Armorsmith Archive
Thread: What if armor..well, ACTED like armor?
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tacwraith
Thu Nov 18, 2004 6:40 pm
#1
Most if not all MMPOG's have armor doing damage reduction in one way or another. We all know this from EQ, from DAOC ...and its true in SWG.
But... what if armor acted like real armor? That is, no mitigation but rather it STOPPED damage or not?
For example, we can take your average base composite suit.. 50% resist and lets be nice and say it has 10% stun resists as well.
If it behaved like real armor then it'd stop completely (100% damage reduction) 50% of the shots coming in from all but stun and lightsaber attacks... and 10% of stun damage type attacks.
Attacks that are not stopped would do full damage. (minus the pvp damage reduction and food/spice reduction modifiers if applicable).
the PSG's oth, would do the current damage reduction system, since its energy trying to stop energy. so a player with a PSG with 40% resists (psg should not protect vs kinetic or acid since they are 'matter' based weapons not energy) and wearing the above comp suit would see something like:
xxx shoots you for 1000 damage!
your PSG absorbs 400 damage!
the shot penetrates your composite armor chest piece!
you take 600 damage.
or
xxx shoots you for 1000 damage!
your PSG absorbs 400 damage!
you Composite Armor chest piece protects you!
you take no damage
... and we can have the armor decay at a % rate of the damage it protects the wearer against.. say a 100k condition chest armor piece took the above 600 damage instead of the player, the armor would decay at 10% of that hit.. so it'd decay by 60 points.
and the armor wouldn't lose protection rating as it neared zero.. just to make things a heck of a lot easier on people.
I think this method would put SWG apart from other MMPOG's and provide a completely different style of play other than 'oh i get guaranteed xx% damage reduction from my armor suit so ill go solo tank those 20 creatures there that can barely hurt me this way'.
comments?
But... what if armor acted like real armor? That is, no mitigation but rather it STOPPED damage or not?
For example, we can take your average base composite suit.. 50% resist and lets be nice and say it has 10% stun resists as well.
If it behaved like real armor then it'd stop completely (100% damage reduction) 50% of the shots coming in from all but stun and lightsaber attacks... and 10% of stun damage type attacks.
Attacks that are not stopped would do full damage. (minus the pvp damage reduction and food/spice reduction modifiers if applicable).
the PSG's oth, would do the current damage reduction system, since its energy trying to stop energy. so a player with a PSG with 40% resists (psg should not protect vs kinetic or acid since they are 'matter' based weapons not energy) and wearing the above comp suit would see something like:
xxx shoots you for 1000 damage!
your PSG absorbs 400 damage!
the shot penetrates your composite armor chest piece!
you take 600 damage.
or
xxx shoots you for 1000 damage!
your PSG absorbs 400 damage!
you Composite Armor chest piece protects you!
you take no damage
... and we can have the armor decay at a % rate of the damage it protects the wearer against.. say a 100k condition chest armor piece took the above 600 damage instead of the player, the armor would decay at 10% of that hit.. so it'd decay by 60 points.
and the armor wouldn't lose protection rating as it neared zero.. just to make things a heck of a lot easier on people.
I think this method would put SWG apart from other MMPOG's and provide a completely different style of play other than 'oh i get guaranteed xx% damage reduction from my armor suit so ill go solo tank those 20 creatures there that can barely hurt me this way'.
comments?
TalynMox
Thu Nov 18, 2004 7:24 pm
#2
Interesting concept, I'll admit. But mathematically speaking it's actually no different to the current system. Here's an example to illustrate...
Assumptions for this example:
- The weapon used is AP1 so that straight resists are used
- The resist in question is 50%.
- 10 shots are fired, all doing 1000 damage per shot.
Current System:
- Assume here that all 10 shots hit.
- Each shot has its damage reduce by 50%, for a total of -> 10 * (1000 * 0.5) = 5000 damage.
Your system:
- Also assume that all 10 shots hit.
- Of these 10 shots, 50% will cause no damage: so we now have -> (10 * 0.5) * 1000 = 5000 damage.
I would also disagree with the concept of real armour stopping all damage from a given shot. Since IMHO it doesn't matter what you're wearing in terms of body armour, getting hit over the head with a dirty-great-big stick will cause sudden changes in direction to body parts that could easily be classified as damage. For example, witness bullet proof vests: these may stop the bullet, but you're still going to feel it (at best) or come away with broken ribs/bruises (more likely).
Another question raised with your idea is: How are differing AP values dealt with? Since I don't care what armour you're wearing, being hit by an anti-tank missile is going to sting.
Lastly, the issue of decay is an interesting one. Since it can be argued both ways:
- Armour should take damage based on how much it absorbs: since that will be done directly TO the armour itself
- Armour should take damage based on how much gets through: since this damage has clearly broken some part of the armour to get past it.
Assumptions for this example:
- The weapon used is AP1 so that straight resists are used
- The resist in question is 50%.
- 10 shots are fired, all doing 1000 damage per shot.
Current System:
- Assume here that all 10 shots hit.
- Each shot has its damage reduce by 50%, for a total of -> 10 * (1000 * 0.5) = 5000 damage.
Your system:
- Also assume that all 10 shots hit.
- Of these 10 shots, 50% will cause no damage: so we now have -> (10 * 0.5) * 1000 = 5000 damage.
I would also disagree with the concept of real armour stopping all damage from a given shot. Since IMHO it doesn't matter what you're wearing in terms of body armour, getting hit over the head with a dirty-great-big stick will cause sudden changes in direction to body parts that could easily be classified as damage. For example, witness bullet proof vests: these may stop the bullet, but you're still going to feel it (at best) or come away with broken ribs/bruises (more likely).
Another question raised with your idea is: How are differing AP values dealt with? Since I don't care what armour you're wearing, being hit by an anti-tank missile is going to sting.
Lastly, the issue of decay is an interesting one. Since it can be argued both ways:
- Armour should take damage based on how much it absorbs: since that will be done directly TO the armour itself
- Armour should take damage based on how much gets through: since this damage has clearly broken some part of the armour to get past it.
darthbock
Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:40 pm
#3
Also, real armor mitigates damage to some degree. Just because the armor is pierced, does not mean the projectile (or whatever) did not have its momentum reduced... The kinetic energy needed to cleave/rip/tear through the armor is dissapated.
WolfGuy
Fri Nov 19, 2004 9:24 am
#4
I like you idea in principle but the way I see it is this:
Someone is shooting at you for 100 points of damage. Lets say your armour will stop 50% of the damage so 50 damage is what you will take, or you will get hit 50% of the time. Now lets say you are down to 100 hit points. Under one system you will survive 2 shots, taking 50% damage each shot. The other system you have a 50% chance of surviving the first shot and a 50% chance of surviving the second shot.
So, under the first (and current system) you will almost definately survive 2 shots. Under your proposed system you could be killed in 1 shot, or you could survive for many shots.
A merger of the two would mean there is a % chance of the armour stopping a % of the damage. The better the armour, the more often it will stop a higher % of the damage. Armour piercing will increase the amount of damage that penetrates the armour as well as damage the piece that is hit. This could be balanced out so that armour works well (but not too well).
I am so stoked for the up coming changes including the armour nerf.
Someone is shooting at you for 100 points of damage. Lets say your armour will stop 50% of the damage so 50 damage is what you will take, or you will get hit 50% of the time. Now lets say you are down to 100 hit points. Under one system you will survive 2 shots, taking 50% damage each shot. The other system you have a 50% chance of surviving the first shot and a 50% chance of surviving the second shot.
So, under the first (and current system) you will almost definately survive 2 shots. Under your proposed system you could be killed in 1 shot, or you could survive for many shots.
A merger of the two would mean there is a % chance of the armour stopping a % of the damage. The better the armour, the more often it will stop a higher % of the damage. Armour piercing will increase the amount of damage that penetrates the armour as well as damage the piece that is hit. This could be balanced out so that armour works well (but not too well).
I am so stoked for the up coming changes including the armour nerf.
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