Architect Archive

Hi,

well, the topic may be a bit too hard :-) But it is ment to get straight to the point. What I like at SWG is the way crafting is implemented, and that you can, unlike most other games, craft without any or much combat. So far the system wroks pretty good, cause of the interests involved.

We now have some professions who has conflicts in interests and we have a real problem with the economy. Why is that?

Well, the same people who selling their harvested stuff at 5cr/unit at the bazar expects from an architect to make a house for less than 5cr/units, but pays 10 or more credits/unit fora weapon.

Why?

For sure it is the overal price, it is much easier to earn the money for a weapon than for a house, and it doesnt hurt that much to spend 5k each week for a weapon. Especially if you can make those 5k by selling ressources .-)

What is the unbalanced part here? I think it is the ability to simply place a harvester by everone.

Possible Solution?

Well, what I like the most is to limit the Lots. Give away new Lots with each Mastered crafting-class and increase the number of Lots used by medium and big harvesters to 2 and 3 per. That way a crafter can still use 10 Heavy harvesters, a "hybrid" char can still harvest but the number of harvesters, and therefore the worth of buildings eating a lot of ressources, will go up. I also like the idea of the need for the novice artisan skill to even place a harvester.

Some people say it just needs more ressources to get the price for ressources down, but that is not the problem. The worth of an installation needs to go up in the peoples head, that can be done by limiting fighting-classes to harvest as effective than other classes, makeing ressources something you get almost for free.

I cant understand why some peoples run 2 Fusion-Ion Generators and 8 heavy harvesters and be a Bounty Hunter. Why did I spend Skillpoints in Surveying when everbody is just able to place a Harvester beside mine?

You can call me a whiner, but in fact I dont have a real problem in the game cause I dont focus architect, but because I skilled up to Installations IV to be independent I know the problems of architects and crafters in general. I think there should be a difference between crafters and non-crafters, and that crafters should be better able to collect ressources than those who dont focus on crafting.

Now you can hit me, call me names :-) Please post your opinion about this, but please think about balancing, not your personal interest.

Read ya,

Moepple

I somewhat like your idea, but I'm not sure I like your suggested implemenation. I wouldn't like to see the lot requirements go up for medium and heavy harvesters, as that would nearly make them obsolete. For example, if I was master architect, I could use a medium harvester by your plan, which would take 2 lots, or I could use two personal harvesters, which would also take two lots. The two personal harvesters are easier to place precisely where you want them, since they have a 1x1 footprint instead of 2x3 or whatever a medium harvester is. 2 personals produce exactly as much as a medium, and cost the exact same to maintain, which would destroy any need for them to be used.

Instead, I'd like to see the number of lots you have limited by your profession, up to the maximum number of 10, just like we have now, with the same lot requirements on all structures. Here's my plan (which someone else has probably posted before, I doubt it's original) :

All professions are allowed to build one home. This home can be any size, and also includes PA Halls. If you are the owner of a PA Hall, you can't have a home of your own under this system. Novice Artisans are allowed to own onlypersonal harvesters (base it on a skill, Harvester Use for example, and give +1 at novice), and start out with only 2 lots. Eachlevel of Survey gives an additional 2 lots, for a total of 10 at Surveyor.Your personal house does not count against your number of lots, so that crafters aren't penalized for owning a PA hall, which could drum up more business for architects (As it is, a lot of crafters don't own a large home because it leaves them with just 4 lots for harvesters, hardly enough to get by). Once you master the Survey tree, you are allowed to use medium harvesters (Harvester Use +1). Each elite artisan class would also add Harvester Use +1, allowing you to use heavy harvesters then if you mastered the survey tree, or medium harvesters if you only completed the one artisan tree to get to your elite class. This would encourage people to keep the surveying tree, because as it stands now once you reach an elite crafting class you can simply reclaim the skill points from surveying, and tolerate a lower range on your survey tools. This would also let classes like Medic who also depend on resources to pick up novice artisan to gather resources they might need reasonably simply. Additional houses could be built on your lots instead of harvesters, at 2 lots for a small, 4 for a medium, and 6 for a large, for crafters that like to have multiple places to sell.

I realize that's a major change to the game, and would be fairly hard to implement, especially with all the harvesters currently out there...

Any Master Bounty Hunter with Survey is an idiot, and without survey they are going to have a hard time finding a good spot to place a miner. I have 8 open lots i'm willing to rent out if you are from Flurry thou.

Hi,

sorry, I was interrupted while writing a lot times. Forgot to mention that the Idea was to give away new Lots with several Skills. An extreme example would be 10 Lots with each Master in a non-combat skill. That way a pure crafter with 2 or 3 masters would have 20 to 30 Lots, which would be 10 big harvesters. Of course, another way would be to limit the effectivity of a harvester by the level of surveying, but thats crap.

I saw Architects writing in other forums about the problem that an architect is not even able to show his wares to a customer, cause he cant build all the houses he sells. If you Handle it that way, you may be able to show some houses or have more structures available for a merchant etc.

And yes, I really doubt that a real BH in the SWG Universe would run harvesters. It is not my intention to completely remove that ability, but hey, you need even a certification to use the toilette, why not for the gear of other classes too? As an alternative, just make personal harvesters available to everybody, and make the others dependant on the survey skill. So you can only use Heavy stuff with survey 4.

Read ya.

Hi,

if you limit the number of houses to 1, you destroy the merchant class, which bases on having sale-points at several planets, which require a structure to host the vendor in.

Read ya.

Fuzby: They could have novice artisan, and just look for fields of harvesters, then survey to see what's there, or even ask an artisan friend where to build and just build their harvesters based off of that.

Moepple: That's why I said additional houses could be had at the expense of lots, or now that you mention it, better yet, a merchant skill that allows you to own multiple buildings. Increasing the number of lots beyond 10 might work, but I'm relatively certain increasing the lot requirements of harvesters would just make people use more personals in that situation.

Yep,

It really ticks me off. I have found that almost often the jerks that spew the "LOL, you are way overpriced" junk, when you quote them a 3 cpu structure, and the same a$$ clowns that are selling ore on the bazaar for 10 cpu.

I quit getting mad about it.. I just chalk them up as dishonest manipulative spoiled brats.

Anyone that can sell a resources for 10 cpu, then complain when you use that same resources to build a structure and charge less than the selling price of the resources, are not the kind of people that need in your shop.

Do what I do. When I get one of those comments, or I find that Mr. Bounty Hunter is a scalping resource gatherer, I just add them to the ban list.

I don't need their money(in acuality I wouldnt get it anyhow because of their scalping con man tactics) and definately do not need their attitude.

Save yourself the frustration.

I think it would be better to seperate lots into house lots and harvestor lots. Crafting proffesions would get the harvestor lots, and normal people would get their house lots. Merchant would also get a bonus to their house lots so they can sell their wares better.

I like the idea of requiring certain professions to place the harvestor. Don't change anything about the lots, but require a certification to place harvestors. Just like only politicians can place city halls and entertainers can place cantinas, only artisans should be able to place harvestors. This would solve a lot of problems in my opinion. You could even require a certification at a higher skill level in surveying to be able to place medium and then heavy harvestors. That would if not eliminate the problem, at least mitigate it. It would definitely remove all the miners out there with no artisan skills whatsoever.

10 lots for house automatic on start of game.. and 10 lots for harvisters start with like 4 and get others as u got up in artisan and Other Elite prof.

i like that idea. cause then i can have my large house and my harvisters to do my buisness

There are some good ideas here.

Separating Housing lots from Harvesting lots would seriously improve peoples ability to have both shops, and harvest resources.

Adding a +2 Lot mod as you gain specific Elite crafting skills would certainly make gaining master an advantage over people who take only one line in certain skills.

Certification for Medium, then Heavy harvesters is a brilliant idea. Mining is not something any idiot can do, just like wielding a gun properly is not for everyone. It would certainly help crafters keep resources costs down.

Right now the reason Bounty Hunter's and Commandos are running Heavy Harvesters, are twofold. One, they are just renting their lots to a crafter friend to use, or Two, they simply find out from a surveyor where a good spot for XXXX is and go plunk down a Heavy.

If I had 10 lots for Housing, and 10 lots for Harvester's at Survey IV, then say +5 lots at Novice (Armorsmith, Weaponsmith, Architect, Droid Engineer) and then +5 again at Master. With certification for Heavy Extractors requirering a Novice Elite crafting Prof.....

It'll never happen but it would make crafters really specialized and important

I have a dumb question - how will reducing the number of people out there running harvesters improve my resource costs? I mine as much stuff as I can, but I count on a network of "miners" to fill the gaps that I miss. I don't care if they are Master Dancers looking to make some extra money or people building up their bankroll before they plunge into a crafting profession - they provide material to me at a cost that I can afford. If we told them "you can't run a harvester anymore", I don't see how that improves my life.

I enjoy being good at being a resource hound but I also enjoy the crafting. It's not clear to me that I have to be a crafter in order to run a harvester. I don't know what being a weaponsmith or a tailor has to do with running harvesters.

I think everyone has some good points but I think limiting the use of harvestors to one class will wipe out the market for them. If only one class can use it why would they buy it if they can make it.

One idea would be to put some timelife on the items. This will cause a constant demand for new buildings. But then again from what I am reading here the demand is already higher then the supply of materials.