Architect Archive

Just some hard figures here , this is based on average pricing on my live server

Average high side cost of a heavy harvesters is 100k

Average low side price resources are sold at 2 cpu

Running that heavy harvester on a 60% vein (high for ore low for others) you generate 6048 resources per day

If you sell those resources at 2 cpu you make 12,096 credits per day in sales

Just selling resources your heavy harvester pays for it's self in less than 9 days. if you craft those resources into consumable goods and sell those goods at greater than 2cpu it takes even less time.

I'm not factoring in redeeds, maintence or fuel costs because those costs will be the same no matter if you are using a harvester you bought last week or one you bought last year.

Everyday past day nine that you use your heavy harvester it is working for you at pure profit, as it stands now it will continue to do so for the lifetime of the game barring human error to take care of maintence.

Now for all the folks thinking that architects are 'greedy' for wanting a continuing market who's more greedy? The architect that makes a single 100k sale for an item, or the one that expects to make a 4,315,040profit a year off that item?

I never thought about it that way... Hrmmm, and here I thought I was just being greedy! Thanks for shedding some light!

I hear what you're saying tho, and it actually makes sense as well... Especially for people that actively SELL the resources.

When talking about decay yes you can because no matter what harvester you use you will pay the same expenses. The expenses are negligible when it comes to decay.

Harvester Y costs the same in maintence as Harvester Z and consumes the same amount of power.

You will notice that on the price of the harvester I didn't make mention of the architects expenses in making the item. I'm not talking pure profit I'm talking cold hard facts.

Yeeeess, but to 'pay for itself' it has to be profit that's counted. If I have to pay 2k in maintenance every day, then that's subtracting from the amount of money that's 'paying off' the price of the harvester. That's not related to how much the architect paid to make the harvester.But if we do use your logic,within two weeks of building a heavy harvester, everything an acrhitect makes andsellsis 'free' because the harvester has 'paid for itself'.

But that's not the biggest issue. I've mentioned thisin other ostsbut there is a very real barrier to entry for aspiring crafters in almost every class except acrhitect. As an aspiring weaponsmith I most certainly don't make a profit off of my medium harvesters. I'm nowhere near being able to afford a heavy, and the reason is that much of my work gets thrown away. Practice grinding. The devs didn't put that little practice button in there because they expected novice works would sell.

This is not to say that I don't sell any weapons, but like many crafters I supplement my income to pay for maintenance fees by running missions. In essence, increasing the cost of harvesters will have the greatest impact on new players, making the game less enjoyable for them. I don't think it's greedy towant another solution besides applying a tax to all the players in the game just to make architects a sustainable class.

But if you are really concerned about making a living, all you have to do is become a resource merchant yourself. Put down a couple harvesters and you too can make 10 * '4,315,040profit a year' to supplement your income as an architect.

You do need to consider the cost to maintain it daily, because those are capital expenses as well. Your math is flawed, but your direction is right. It'd just take a bit longer than the nine days according to your forecasts.

But yeah, these items, once paid for - live forever.

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Jianti wrote:

But that's not the biggest issue. I've mentioned thisin other ostsbut there is a very real barrier to entry for aspiring crafters in almost every class except acrhitect. As an aspiring weaponsmith I most certainly don't make a profit off of my medium harvesters. I'm nowhere near being able to afford a heavy, and the reason is that much of my work gets thrown away. Practice grinding. The devs didn't put that little practice button in there because they expected novice works would sell.

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The encourage the devs to add decay and experimentation against decay to architect lines so that there is the similar barrier for all classes. That's what I want I want equality. Equaltiy to experiment to create a superior product and equality to continue to create those superior products for a long time into the future. If you are concerned about start up costs run missions like the rest of us did, make your own fleet of personal harvesters (you have eng 4) and don't buy harvesters until you can afford to maintain them. Don't push your professions start up costs off on the architects.

Now if you insist on talking expenses here we go.

1 Fusion Generator operating on a 60% vein of radioactives will generate 11272 units of radioactives I'll even give you a boon and say its the rare radioactive that is less than 500 PE and so therefore is only considered to be a single unit (keep in mind that if your radioactive is above 500 PE you get 2 units value per every actual unit but I'm trying to keep the math simple for yas). Ok so of that 11272 power you will use1800 of it in your harvester. Leaving you with an remaining 9472 radioactives that you can sell or that you can use in other mythical harvesters (my examples are based on a single harvester). Now on Shadowfire the average sell price of power below 500 PE is 1 credit per unit so with the expense of power you now generated yourself9472 extra credits per day.

Running total of resource sales is now21568

Ok now your expenses in maintence of your fusion and you heavy totals 3830 per day subtract that from your resource sales so your profit ratio is 17738 per day by adding in your expenses you've now reduced the amount of time that it takes you to pay for that 100k harvester toless than 6 meaning that if you are smart enough to track your planets resources there will not be a possible shift during that period and no redeed fee is required.

Your profits on that 100k harvester is now 4,342,464 credits per year by forcing the issue of expenses you just became more greedy (feels good don't it). We'll round it down to 4 mill just so you all won't get picky about bazaar costs and human error on not realizing resource shifts and having to redeed during your inital 6 day payoff period.

I missed this before so I appoligize but I need to respond to it

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Jianti wrote:

But if you are really concerned about making a living, all you have to do is become a resource merchant yourself. Put down a couple harvesters and you too can make 10 * '4,315,040profit a year' to supplement your income as an architect.

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I'm not concerned about income I'm concerned about a continous market so that I can continue to create the items that I took the time to earn the skills to make. If decay is never entered I'll continue to make and sell the products that I can running missions and selling resourcesto afford the upkeep of my harvesters. Many architects have already moved into the resource selling market increasing the glut of resources available and decreasing the other artisian proffessions costs. Once the resource glut is so high that resources are selling for less than 1 cpuI'll become a weaponsmith and sell my products for 20+ cpu a piece instead of my current 4-5 Eventually the economy will become so skewed that the fighters that sell resources for pocket change will cry nerf and something will be done

The point of this thread is that the number one reason that people think architects want decay is because we are greedy. If those folks wish to believe that, I've turned the figures around and pointed out that by not wanting decay they are proving their own greed to be much higher than that of the architects.

I'd be happy for architects if they could experiment like other classes. I don't see how adding decay to structures will implement that.

And I do run missions. That is in fact my point. I have to, becauseI do not make a profit off ofany of my harvesters, much less 350k a month (i.e. ~4 million a year). I doubt I ever will, because if there were an additional 35k-40k units of power in the marketplace the price would drop, slowly approaching cost. It's just supply and demand.

I admit I'm at a loss to understand how I could be pushing my startup costs off onto Architects though. After all, by your figures you too should be making millions of credits a year, if notper month since you could easily have 10 heavy harveters. You would not be giving me any money, or resources. Instead you want me, and other players who do not actually make a real profit off of our harvesters to do something we don'tenjoy - grinding missions over and over for money - so that we can... give it to you when our harvesters die and need replacing?

Sure, we could just never buy anything until we're in the pure profit zone, and take twice to three times as long to gather the required resources to master our profession.But I play this game for enjoyment sake, not masochism. You're telling me that because theoretically everyone -could- just sell resources and make 350k a month (which I disagree with because of the laws of supply and demand, and the fact that the amount of money in any galaxy is not infinite) I am greedy because I don't want to continually pay money to architects for my resources in addition to the maintenance fees which I already pay.

Well, I disagree. If I was that greedy, I would do as you suggested and become a resource merchant. Obviously you feel the same way, or you too could become a resource merchant and never need to worry about money. But in fact, the non greedy people are hurt even more by decay because they are out spending their time having fun rather than making money every second. The disagreement to the proposal isn't about greed, it's about not wanting to have a game turn into a job.

You can call people who disagree with the idea greedy all you want, but it doesn't make it true.

How about all the architects stop complaining and either take up another profession, reducing the glut of archs and increasing costs, or just shut up and be happy you can sell anything. After all you could be a Chef, BE, DE.

I've never seen so many people in a very useful and profitable class complain. Get over it, you're not weaponsmiths. You greedy bastards.