Artisan Archive

Tonight, Q announced that there will be correspondants for each profession. These correspondants will have the jobof helping tofocus the discussion of issuesfor each 'class' for the devs.

Whoever the artisan correspondent turns out to be will be representing OUR concerns about the class, and we should assist him/her to bring these issues to the front.

I am starting this thread to address those things that are BROKEN in the artisan profession, not things we don't agree with (they'll be plenty of time for that later).

Please stay on topic, and give specific examples.

1. Artisan experimentation on bone segments is Broken. Only one experimentation point can be used (there are several schematics with this problem, I will add more later).

2.Artisan experimentation on personal harvesters doesn't allow experimentation for anything but size of the hopper. Wind generatorsare the exception.

3. Premium sales don't appear to do anything but cost more.

4. When experimenting, if the starting value is 0, any attempted experimentation will produce amazing results, and nothing will happen (divding by zero somewhere?)

By all means, feel free to continue.

Bianca Minola

While I have never experienced only being able to use one experimentation point on bone armor I have noticed that when maxing out the quality on bone armor it soes nothing to the encumbrence of the armor. It will brin up two of the three damage motifiers but while this provides better protection it still makes it too difficult to wear.

According to the experimentation stats in the data schematics quality experimentation should have a 50% effect on overall encumbrence.

I have yet to craft any piece of bone armor that had reduced encumbrence. I have tried to wear a complete set of bone armor (I am a novice marksman as well) and it is nearly impossible to fight meele creatures while wearing it (I know that this type of armor is more for blaster protection) and the pit fall far out-weigh the benefits when fighting attackers using blasters.

Is this as intended or should we expect a change so that this armor becomes better to use?

5. All personal harvesters from engineer III and IV give structure-XP. I have 11.5k useless SXP sitting on my Weaponsmith.

Let's stay on toppic - this thread is a good idea

I am taking this thought from JediFoder from another thread, but is is an important one for Artisans.

The Bazaar interface is in serious need of fixing.

When I call up items in my region I should be able to see ALL OF THEM. I shouldn't have to call up another page to see the same part of the alphabet. Even when the bazaar is sorted on a given attribute (e.g. name) you don't see all that is available to you. Stuff gets buried and there is no reasoning that I can figure out for it.

Also, being able to sort on item statistics would be of great value to shoppers. If I want to buy a carbine that has the greatest amount of damage, then I should be able to sort for ALL the weapons on my planet, by carbine, by damage. This would go a long way to help support the economy and the gamers who are focused on quality. People shopping for items are misled by the fact they get one screen with a limited number of items. Many probably think that this is all they have to choose from.

Simple economics says that for a free market to work there has to be "perfect" information. Now we know that isn't achievable, but shoppers need to be able to see everything they have to select from. That's not the case with the bazaar. Fix that, and I think it will go a long way to helping support price.

Things I would like to see. Some are more future development than urgent fixes.

Along Starrbuck's line, but in the other direction, make repair tools, weapons, armor, clothes, and food in the artisan tree also grant specialized xp. Let any crafting XP (Structural, weapons crafting, etc) be used to advance artisan skills, and change the reqs for advanced professions to use this specialized XP. Drop the mouse droid to Eng IV, andmaybe some droidcomponents to Eng IV or MArtto give the DEs a way to advance. Balance this by moving specs around in the DE tree to give them something better than mouse droids to grind.

Add a calculator to your datapad that takes into account maint. rate, power consumption, resource rate,productionrate, etc.to keep track of your structures remotely. If backwards compatibility is an issue, add an optional "Burst Transmitter" slot to new harvesters. This could be a MArt spec.

Fix wind harvester power display to be in days and hours instead of "0:52" or something...

Depositing maint or power retains the default 0 in the amount. So, it says 0 to start, if I backspace over that and type 500 and hit enter, it will deposit 5000. It does display 5000, but since that zero didn't delete, the 500 I typed in went in front of it 500+0 = 5000. Not too bad, but annoying and easy to mis-enter.

Maint and power cannot be retrieved once entered. "I paid 10K maint for my weekend camping trip, but the resource ran out 20 minutes later. Dang nabbit."

You can't redeed a harvester unless a certain amount of maint is paid up. Power and maint. fees paid are lost when the deed is reclaimed and placed. It makes more sense to destroy and make a new one for the 200 resources (or so) than the 3K maint fee. A fix would be to retain the power and maint, or make the harvester tougher to craft. To do the latter, increase the resource cost, difficulty (requiring a crafting station), or make it an architect spec vs. Eng 3-4.

Empty resource containers from harvesters when a hopper quantity is not explicitly stated.

IMO, harvesters should require oil instead of maint fees. They should also have a structural integrity bar like creature lairs that an Engineerhasto"heal" by performing a repair command. This could require a tool who's spec is granted at Eng IV. Decay rate would go up sharply if oil runs out, stop if power runs out, and can be decreased with experimentation on the original deed.

Allow harvesters built adjacent to a power source (wind generator, etc) to draw power directly from it. The power generator hopper would only fill with the power generated above the harvesters needs. Power could still be added to these harvesters, but would be in reserve in case the generator feed stops. Harvesters pulling fuels (i.e. radioactives) should be able to power themselves. (This could also be an optional module that allows this.)

Many fuels cannot be used to run your harvesters (petrochem, etc.)

How about a no-spawnzone around structures ? Even more fun - create an engineer item that can create a distraction (short). Remotely detonated blast (A)will pull aggressive mobs (B) from 60 meters, can be set off from 120 m in the other direction (C). Then you can create a diversion, and get to your structure (D) before they return.

A<-------->B<-------D-->C

Add descriptions to specs to tell you what the optional components do for the item. "Why does my repair tool call for an optionaldroid storage compartment?"

Better descriptions to all specs. "What does a nemodian bird cage do?"

Add a section to the Holocron with a list of all the schematics. If I offer to provide resources to an architect for a small house, and he tells me he needs 10K ore, is he trying to scam me? (yes) It would help people decide which professions or skill pathsto pursue as well.

Novice WS should be able to craft a D18 that outperforms an artisan CDEF right away... same with AS armor vs. bone armor. Advanced professions are forced to grind their (inferior due to artisan experimentation) novice spec items to get anything that can even compete with higher level artisans.

Why go into an advancedcrafting profession if there are 10 other players in the same area that can make a better product for less money? Maybe experimentation points should only apply to specs at the same level. i.e. Int firearms crafting specs are improved by Int Techniques. After that, you know everything there is to know about crafting those specs.

This keeps my DL44s competitive with the aforementioned 10 other players who already have more techniques levels. As it is now, I feel like I won't have a market until I can level up to the maxed out powergamers. (Likely arriving at master several months after they do). With cumulative experimentation points (in all artisan categories), the gap between casual players and powergamers will never be closed until master. By then, the powergamer has so much more in the way of resources and money, he can still undercut the casual player at every turn.

Grant more XP for experimentation than for non-experimented items. A failure should still grant some XP. "Whoops, I won't do that again!"

Give us a way to placevendors in towns - maybe a marketplace?Nobody wants to run 2K into the wild to pick something up from a vendor. The only time I sell anything is whensomeone happens across my house in the wild. The Bazaar is fine for low level items, but what about high-end gear?

How about better advertisement at least? Put a section in the bazaar called vendors. Each vendor you place would appear as an "item" in this section with your description, a downloadable waypoint, and a listing of your current stocks. This could be free, or require a listing fee. (I just placed my first vendor last night, so there may already be a system in place.)

I'll add one...

Bazaar listing needs to show "exactly what the item name was BEFORE the crafter naming"

There is a possible exploit of naming a deed object like a mineral extractor as a chemical extractor or some other deed object, and it will look and probably fool someone, cause the picture sure looks the same.

It would really suck to think you are buying one thing, and get something completely different, and you won't know until you try to place the structure.

-Loserwan Ka'newbie

I posted this a little while back, but it got burried a couple pages ago....

If it takes an artisan to create a harvester or generator, then he should have the necessary skills to repair the very item he created. We, as artisans, should have the ability to repair this stuff. We can make kits to repair armor, weapons, droids, and clothing. Why can't we repair our own equipment ?

Maintainance fees are fine for those individuals who don't want to go the Master Artisan route. Being a Master Artisan has no benefits whatsoever. IMHO if you are a Master Artisan, you should be able to keep your stuff repaired either through the use of a tool kit or through resource consumption of some sort

I like that interpretation BakDorr... I'm MArt, and Iusually get about 3 hours of playa night. Ispend the first two running delivery missions to pay for my structures. I spend the next 30 minutes paying fees and collecting power. Then the last 30 minutes trying to advance my skills. I have lots of resources, but don't have the time to grind. As a result, I can't make many products that would sell well (droids, weapons, armor, etc)

I could just sell my resources, but that kinda defeats the purpose of paying to get them in the first place.

It may be an easy code change to allow players to choose to pay maint fees, or have anEngineer(or maybeMArt) perform a seven day tuneup (costing resources for lube and parts, use of a tool that requires Eng IV or MArt skill, and maybe a HAM damage cost).

I agree that MArt should grant some advantage beyond the few specs that we get.

I'm just interested to know how much user XP you get when someone uses what you build.

What is the cap on it?
Does it even work?
If it does work, is it enough, not enough? (in your opinion)

Please fix the experimentation. I got a "great" success on D18 last night with my one point to spend and it made the special move cost go UP? Doesn't seem right.

All I can think of off top of my head.

A lot of good ideas here, but we need to keep this list Specific, please.

6. Artisan Experimentation broken on:

a. Casual Pants

b. Casual Shoes

c. Maiden's Dress

d. Simple Shirt

7. Even if you turn off confirmation prompt in option menu, you are prompted are you sure... when you quit experimenting while experimentation points remain.

8. When you stop crafting session in the middle of the session, you are prompted TWICE whether or not you want to quit and lose resources. (this is also with the prompts off in the option menu)

I'll do general items and food/drink tomorrow.

Bianca Minola

****MAJOR ISSUE**** NPC Vendors in merchant line

When we get Merchant I line we have the ability to place humanoid npc vendors.

At basic merchant I, the race of the merchant is random, so people will naturally delete the vendor and make a new one until they get one they like. It appears that the NPC vendors in the inventory that get deleted still take up their inventory space after deletetion. When this happens, The inventory will look like it has plenty of space, but the player can't tradewith anyone (container full message appears to BOTH players), mine anything (container is full), or do anything that involves the creation of a new item in the inventory (if the item gets made, it wont show up). The player is now officially screwed.

I Found a work around to this. If you get another player to kill you while your uninsured, when you retreive your corpse it will be fixed. This solves the issue but leads to an even more critical one.

I share a house with the person who constructed the house from the deed. Since it wont let me lay things down, i gave my original vendor to him to lay down. He layed it down, I initialized it and it worked perfectly. This is not the case for NPC Humanoid vendors. I gave him the humanoid vendors to lay down. He tried to lay it down and it said he didn't have permission. There is no destroy option for the vendor in his inventory, and it won't let him trade it back to me! So now I am screwed. I have no vendors and he is stuck with 2 humanoid vendors in his inventory. Going on 2 days, with no answer to my CSR ticket.

Fish Monger of Kauri

Hiya all, great thread.

As i see it crafter problems fall into three no two, no three categories...aiiiiiiiiiiiieeeeeeeee

1. Too much grind. Several people above mentioned running missions to pay for thier crafting. My experience exactly, if the economy is working this will not be the case. At this time the market is flooded with items people done want/need. Part of the problem is the items low level crafters can craft are not useful. this falls into two categories, the fact that in combat bone armor is worth its drawbacks to wear and secondly that the crafter tree doesnt balance with the weapon use trees. What I mean by that is that if a weapon is available on the third slot of a basic tree, that is at the point at which the crafter should be able to craft that item. So D-18 pistols and other simple weapons should be available to craft on the basic crafter tree (not weaponssmith, who would be only able to craft the advanced weapons, trust me he wont want to waste his time crafting d-18 pistols anyway). I think the armor system is totally out of whack by the way. Encumberance penalties need to be cut in half at least. Few are wearing this armor and its not from lack of affordibility. Because this armor is getting hard to sell, it greatly increases the grind of leveling (because you cant sell what you make, now you have to spend time missioning to make money to craft, to buy hides/bone/etc). Speaking of that lets talk about hides. There is no reason that one piece of bone armor requires the hides from 100 animals. My god at this rate the planet will be devoid of animal life in a week! (lol, you know what i mean). Lets bring this back into reality and reduce the grind for for artisans (this idea could be applied to a lot of components). the crafting process is grind enough, reduced component cost would greatly ease the burden on crafters.

2. Harvester are brokes. And no I dont mean all the little bugs that have plagued them so far, I mean by design. The maintenance process is totally out of whack (honestly!). I agree that harvesters should wear out, but right now its happening so rapidly that it's not economically viable to use a harvester. The maintenance fees need to be greatly reduced and I believe harvestors shouldnt begin to break down 'till they get below at least 60%. Lets talk about wind power, lets face it, it blows everywhere but inside. It should be available EVERYWHERE at at least 50%. This goes to the grind of being a crafter, having to run back and forth from wind generators to harvesters through the wilds for a non-combat artisan isboth dangerous and boring. (run sideways as much as forwards to avoid everything that can kill ya!) Heres an idea for ya. Each town has an urban growth boundary. Within this area structures could be built. The areas could even be zoned (ie certain areas only available for homes, another for shops, another for industrial) This would solve a few of the complaints listed above.

Namantha, Wanderhome

OK, did all the food, drinksand weapons tonight (except for Jaar, need to find some milk for that one). All those schematics seem fine. Experimentation working.

Still wanted to add to the list:

9. Items that are sub components and allow experimentation give no indication of their quality when Examined. It is impossible to tell the difference between (for example) a fiberplast panel created by a new artisanwith a generic crafting tool, and an experimented one by a master artisan with experimentation. If there is any difference between the two for the purposes of crafting, then we should be able to see it.

10. Similar to 9, but with finished products. Manyitems (deeds, crafting tools, survey tools, clothing) give no indication of quality when examined. If there is any difference between the final products, we should be able to see it.