Artisan Archive

A lot of what I have seen as protests regarding the artisan professions revolves around two things:

1. Advancement / Grind /Uncompetitiveness withthe masters


2. Expectations / Fun factor / Sociability

I suggest the following as an attempt to address these issues:

As an artisan, I get a new option popping up on the radial menu when I examine another player: Craft Personalized Item. A submenu will appear denoting the crafting tool to use depending on which crafting tools I have in my inventory. The crafting tool is then opened as usual, and you craft the item as per usual.

So what, exactly, is different? Well, maybe something along the lines of:

• You get a significant bonus to the number of experiment points you can use in the crafting session, yielding a significantly higher-quality end product


• The item can only be used to maximum effectiveness by the person it is crafted for — should anyone else attempt to use the item they will get a similar message and result to using an item for which you aren't certified. For non-certified items (everything but weapons right now... but that will change) similar penalties will exist, perhaps in the form of much higher upkeep for structures, higher HAM costs for armor, etc.


• You get a multiple of the usual crafting experience for creating a personalized item.


• You get a multiple of the usual (currently bugged) UXP when the person for whom the item was customized uses it (clothing UXP / decay also needs to be addressed).

I'm sure you could come up with other possibilities, however these will do for the purposes of illustrating the concept.

So what does this address? Well:

• It increases the number of artisans required to adequately serve the player base with the most effective items


• It may act to make it not worth the time of master artisans to service lower level requests, and thus create opportunities for lower level crafters. At the moment higher level crafters can pretty much satisfy the needs of all levels of players via the use of factories to create unpersonalized items


• I think it addresses some of the "This isn't what I expected to be doing issues...." with artisan by making it a more interactive experience


• Offers advancement bonuses that encourage the sort of behavior that I think most crafters are after

If you need a justification for why this should yield these bonuses for the crafter and the user, then I guess you could consider how much better a personally tailored suit looks.

Anyway, that's the idea in general. It would requirea reasonable amount ofwork on the part of the devs, of course.

Would something like this be worth persuing in your opinion?

I think as far as gameplay/fun factor it's a great idea, but implementing it might be tricky. Though the addition of "practice" has reduced the amount ofitems that I destroy without even being used, I'm still making a bazillion things that aren't getting used. I just think this is silly. I would far rather make a few things that get used, but have them difficult to make, rather than just making tons of things and have them auto-delete.

Lord_Raegune:

First, thanks for the response.

As far as developer effort goes, I'd have to agree that it is not insignificant. It requires a new tag on all crafted items ("Made for PlayerName"), and a check needs to be done against this before calculating the effectiveness of the item. Interface changes are pretty much limited to the radial menu. There are several server-side support issues which, while not trivial, are probably not amazingly significant either. The real problem is not so much that implementing the elements of the idea are rocket science, it's that there's a high degree of integration involved and that means a lot of testing and fiddling.

Anyway, no matter how much I try to downplay the complexity of implementing such an idea (and, realistically how much can I really know about that? All I can do is guess), what I am attempting to do is offer some sort of potential solution to the problems facing artisans beyond "Bring back factory XP" etc.

I also hoped that by suggesting this I'd get a better idea of what artisans really want to be doing, and what they consider a reasonable advancement mechanism (beyond factory XP) to be. I can only assume that increasing player/artisan interaction isn't actually that high on their list of priorities given the lack of response to this idea (which seems strange to me given how often it is cited as a problem).

At first I thought that there were big problems in the artisan profession because I coudn't sell anyting. That has changed quite a lot in the past two weeks as I think many have moved on to elite professions and I'm also finding my niches.

A novice artisan can gain their first box just making the survey tools they need to find the resources they need to craft.

I think there need to be some low to no experimentation items. Either components or other things in the low end boxes that a newbie can make just as well as a master. This would give them something to sell.

I went up the engineering tree first. I'm finding that crafting tools sell. These can be made with the first box of engineering. Fireworks also sell. Each box adds new ones. Now a master can make fireworks with more charges than a newbie, but other than that they do the same thing. I charge 25 credits per charge on my fireworks. Repair tools sell (These are more dependent on skill, so not for the newbie) I've never tried to sell dice, becuase what would people use them for. If you needed dice to gamble or something these would sell.

I'm now going up the domestic tree but I have all my engineering power behind me, so I have lots of experimentation points now. However, I'm sticking with selling engineering items.

Other than the fiberplast panel that is needed by the engineering line, clothes and food compete with elite classes. Clothes seem to be popular with most people and once they can decay like other items I think perhaps there is a demand here.

Now with 4 boxes of engineering and 2 boxes of domestic I can pretty much make maxed out repair tools and nearly top end weapons and powerups. These items I can now sell.

There are niches in the market and people are buying my hand made goods. Now if I had a factory and such I think I could actually make a good living selling this stuff, but I'm still learning the trades so what I have now is fine.

It really can be as simple as finding a niche. I know starting artisans say they don't have a lot of credits, but get Marksman/Brawler and do a few destroy missions. You can always cash the skills out later.
I started on Talus, Nashal (Kuari). Not a bad place to get into the market. When I got a few extra creds, I took a hop to Dearic. It was like a whole new world there. The creatures right outside the city could be deadly at times. And there were things for sale there not for sale in Nashal and vice versa.
Take the time to see what's NOT on the Bazaar that you can make and sell it. Go ahead and laugh, but every fishing pole and musical instrument I put up sells! No one was making surveying tools there! Big market for them!

I must admit it is heartening to hear such positive feedback on the way the system is as it stands. I authored this post mainly to attempt to address the issues cited in the "On the factory XP" thread on the "SWG Discussion" board.

Your replies have made me realize that there probably is a silent majority out there enjoying the artisan professions as they are presently.

I'm beginning tosuspect I should probably limit my exposure to these fora (or at least "SWG Discussion") so as to avoid being whipped up into a frenzy over the latest issue of the day, and perhaps just sit back and enjoy the game.

Thankyou for your perspectives.

I think the Artisan profession is really a good profession. It could use some minor tweaks, but I don't think its nearly the grinding hell that some of the elite professions have turned into. (I've not played those yet though, just the rumors I read) Most people really seem to grind because its a means to an end. I do think you can really enjoy moving through the profession.

I started making food last night just to mess around and all of that has sold out during the day. I make maybe 10 or so items and put them on the bazaar and they are usually nearly all sold by the time I log on the next time.

I've fiddled around with harvesters and doing all kinds of things. I started out in Nashal and ran delivery missions to get my first few hundred credits. I've done a lot of destroy missions with people when I didn't even have any weapon skills.

Resources might be where its at for the early artisan. Dig up a few hundred resrouces, maybe find something high quality and sell it on the bazaar.
Once you have a few thousand credits is to get a wind generator. Find a high % spot and plop the thing down for a couple days and sell off some of your wind. That is what I did once I got to engineer III. But you can buy harvesters now for about 1000-2000 depending on what you want.



Artisan is nice because you only need 1500 xp to get a couple boxes and a bit of experimentation pts. It's not like the elite professions where you need hundreds of thousnads to move up a tiny bit.
Spend some time hand digging and building your tools and such. I think if you really just enjoy making things and selling them the Artisan profession offers a lot. I don't care how fast I advance. I don't even worry about the XP. I just make stuff and sell it and I"m slowly moving along.

Great post Jiordy!

Iam falling alseep as we speak so I'll comment on this more in the morning lol just did't want you to think I was ignoreing your suggestions.

Jaliss Anarawyn

Jasarina:

I'd still be interested to hear your comments on this. It's not that I'm keen to rush to the defense of any criticisms you may make, it's just that I'd like to hear how someone who's across the many issues facing artisans at present would feel about such a system. If it's just the relative impossibility of it occurring in a reasonable timeframe given the dev's current tasking, then, well, I can live with that.

I do think artisans need some items. Maybe all crafting classes need items that don't require experimentation to make better.

A novice artisan can make a general crafting tool. I've sold quite a few of these, and while experimenttation and higher effectiveness do have an affect on your success rates and help avoid critical failure, most who use this tool aren't super high end people.

I like fireworks too because no matter who makes them they all do the same things. A master can make one with 8-9 charges and a novice might make on with only 1-2 charges, but he can still sell them, abiet for less money than a master.

Clothing actually doesnt require any experimentatin skill because durability doesn't matter right now, but I'm sure this will change over the long run, but a novice or low end person could still make cheeper lower quality items.

I"m not sure adding a complex system onto the current system would make things better or not. People who want to grind will grind. I think if you want to smell the roses and sell what you make there is a lot of oportunity in the profession. I may only get 500-1500 gxp a day filling up the bazaar, but over a couple weeks that will get me nearly any professoin I want to be.

One thing I do worry about for artisan class is basically its a low money producing profession. Volume is what would generate the cash, not quality no matter how good it is.

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Your replies have made me realize that there probably is a silent majority out there enjoying the artisan professions as they are presently.

I'm beginning tosuspect I should probably limit my exposure to these fora (or at least "SWG Discussion") so as to avoid being whipped up into a frenzy over the latest issue of the day, and perhaps just sit back and enjoy the game.

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You've hit the nail right on the head! Once I hit Engineering IV (now Novice Weaponsmith), I've not had a huge problems selling stuff that I craft well. I'm not making aton of money, but I am inching ahead. Don't let the ranters whip you into a frenzy about crafting. Frankly, after I read some of the posts on the forum, I wonder how some people find the motivation to even log in! My words of advice for new artisans are similar to what others have said:

1) Find the niche on in your city. There are some great suggestions for "off the beaten path" kinds of items to make and sell.

2) Focus on quality.Don't put anything on the bazaar you wouldn't equip yourself.

3) Know your resources. Study the schematics of the items you craft. Know what resource attributes make them better. Find those resources on your planet and use them.

4) Start small with harvestors and work your way up. For the most part they work fine. Get one up and running so you can get used to the way they work. BE SURE TO PLAN POWER IN ADVANCE.

5) There is going to be some grinding. Do it in small amounts and with your lower quality resources since you will be destroying those items.

6) Go to cntrl-O. I think it is underMiscellaneous or Controls. There is a toggle box for crafting confirmation. Turn that off. It will save you a few mouse clicks or "Enter" keys.

6) Go to cntrl-O. I think it is underMiscellaneous or Controls. There is a toggle box for crafting confirmation. Turn that off. It will save you a few mouse clicks or "Enter" keys.

That may not seem like a lot, but I'm sure it will help. I wasn't aware of this option. I'm going to set that when I get home and grind my way to Novice Weaponsmith now.