds with a multiple master combo instead of 3 secondslike i do with mysingle combatacct. i mean, how much do docs, BE, armorsmiths and chefs need? my vendor is stocked (and i mean a master BE and a master doc vendor), i look around at other BE vendors and they charge WAY more for much less quality/quantitythen i do. i advertise but i don't have a problem with keeping up with only 5k of good meats here or there.
are ya'll running 10 factories a day or something?
i'm still stubborn about the prices. we as the human being portion of the game can lower this. i'm serious, i play around on other servers and some are just naturally higher priced than others. i seriously doubt that flooding the market with materials is going to fix that. it has to be a concious fix of the humans that play the game. much like how gov't has had to regulate some companies in the past...like electric and whatnot. bah, i'm no politician...i'm goin back to makin tissues!
Ainwyn wrote:
should be able to double harvest off any kill. Go back for a second round, whether of the same resource or a different one
Great thought, we rangers have always considered not being able to harvest multiple resources wasteful and very un-rangerlike...the Native Americans would be ashamed.
We have suggested in previous posts that at the Master Ranger level, all three harvests are available (if available) to the ranger, at reduced rates, while choosing one resource, if i am harvesting hide for an AS, then I would get a great boost to that harvest.
As of now, the highest quality veghash only provides at the master ranger level, a 15% increase in actual harvest numbers, I was hunting fambaas and I was getting 120 hides on average, and with the veghash that I paid quite a bit for, I was harvesting about 139 units.
The veghash is a great addition to the game, however, if that same food is stacked upon our harvesting proposal, then that would be worth the money i paid for the food.
So far, thanks for the support....we rangers know very well the interconnected nature of the game and wouldnt want to propose something to your community without truly believing that it would help you too.
thanks