Armorsmith Archive

Thread: Armor Variation or, A better way to make sure there is more variety WITHOUT nerfing us.

Ihareo
Wed May 26, 2004 5:07 am
#1

Ok true believers, I have an idea to solve the 'everybody wearing composite armor' issue that seems to plague us. It's not exactly the best idea, but I'd like you're opinion on it.

First: When an Armorsmith craft's an armor, what she would be crafting is the stats, not the armor itself. This means that if you were creating a set of armor on line with the current composite, or Tantel or padded or what have you, it would basically be JUST the stats. Encumberance, Armor value, the whole nine yards would all be just as they are now.

Second: Include an option to change the AVATAR of the armour. So, theoretically, you could have what looks like Ubese armor, but has the stats for tantel or composite. This would preserve what game balance there is, yet provide for more variety. Lets face it, Nothing beats a suit of high resist Composit armor, but it's not exactly very cool looking, and in what is supposed to be a vast universe, you see way too much of it (note: the avatar could only be selected at armor creation). This will also cut down on the problem of vet players picking on new players based on what armour they see the poor noob wearing. A griefer will think twice before shooting someone if that Chitin they're wearing might very well be %80 resit...

Third: Assuming the Devs take my above suggestion to heart, they could include MANY more armour variations. If the devs can't think up any new armor designs, they could have a concept art contest, pick the best 10-20, and poof! you not only have a new armor system that makes for more vriety, you also have a whole community event that everyone can get involved in! All WITHOUT making the game EVEN HARDER THAN IT ALREADY IS!! (I dunno though... I kinda think itll be funny to be a master commando getting my butt whipped by a 50k ham Ewok with board with a nail in it... *grin*)

Fourth: For those hardcore StarWars Fanatics (of which I am one) In the StarWars reality, there exists more variety than could possibly be expressed by 5 (9 if you count bone, ris, mando and bountyhunter) Armors. For those of you who will surely bleat "but that isn't in the movies!!". SHUTUP! Twi'leks weren't in the movies till episode six! (yes I realize they were in episode 1, and 2, but I'm talking real world chronology). very movie that comes out has somthing new in it BECAUSE one man can't possibly think of everything that could possibly in a possible galaxy (can I fit one more possible in there? Possibly!!)! That's just the way it is. There are already several thing that don't jive with the movies, but make sence anyway, or at the very least are ntertaiing, or fall in line with the EU (I point to the Dathomir Sarlaac as a prime example. Heck, I point to DATHOMIR as a prime example!).

Anyway, I do hope I have helped.

"the only thing we have to fear is fear itself. Fear and Jumping off a 16 story building." - Jakie Chan




Ihareo Imtame--Adept of the Force
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Ihareo
Wed May 26, 2004 5:09 am
#2


Lol you should have read the testing forums during the skimpy period of time they called beta test.. however our hundreds of pages of very specific well thought out posts were deleted every day. I spent 7 hours one night refining the followingpost.. got nix'd the next morning.. fortunately a few people saved it and reposted it periodically... well, i saved it too.. so here it goes again:


POSTED ON APRIL 5th (note that the font in game has actually been changed so they at least fixed one thing i asked for)


I would like to preface this post with some of my real life professional credits so that you don't think that i'm approaching this from a smack talking 15 year old script kiddie perspective. I have been and in many cases still am a:


-Senior Graphic Designer

-Brand/Continuity Designer/Director

-UI Designer

-Information Architect

-Senior Game Tester/Game Team Director

-Game Designer/Developer/Programmer

-Game Content Designer/Director

-Content Manager/Director

-Technical Support Staff/Director

-Customer Service Staff/Director

-Technical Writer/Documentation Specialist/Senior Editor


So, that being said....


High Points:


... TBD


Low Points:


New Icons: We did not ask for our beautiful realistic game to be turned into the "My Little Pony - Disco Edition". This is one of several show stoppers for me. Not only did you put these new icons in a game where they have no business being (they are 100% genre-inappropriate not to mention unclear and distracting).. but you force us to rely on staring at them to function. Why are you punishing us? I would have fired you if you were on my staff.

SOLUTION: Here's a thought.. put the old icons.. no wait.. the whole old interface back in so we can test COMBAT. that's what we're supposed to be testing, right? Isnt' this the Combat Upgrade? If you insist that we need these new animated icons.. please take the old icons and give them a color treated state instead of these new noisy ones. This could be simply accomplished by adding a sharp contrasting color to the outer rim of the icon while it is in state and a fade of a lighter color to indicate the timer... but the timers on the icons are a bad idea anyway... see the section on the combat que for more.


New Font: This bulky crowded font is ruining the immersion of the game and it is very hard to read around. With this new font, I can't read spatial bubbles or other items in the game that are necessary to be legible in order to play effectively. The old font was perfectly chosen by someone who understood UI Design and usability.

SOLUTION: Put the old font back.. no wait.. put the whole old interface back so we can test COMBAT.


New HAM system/look: I've died now several times because there is no contrast on the ham bar when i'm losing health. The old ham bar is much better as even peripheral vision the stark white indicating damage gives some sort of cue that something is amiss. The eye catching white bit allows me to focus on what's happening in the middle of my screen and only when the sharp contrast of the white showing catches my eye do I need to stop looking at the breathtaking action/scenery and look at the interface. (this is what a good UI designer strives for, btw: an interface that is unnoticed except when needed). Also, If I were even slightly visually impaired , I can imagine that I would likely find the lack of contrast to be unplayable. If you are color blind (1 in 5 men in the world are btw) and you can not see the color red.. you can not see 2 colors of red... you only see whatever color it appears as to you and that is generally seen as a single color unless there is some serious contrast. The contrast is really really important. That's why Stop Signs are Red and White.. if they were Red and Red half the population wouldnt be able to read them.

SOLUTION: Put the old one back.. are you sensing a pattern here? I am.


Lack of Combat Que: Ok so i'm not sure who said we didnt want a combat que anymore but here's my experience with the new game. This actually sums up my entire combat experience with the CU so far.

--Find a creature that has the same number as me. (btw: I feel like the numbered level system is something of a dumbing-down of the game)
--Push the button.
--Watch the button carefully until it changes
--Push the button again
--Watch the button carefully until it changes
--Repeat for several minutes until you or the creature is dead (usually i'm dead because I had no visual indication on my ham bar that there was a problem)


If I wanted to play a game where all I did was watch a button and push it, I would go to Yahoo and play the weekly web games.. it would save me $75/mo. (yes I am a fiend with several accounts) and I would feel like I was getting what I paid for... a button to watch and push.


This "new" lack of que steals the ability to socialize while in combat. If I choose to say something to another player, I either have to type very very fast while watching the button or stand there while the mob chews on me so that I can stop pushing the button long enough to type. Of course after that i'm dead anyway so I have lots of time to talk. But even more importantly I was so busy with the necessity of watching the button, that I was unable to see anyone talking to me because I am so oblivious to everything going on So, its either fight or talk.. not both which is going to make coordinating combat with other players really miserable unless you're on a voice server. I thought one of the goals here was to encourage grouping and enhance social interaction between players, but it seems that even with the new forced grouping, there is a great deal less room for social interaction as noone really has time to talk while fighting. Additionally, by penalizing us for grouping with people of disparate "levels" you create a system where I can't just hunt with my friends. When my co-worker who plays only once a week gets on we will not be able to group up because we will be different levels. When my husband who plays less hours per evening than I do gets on, we will not be able to group. This seems like a DOWNGRADE ... You are destroying some of the wonderful (and in my experience unique) features of the game.


The lack of a combat que divides the players into two categories. Those who can write macros and those that can't. The ones that can (which includes myself) will find a way to write their own combat que so that they can enjoy socializing with other players and enjoying the beautiful 3D game that's hidden under the ugly button pushing game. Those that can't will be the silent unheard people that talk while standing in the safety of town. Or they will be the people that quit the game because it is too hard to understand because no one will help them because everyone is too busy watching the button. I might add that if you're going to force us to play a watch and push a button game, you should at least make the button look like it might belong in a Star Wars game. .


SOLUTION: Care to take a guess? Wait... its coming to me... Put back the old interface and UI so we can test COMBAT


Is that mob in combat with me? I don't know because there are no visual indicators that any creature is in combat with anything unless you can see it biting something or someone when you're up close and personal with it. Every mob I have attacked while playing has never shown me any reason to think it is in combat with me or anything else. After it incaps me.. it wanders off but is now a red dot on the radar. Is it still in combat with me? or is it now forever red to me until I kill it? This is far too confusing for a noob.


SOLUTION: I'm getting tired of repeating this.... but yet again the old system was better.. all the mobs in combat with me have their ham bar visible over their heads. This is easy, straight forward, simple, clean and really really obvious that I should pay attention to that mob.. especially if it's something I dont want to be in combat with. The old system also didnt clutter the game with unnecessary UI elements unless it was to illustrate an important point. That allowed the player to be totally immersed in a beautifully designed 3D environment and only disturbed when there was something that should be paid attention to.


New Con/Level System:
If i wanted to play a match the color and push the button game, they've already made one.. it's called Simon. It's for ages 4-8.


SOLUTION: The old level system was great. It added adventure to the game. There are some mobs that I had no business trying to tangle with but it was great fun to see if i could find a strategy to actually kill them. If I really wanted to see mobX dead, i'd get a group together and we'd all try to kill it with strategy, smarts, some logic and probably a little luck. It added some spice... some edge... it made the game really fun and challenging at every skill level and on every planet.


Delete TC5, start over and Implement just these simple solutions to the existing live code:


Things that needed to be changed in the old system to make almost everything more challenging and fun and balanced:


  1. Less uber armor. You've done that.. good work!
  2. Less uber Doc buffs. You've done that.. good work!
  3. Nerf DOT's. Limit the max uses on a DOT weapon to 50 or less.
  4. Redistribute the Skill Tree. You've done this. Great work! Stackers can no longer stack. Job done.
  5. More types of armor to choose from: You've done this.. The new armor changes and certs look like they will make a huge difference in how frequently armor is worn and how much it will affect gameplay. No need to adjust the HAM.. just the armor certs and stats as you have. Great job!
  6. More cool weapons: You've done this.. and the new weapons are really aweome. especially the different cert levels that you get them at.. it makes sense! Great job!

Ok now let's talk about items 1-3 and how they affect the rest of the game. Essentially you need to nerf me and DOT's and it'll be all good..


I will preface this by admitting that I do not do any PVP. I only do PVE nowadays because its peaceful and npcs dont talk too much smack..and the smack they do talk is appropriate to genre and I enjoy it and welcome it. I used to do PVP.. ive been retired for over a year now. I am, however a total lootjunky and while I don't sell very much of it.. I love to loot it and display it. It's the pursuit that I enjoy.



Here's my typical day playing galaxies..


Log in and get 125% mind buffs and 2800 Doc buffs. Strap on my 90% base ADK Stun Comp, my 860 ADK Hammer, my 60% base ADK PSG. Now i'm ready to party!


So where to today? couple solo runs killing everything but the SBD's on the vette? Maybe solo a few Elders and some protectors.. maybe 30-50 Krayts.. enie meinie mienie mo.


....So off I go to Dathomir where I lay waste to the sisters for a few hours and come home with some uber DOT pikes ( I delete anything less than a 200 strength DOT because its worthless otherwise), some great skill tapes and an inventory full of crystals. And in my 3 hour buff cycle, i've been to the village twice to drop off my xp for FS. I routinely get 200k XP in a half hour in the Labor Camp Cave. Wow does that make leveling fast!



Now let's look at how to logically nerf me.. the uber looter and XP repository without killing the rest of this game:


It really comes down to doc buffs and fewer uses on DOTs.


Make Doc buffs nominal, which you've done. Now.. without my 2800 doc buffs, I can't put on that 90% base armor because the encumberance is so high from all those stun layers that I wouldnt be able to special.



If I can't special, it'll take too long to kill that Elder in a buff cycle because all I can really do is tank and she's not gonna die from my good looks. If I can't kill the nightsisters solo, then I won't be bringing home any DOT pikes that aren't the ones that drop off the little puny nightsisters that I can actually kill without specialing in a reasonable amount of time. And last I checked.. those are really puny DOTS and no one would bother to use them in PVP anyway because of the speed of application to diminshing return. If it takes a whole group of people to kill a nightsister then DOT pikes will become less common. Once the DOTs of the previous weapons wear out there will be very few replacing them and they will be pretty weak because you'll need a good sized group to go to Dath and survive such a hunt.



Now that it takes a big group to go get all the cool loot..the cool loot once again becomes valuable and less common. This also makes XP slower to get for the individual because of the lack of buffs and armor.. thus making mastering a skill take longer. When we first started long before doc buffs and armor.. it took us a month of very steady play to master marksman and we had a blast doing it. Now with fat doc buffs, great weapons and insane armor, I can master marksman in a few hours tops.



Now about those DOT uses. So I have this pike that I looted. It's not the best on the server by any means, but it's pretty sweet. I has a 295 Mind Poison and has 7000 uses left on it. I can sweep a lot of nightsisters or players or whatever before that DOT is going to wear out. Meantime.. if I were a pvper people would see me coming and run for it and battles would never happen because no one would want to fight with that nasty pike around.



Now if that pike only had between 50-100 uses or mabye only 25.. then it would mess up a few people in a couple of battles and it would be burned out and hanging on my wall as a nice souviner. Limiting the max number of uses seems like a much easier fix as it is just a couple of lines in the loot table to modify. Now if there were only 50 uses on my uber pike that I looted, I wouldn't be using it for garden variety pvp.. i'd be saving it for those ancient krayts or elders or places where as a group we were going to be in battle for a long time and we really needed the extra help from the DOT.




Now after all this is implemented in the existing code we should see a much better Galaxies. After these changes have been implemented and debugged, I think you will find that the rest of that unplayable stuff that you put into TC5 was a waste of time and energy and way too much overkill. Let's get this important stuff on live and then look at whether other stuff needs to be changed as well.. baby steps guys, baby steps!

Message Edited by Ihareo on 04-30-2005 10:19 AM




Ihareo Imtame--Adept of the Force
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Ihareo
Wed May 26, 2004 7:01 am
#3

P.P.S What's 'trolling'?




Ihareo Imtame--Adept of the Force
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Reaktor_Ultima
Wed May 26, 2004 7:52 am
#4






Ihareo wrote:
P.S. Can anyone tell me ow to get one of those lil faces by my name on the left hand side? thanks!!






Go inte "my profile" then "icons"






Inec
TSA

Vendor: PSG vendor, HPI Mall @ -3859 3571 outside Theed, Naboo.
Currently Selling: Personal Shield Generators 25% Energy 45% Base.
Paladipuss
Wed May 26, 2004 9:28 am
#5

yeah we need variety big time.


I also say they let us make faction armor. More ST armor=more SW feel





Lyons.
Armor Inc
Corillia 996 -4652
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Adv comp buy the suit
Ihareo
Thu Jun 03, 2004 4:58 pm
#6

/bump




Ihareo Imtame--Adept of the Force
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Yaurrada
Thu Jun 03, 2004 5:26 pm
#7






Ihareo wrote:
P.P.S What's 'trolling'?





"Trolling" is a word that stupid e-junky forum users made. Pretend like you've never heard it.



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