Armorsmith Archive
Thread: Questions about Base Experiment %'s and Resource Quality
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KindredUK
Tue Apr 06, 2004 4:18 am
#1
Hey,
I've had to jump in at the deep end with Armorsmith, mainly because our guild 'smith was off for a while and I thought i'd help out where possible, so grinded the profession quite quickly and obviously lost some of the basic principals I would come across when mastering it at a normal pace...
So apologies in advance if I sound very noobish, because I am
Anyway I've not had chance to gather awesome resources as they've spawned, so i'm pretty much stuck with whats available to buy recently and current spawns. Looking at some of the stats they aren't great, but its all I have to work with.
So my question is basically what I should be expecting as the initial base experimentation percentage (i.e. the one after the combine). I'm purely making composite at the moment, since that seems to be in high demand.
For layers, I picked kinetic (again, seems most popular), and came out with about 18%/22%/22%. With this, I dumped most of my points into HAM costs and got it down to 6/6/6, threw 1 point in quality and got the base to 2%, and the rest in kinetic which I think came to about 7%. First off, is that the most appropriate way to use the points if i'm looking to hit 80% kinetic and roughly 59% base? Can base go even higher than that? (I ask because 59% seems to be a common number).
For segments, I seem to have really poor Polysteel Copper, and the others (Kiirium etc) seem to be heavily gated anyway. With my resources here it came out at 14%/18%/18% if I recall, which doesn't sound very good to me (but again I'm not sure if this is because of the gated resources). Does that look bad to anyone else? After experimenting I maxed the base to 24%, dropped a couple of points in HAM, and one or two in the resistance (affects just electricity resist yeah?). Now this is where I think 24% base isn't good enough, but up to this point i've maxed base at every point I could, apart from the layers because it seems to take a hell of a lot of points to make it go from 2% to 3%.
When I finally make the armor (taking gloves as an example), the base starts off 35%, and I can max it with 8 points, which brings it to 58% if I get an amazing. Is this simply a sign of bad resources, or could I have increased the base elsewhere in other components somehow? I also can't get my Kinetic to peak at 80% - it usually maxes at 79%. Again, is this something I could have tweaked in the layers instead of maybe throwing an extra point to lower HAM?
I guess in time I'll just know from experience how to use my points effectively, but being new and not having the best resources i'm wondering if its my method, or simply the resources that are holding me back (or both!).
Thanks.
I've had to jump in at the deep end with Armorsmith, mainly because our guild 'smith was off for a while and I thought i'd help out where possible, so grinded the profession quite quickly and obviously lost some of the basic principals I would come across when mastering it at a normal pace...
So apologies in advance if I sound very noobish, because I am
Anyway I've not had chance to gather awesome resources as they've spawned, so i'm pretty much stuck with whats available to buy recently and current spawns. Looking at some of the stats they aren't great, but its all I have to work with.
So my question is basically what I should be expecting as the initial base experimentation percentage (i.e. the one after the combine). I'm purely making composite at the moment, since that seems to be in high demand.
For layers, I picked kinetic (again, seems most popular), and came out with about 18%/22%/22%. With this, I dumped most of my points into HAM costs and got it down to 6/6/6, threw 1 point in quality and got the base to 2%, and the rest in kinetic which I think came to about 7%. First off, is that the most appropriate way to use the points if i'm looking to hit 80% kinetic and roughly 59% base? Can base go even higher than that? (I ask because 59% seems to be a common number).
For segments, I seem to have really poor Polysteel Copper, and the others (Kiirium etc) seem to be heavily gated anyway. With my resources here it came out at 14%/18%/18% if I recall, which doesn't sound very good to me (but again I'm not sure if this is because of the gated resources). Does that look bad to anyone else? After experimenting I maxed the base to 24%, dropped a couple of points in HAM, and one or two in the resistance (affects just electricity resist yeah?). Now this is where I think 24% base isn't good enough, but up to this point i've maxed base at every point I could, apart from the layers because it seems to take a hell of a lot of points to make it go from 2% to 3%.
When I finally make the armor (taking gloves as an example), the base starts off 35%, and I can max it with 8 points, which brings it to 58% if I get an amazing. Is this simply a sign of bad resources, or could I have increased the base elsewhere in other components somehow? I also can't get my Kinetic to peak at 80% - it usually maxes at 79%. Again, is this something I could have tweaked in the layers instead of maybe throwing an extra point to lower HAM?
I guess in time I'll just know from experience how to use my points effectively, but being new and not having the best resources i'm wondering if its my method, or simply the resources that are holding me back (or both!).
Thanks.
DirthNader
Tue Apr 06, 2004 4:40 am
#2
I dunno how to answer your questions exactly... I'll share my experiences with layers and comp. My kinetic layers start out at 2b, 4k, 16/16/16. I go for all amazing successes (six points) on quality to get the base to 4%, then the other five points into durability to get it down to 8/8/8 (without that extra point they'd be 10/10/10). The layer ends ups as 4b, 4k, 8/8/8.
The segment ends up around the low to mid 30's on encumbrance, with base around 30%. We got a new spawn of good colat (well, the best ever for Shadowfire) a few days ago, so I've only done one test set of gloves. They came out in the high 50's on encumbrance, 80% kinetic, and 65% base (I think they sould have been 66% base, I havea strong feeling I accidentily used some of my total crap beryllious to make them).
The armor you're currently making sounds a lot like my first sets - around 700/600/700 HAM, 80% kinetic, 59% base. The feedback I got from customers was that they'd gladly trade off some encumbrance for extra base. This was true, up to a point. I had some 750/650/750 HAM, 80% kinetic, 63% base on the vendor at the same time as some 800/700/800 HAM, 80% kinetic, 64% base. Despite pricing the lower HAM 63% base armor slightly higher, it sold out much quicker than the higher HAM 64% base.
I'd suggest playing around a bit, this time freeing up some points from durability (I've found anything at or below 8/8/8 on the layers makes for armor whose HAM Im not ashamed of) and throwing them into quality. You may even be able to move some points from effectiveness into quality. The trick is to figure out what combination of base and kinetic resists in your layers will let you hit the 80% kinetic number everyone is looking for - with my materials, and base + kinetic totalingeight or more on the layer will result in a final product with 80% kinetic,hence I chose to experiment to 4b,4k to maximize the base resists while keeping that magic 80% kinetic number.
Just mess around until you find something that works for you. It's not an exact science since there's a decimal place in the stats that we can't see but that is factored into the combines, but playing around with layers, segments, and gloves will start to give you a feel for what your materials are capable of.
KindredUK
Tue Apr 06, 2004 4:47 am
#3
Thanks for the input - I mainly went off the Armorsmith Guide stickied on the forum, which mentioned that the HAM on my layers should be as low as 6/6/6 if not less. Also you said you start out at 2% base on your layers, whereas mine start at 1% - obviously a resource issue here but nice to know you can actually reach 4% base.
I'm on the hunt for new materials tonight so i'll look into leaving the HAM a little higher and see if I can get my base a little higher instead!
Thanks
I'm on the hunt for new materials tonight so i'll look into leaving the HAM a little higher and see if I can get my base a little higher instead!
Thanks
DirthNader
Tue Apr 06, 2004 4:58 am
#4
Concerning the 2% base on the initial layer combine, we've had good metal spawns on Shadowfire - the stuff I use for layers has around 995 OQ and 980 SR. The polymer is over 900 on both OQ and SR, and the gemstone is pretty close - I think around 950 OQ and 750 SR.
Your mileage may vary on HAM. Some of my stuff has very good MA as well as OQ and SR. I've found that any final combine on the gloves that doesn't push a HAM stat into the 60's will result in a set whose HAM will be acknowlegded on my server as better than average. There are aquite a fewof folks on Shadowfire moving tons of armor with one or two extra base % points but much higher encumbrance, and very few moving anything with similar base resists and lower HAM.
Personally, I like to strike a balance between good resists and liveable HAM, and there seems to be a point of diminishing returns (at least with our server's materials) above 65% base where you get one or two extra % points but shoot the HAM through the roof. Again, the best thing to do, IMHO, is to spend a good amount of time making gloves with various layers and find a setup that you're happy with.
Avengre
Tue Apr 06, 2004 8:19 am
#5
Comp armor is bugged in how experimentation works. Max out your regular effectiveness, then drop a point into durability. Suddenly all your special resources jump by 5 - 10%. Great job there sony. Even more interesting, putting points into special resistances reduces the encumberence while it does nothing for the actual special protection or durability. Placing a point in durability, (unlike all other armors) increases the Durability and increases the effectiveness.
I've succumb to hairloss due to this damn'd armor.
DirthNader
Tue Apr 06, 2004 8:29 am
#6
I simply view crafting composite as a completely seperate profession. I thought I was ready for it when I mastered, not having ground more than a few boxes and having run a successful shop since 3/0/0/4 'smith. When I did master I felt like a noob all over again trying to understand triple layered comp.
Avengre wrote:
I've succumb to hairloss due to this damn'd armor.
Dova
Tue Apr 06, 2004 8:48 am
#7
2% Base segments are only going to get you final base resists in the low 60's even with very good resources. I think I can hit 62-63% base now using 2% base layers. I'm fortunate enough to be a 12 point smith so my Kinetic layers come out at 2/6 1/1/1. With 10 points and good resources I believe I was hitting 2/6 4/4/4. At combine my layers are 2/4 so I dump 2 points into Kinetic and the rest into lowering encumberance.
If I am focusing on getting the highest base possible I can experiment to 4+% on base and get armor that has base effectiveness at final combine of 68-70% depending upon the type of suit (heat is 70% and stun is 68% for instance).
KindredUK
Tue Apr 06, 2004 9:06 am
#8
Interesting, my resources must suck (I know thats kinda obvious starting out new, but I wondered how much of a role they played).
Think i'll try find some decent Amorph Gems and see if I can get at least get 2% base on the initial combine, as that will probably make pushing it to 3% a lot easier than it is now.
Thanks!
(I know thats kinda obvious starting out new, but I wondered how much of a role they played).Think i'll try find some decent Amorph Gems and see if I can get at least get 2% base on the initial combine, as that will probably make pushing it to 3% a lot easier than it is now.
Thanks!
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