CUEmu - Thread Posts

MaliaMing

Tue Mar 01, 2005 6:00 am

Just wanted to let everybody know so that we can breathe a collective sigh of relief at no longer losing resources for a stinky assembly.

..\ggggggggggggggg[malia]ggggggggggggggg/..(P)(h)(a)(t)(S)(t)(a)(t)(z)B a r . a n d . G r i l l«««« WP -5107 5603 ~ Freefall, Naboo »»»»
«««« WP 356 2549 ~ Jammy Town, Dant. »»»»
../ggggggggggggggg[ming]ggggggggggggggg\..

waffle2626

Tue Mar 01, 2005 6:02 am

#2

Huzzah!

(gnn[[[[[[[[[[~~]nnn~~WXggggggggggggggggggggg)

Kanep ~~ LRB's Resident Chef

Tyq ~~ Wasting Kanep's Money Since '04

BE Food Vendors: 5893 -4552 Dantooine!

CraftingGenius

Tue Mar 01, 2005 6:43 am

#3

amazingly, i havent gotten a critical in like a month???, but i am having lots of trouble getting amazing's

btw, if you dont know malia, you are in the top three for the chef comp,

Merchant - Sceno - Crafter

Swordsman - Yveic - Doc --- BH - Goowock - Pistoleer

"Pink Does DMG"| DMG-I |"Lots of DMG"

TyfoE

Tue Mar 01, 2005 8:58 am

#4

Haven't got a single critical (while crafting, not grinding) in the 7-8 months I've been a chef.

And it's not like we loose a massive amount of ressources if we get a critical.

:: Tasty Snack åIncorporated ::

Tyfo, 12-point Master Chef at Tyfo's

(3322 -5630, Danevang Mall, Corellia)

sciguyCO

Tue Mar 01, 2005 9:36 am

#5

Personally, I think I would've preferred to keep the crit failures, lose theresources (maybe Architect/Shipwright could be exempt due to high resource requirements), but components get recovered. Though this is a very nice change to reduce the stress of people assembling, say, an AV-21 or Krayt enhanced weapon (although there is still experimental risk).

Unless other crafting changes are coming down the pipe, this one change affects a lot of different pieces of the game. Without critical failures, a whole FS skill tree is now useless: Crafting Techniques only reduced chance of crit fails. Another is less useful: Force Assembly now only effects the initial combine success type, most Master crafters get a "great success" on assembly 99% of the time, and for a large majority of crafters (including chef) an "amazing success" during assembly doesn't give an improvement to the starting stats.

Pyollean Cake, +assembly tapes,and Manufacturing Center player cities are for the most part useless (see "great success 99% of the time").

Although with the lack of critical failures, maybe a "stinky assembly" (something other than a great success) is more likely, making the above things useful (with the exception of FS Crafting Techniques).

Kriles Ch'artoff , Chilastra server
Master Chef (retired)
Currently doing....stuff

TyfoE

Tue Mar 01, 2005 10:17 am

#6

People will still buy pyollian cake for that amazing succes (except for things that don't get better with amazing). And maybe they've upped the change of getting a bad assembly (ie. anyting under great).

:: Tasty Snack åIncorporated ::

Tyfo, 12-point Master Chef at Tyfo's

(3322 -5630, Danevang Mall, Corellia)

Gizmarke

Tue Mar 01, 2005 11:44 am

#7

sciguyCO wrote:

Unless other crafting changes are coming down the pipe, this one change affects a lot of different pieces of the game. Without critical failures, a whole FS skill tree is now useless: Crafting Techniques only reduced chance of crit fails. Another is less useful: Force Assembly now only effects the initial combine success type, most Master crafters get a "great success" on assembly 99% of the time, and for a large majority of crafters (including chef) an "amazing success" during assembly doesn't give an improvement to the starting stats.

/agree

Either give the FS Tree a new function, or put crit failures back in some form.
As it is assembly mods are almost useless.

So glad I just ran off that big run of Pyollian Cake...

But realistically I know they're not going to change the FS trees, so I doubt anything is going to happen. Yay for useless mods

-Castin Donn
...has mastered the Pilot profession

Brutus_Krylop

Tue Mar 01, 2005 2:07 pm

#8

ZionHalcyon wrote:

In my crafting, I have noticed I have had a greater chance of having an amazing experimentation, and even repeated amazing experimentations, on a segment or layer or component that has had an amazing assembly over one that has a great assembly. That doesn't mean getting an amazing assembly on a great experimentation is impossible - its just more likely, and more likely to happen multiple times on an amazing assembly than on a great assembly.

These are your impressions. Show me the empirical evidence. Show me the "numbers under the hood." Create a correlation chart. Until you do that, it's all speculation.

In my crafting, I haven't noticed a darn's worth of difference between having an amazing success on assemby and amazing experimentations. If anything, I've noticed I have a greater chance to get a moderate success on experimentation after an amazing success.

Furthermore, we don't even know what the correlation is between having a higher assembly mod and getting a good / great / amazing success. What wedo know is that there is a significantcorrelation between having a higher assembly mod and not having a critical failure.

Why do people use pyollian cake? Why do people spend credits on assembly tapes? Why did people grind out countless thousands of experience points to get the force sensitive techniques and assembly lines? It sure as heck isn't to maybe, possibly, sometimes get a higher chance of an amazing success on assembly so that they might maybe, possibly, sometimes get two amazing experimentations on the item. They did it to avert critical failures, which is now pointless.

Ehril Gospic -- Elder Jedi
Fahoo Gua'gads -- Elder Armorsmith
The Ironhead Armor Shop will return!

ZionHalcyon

Tue Mar 01, 2005 2:14 pm

#9

IF you are talking hard fact over impression, given that none of us have the actual data, then you have nothing more than impression to go on as well.

THEREFORE, quit being a hypocrite.

Z I O N U H A L C Y O N

J O R R EN U DA RK S T A R

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jorren's Spy Kill-o-meter:

and countless speederbikes and land speeders.

I love being a spy.

Baccarat

Tue Mar 01, 2005 2:19 pm

#10

ok ok everyone take a deep breath.

I'll see if i can take some data today since i'm curious too.

Furia, Kavala, Xana, Tarantella (Xana's alt, before NGE), all cancelled.(3 accts total)

Brutus_Krylop

Tue Mar 01, 2005 2:24 pm

#11

ZionHalcyon wrote:

IF you are talking hard fact over impression, given that none of us have the actual data, then you have nothing more than impression to go on as well.

THEREFORE, quit being a hypocrite.

No, I'm being an empiricist.

We have gobs of data that suggest a high correlation between a higher assembly mod and a lower critical failure rate. It is therefore logical and reasonable to posit as fact that higher assembly mods reduce your chances of getting a critical failure upon assembly.

You, however, are positing that higher assembly mods increase the chances of amazing successes on assembly, which then increase the chances of amazing successes on experimentation -- a double correlation. While it could be true, we lack the data to do the appropriate statistical tests.

There's no hypocrisy here other than your railing about people who've been doing this since beta "having NO CLUE," slinging perjoratives, and stating that no one who doesn't share your views should ever represent the community.

Ehril Gospic -- Elder Jedi
Fahoo Gua'gads -- Elder Armorsmith
The Ironhead Armor Shop will return!

ZionHalcyon

Tue Mar 01, 2005 3:03 pm

#12

Besides, how does one discover data? They make accurate and detailed observation of what happens, and look at ratios and percentages, etc.

Look, any armorsmith worth their salt knows HOW the system works, even if they do not know the numbers themselves to be able to predict an outcome. Your lack of knowledge of how the system works isn't really what bothers me - it's your insistance that you do know the system, when you obviously don't.

Based on careful observation, let me break down, in simple, non-numeric terms, how this system works:

Everyone, even the laziest crafter out there, knows how the system works. We have definite numbers that affect the quality of our products. Based on the Mallebility and Skill points in Assembly, you have an influence over how a crafted item comes out.

However, the number that is used to determine the quality of your crafted component is a random number generator, which spits out numbers based on the aforementioned skill and stat. By having a higher or lower value on the static and known numbers, you change the probability of each outcome, which is why at higher levels, great and amazing assemblies are more probable.

Based on this, the result leads to a value that affects another random number generatior, this time experimentation. However, experimentation is more complicated, as it also has the experimentation value affecting results. The experimenation stat is weighted, but the assembly results also affect the input of this, as you are given a higher probable of amazing experimenations than with a great success.

That is how the system works. The only real unknown is the random number generators and how they function.

So yes, you are being hypocritical. Sorry, but this is nothing more than a pissing contest for you. For me, it is about not letting someone who claims to represent my profession misrepresent it with unfounded whining.

Z I O N U H A L C Y O N

J O R R EN U DA RK S T A R

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jorren's Spy Kill-o-meter:

and countless speederbikes and land speeders.

I love being a spy.

Meplorium

Tue Mar 01, 2005 3:34 pm

#13

ZionHalcyon wrote:

depending on the numbers under the hood, the resources, and the crafted segments used, an amazing assembly can result in an increased chance of having an amazing success upon experimentation.

In my crafting, I have noticed I have had a greater chance of having an amazing experimentation, and even repeated amazing experimentations, on a segment or layer or component that has had an amazing assembly over one that has a great assembly. That doesn't mean getting an amazing assembly on a great experimentation is impossible - its just more likely, and more likely to happen multiple times on an amazing assembly than on a great assembly.

So yes, you don't know what you are talking about.

I've notice this as well on amazing assemblies leading to amazing experimentation. I also get slight variations with final stats depending on the assembly and experimentation results. Did a lot of crafting of wookiee armor this weekend making 90% suits. Some times I would get a 73% base, others 74% base. Resources being the same, the difference came from the assemblies/experimentation. I've also seen this on BE food additives. If you are right on the line between say 83 and 84, getting an amazing on assembly and then one in experimentation, sometimes, not all the times, lets you get the higher number. I have also noticed differences in complexity, the amount of time a factory or tool takes to make an item from this.

This differences are real, not imagined. You notice these more after you get force crafting mastery as they come up more.

- Meparch (Master Crafter, AS, DE), Mepaarch (MiniMep, Chef, SW), Meparca (Master Wookiee), Mepthorian (Master Naturalist, CH, BE)
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Thread: No more crit failures!